Disclaimer: I'm Using Other Peoples' Photos!!! Ack!!!

Business By BrandisBaked Updated 12 Jul 2007 , 2:45am by Jenn123

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BrandisBaked Posted 29 Jun 2007 , 5:31pm
post #1 of 43

Ok, after the umpteenth call of "can you do an xxx cake?" and me saying "yes, I can" and then they ask me for a price and I have to pry a billion details out of them before I can give them a price. Yesterday was a call about a castle cake (while I was driving my daughter to cheer practice)... she wanted it to serve about 30. Did she want fondant or just buttercream? Turrets/towers, or not? One tier, or two? Was she talking about just a castle cake, or the princess castle kit (I don't do kits...)? I don't like wasting my time like that.

So anyway - what I've decided to do is put a section up on my website of inspirational photos (cakes I haven't done myself - but are there to give customers an idea of what I can do and help lead them toward what they want), this way - they can say how much would you charge for cake #54? I am not going to link it anywhere on my site, and it will only be accessible by me giving customers the direct URL. I don't see that it's any different from them viewing a book of the same nature. However, I operate from home, and I'm not going to invite everyone that calls me to come over and look through my book.

I wanted to put this out there because I have seen what happens people get "caught" with photos that aren't theirs. I am in NO WAY going to indicate that these particular cakes were created by me (I've never actually made a castle cake - other than the kit ones when I worked for another bakery), but I need photo examples. Over the past few years, I have amassed a file of thousands of cake photos and I do not know who created any of them. If somehow one of you happens upon this private gallery, and finds a photo you recognize - please don't jump down my throat. If the cake is yours and you don't want it displayed, feel free to ask me and I will take it down. However, I will put a very specific disclaimer on that page, and would never take credit for work that is not mine. It is only there to help make things easier on me, and my customers. If someone on here needed to do the same, I would allow use of my photos - with no questions asked. I would gladly help anyone who needed it.

Sorry this is so long... just wanted to let the community know what I was doing before I did it. (BTW, at least half of those photos were saved before I ever knew about CC... and I really have no idea where I got them from)

42 replies
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JoAnnB Posted 29 Jun 2007 , 5:42pm
post #2 of 43

This is strictly my opinion. I would re-find photos and obtain permission. At some future date, if someone 'finds' your site, there could be a recurrence of the explosion.

It would take a bit more time, but you could credit each designer, and/or ask specific permission.

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darandon Posted 29 Jun 2007 , 5:51pm
post #3 of 43

I would at least put a disclaimer with the pictures that they are not your and they are for inspiration. I'd also contact all the ones that you know and let them know.

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BrandisBaked Posted 29 Jun 2007 , 6:13pm
post #4 of 43

As I said, there will be a disclaimer.... and the pictures would only be there to say "This is what an xxx cake looks like..."

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Audraj Posted 29 Jun 2007 , 6:18pm
post #5 of 43

Another idea might be to provide links to the original cake creator's site to look at a particular photo.

Otherwise, I think you are going about this the right way.

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foxymomma521 Posted 29 Jun 2007 , 6:20pm
post #6 of 43

Could you put a link on your website to this website?? Then maybe people can look for cakes themselves and there would be no confusion as to who made them... I don't even know if that is possible, it's just an idea...

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lardbutt Posted 29 Jun 2007 , 6:27pm
post #7 of 43

My only question is, "Are you legal"? icon_lol.gif

You know I'm kidding if you've read the thread on that one. If you are letting your customers know they are not your cakes, that seems fine. You or your customers can go online anytime and google cakes and get who knows how many photos and ideas. I guess that's the chance you take posting photos. It seems like you are going out of your way not to take credit for something you did not do. thumbs_up.gif

There will be many opinions on this subject, and that's what mine is JUST MY OPINION!

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freddyfl Posted 29 Jun 2007 , 6:34pm
post #8 of 43

I think people over think this stuff. You already said there would be a disclaimer and that it isn't your work. When you ( and I mean that as any generic you, not any one person specifically) find an image on the internet to do a fbct does anyone put a disclaimer on the finished cake saying that they, themselves did not draw the picture but found it on such an such a site? I doubt it. I say it sounds good Brandi. I don't see that as any different than when you go to a hairstylist and look through their books on different hair cuts. It is to give the client an idea, it doesn't mean that THAT particular stylist has done all of those cuts and styles. It is cake. Why does everything need to be such an "issue" these days. Just my 2cents.

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amysue99 Posted 29 Jun 2007 , 6:34pm
post #9 of 43

I'm glad you're starting this thread. I've been wondering about the same thing. I often send e-cards of photos to give examples to clients.

I would hesitate to just do a CC link, however. For one, the mass of photos can be overwhelming for some. Also, I had a client looking on here (after viewing an e-photo) who then told others about this amazing website and that I could do "anything" on there!! So far from the truth that i had to laugh when I heard it.

If it's possible to do a page of "inspiration" photos I think it's a great idea. That way people are seeing things you can accomplish without being overwhelmed by choices.

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GenGen Posted 29 Jun 2007 , 6:34pm
post #10 of 43

you can also contact ohmygoodies who just recently did this also; she contacted every member whose pics she wanted to use on her page with name link and credit given to each cake artist etc i'm sure she'd be happy to tell you what she did and maybe offer some tips to help you further icon_smile.gif

this is the link for her web site thats also in her sig here.

http://www.freewebs.com/ohmygoodiesco/

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marecip Posted 29 Jun 2007 , 6:41pm
post #11 of 43

I'm anxious to see the reactions to this. I too have been wanting to do something similar. It is frustrating knowing you could make a particular cake design but that you haven't yet and therefore cannot show your own. Time & money don't allow for all the sample/dummy cakes of my own that I would love to show. As my own portfolio grows I would have less of a need but for now it would be so helpful in pricing and suggesting styles.

If people can find pics of cakes they like and print them to bring to you what is so wrong with posting them yourself...as long as their is a noticeable DISCLAIMER that they are not your work and that you will recreate something similar.
I too have numerous photos that I don't know where I get them, If I know I would give credit.

I would have no problem with someone using my pics for show and when you finally make one of your own then you use your own photo. If you feel so strong about one of your cakes here on CC then note that this is pic not to be posted or shared elsewhere.

The only photos I wouldn't use are of someone close enough to me to be competition. I wouldn't feel right about that. But if your 3 states away I'm not taking your business and in the end they would be getting a cake by me. If you go for a haircut or dress to be made you take a sample of someone else's work.

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OhMyGoodies Posted 29 Jun 2007 , 6:43pm
post #12 of 43

I just did this 2 days ago lol. I posted here on CC asking for people's permission and if they posted they didn't have a problem with it or liked the idea I would PM them after looking thru their gallery of photos and picking one that I'd like to use on my website. My intention is to build up photos of cakes I know I'm capable of doing but have not had a chance to do any yet to have my own photo of it.

I got alot of support and alot of people gave permissions. I saved each PM that stated they gave permission, I saved the photo to my hard drive with a note pad document with the photo file name, CC username and the name they wish to have used on the website for credit given. I then uploaded the photos on my LOCKED PRIVATE photobucket site into a folder named strictly IDEAS, which does contain other photos found else where on the net but since I don't know who made them anymore, to go back and ask permission I didn't post them, however I do invite my clients to view a slideshow of idea photos at the time they are looking thru my portfolio.

I think it's good to go thru the photos you have saved already, search CC for the type of cake, to see if you can find the original creator and PM them and ask for direct permission as not many people may see this thread or read it.

We're all probably guilty of using other's people work in one way or another, meaning I'll copy a photo to my hard drive long enough to show a friend a picture of it, since you have to be a member of CC to view photos, and after they say they don't like that one for their particular event I delete the file. If I happen to keep the file, I will rename the photo with the CC username of whom it belongs to or I'll make a text file like I did with these most recent photos.

All my idea photos are in seperate folders on my hard drive and it is plainly labeled Ideas. Which is seperate from "My finished products" that way if a friend is viewing my photos and they open the other folder without me explaining in advance they will know I didn't do the cakes they are viewing.

I know going thru the photos and going thru the galleries would take longer then just posting but I think it's the right thing to do, to get their permission before using their photo. I didn't have a single person tell me No over the past two days while asking for permission, I haven't heard back from a few but no one has said no yet. Which is a good sign of how nice the people of CC are icon_smile.gif

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marecip Posted 29 Jun 2007 , 6:46pm
post #13 of 43

I think it would be a problem to give a link to CC because I want to have control over the degree of work I can offer. I would only post samples of cakes I know I can do (or come close to!) And there are way too many on here that are out of my league!!!!

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BrandisBaked Posted 29 Jun 2007 , 6:54pm
post #14 of 43

I wouldn't just give them a link here for 2 reasons:

1. The search feature doesn't work as well as I'd like. And how would they know what to search for?

2. You have to be a member to view photos. The more hoops you make a customer jump through, the more likely they are to call someone else.

I didn't realize anyone had posted something similar recently. Maybe it would be a good idea to just do a general website that has different types of cakes or techniques and we could ALL link to it! LOL!

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Sugarbean Posted 29 Jun 2007 , 7:14pm
post #15 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by JoAnnB

This is strictly my opinion. I would re-find photos and obtain permission. At some future date, if someone 'finds' your site, there could be a recurrence of the explosion.

It would take a bit more time, but you could credit each designer, and/or ask specific permission.




I agree...I think you do have to reference the photo's to be fair. Sorry....

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ShirleyW Posted 29 Jun 2007 , 7:18pm
post #16 of 43

If you have no idea who originally created the cake I would not use that particular photo, as you would not have that persons permission. I think you are putting yourself in a precarious position doing that. I personally am willing to share how I did something on a cake with just about anyone, but I would not want my photos on another person website without my agreement or permission, even with credit.

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bakincakin Posted 29 Jun 2007 , 7:23pm
post #17 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by freddyfl

I think people over think this stuff. You already said there would be a disclaimer and that it isn't your work. When you ( and I mean that as any generic you, not any one person specifically) find an image on the internet to do a fbct does anyone put a disclaimer on the finished cake saying that they, themselves did not draw the picture but found it on such an such a site? I doubt it. I say it sounds good Brandi. I don't see that as any different than when you go to a hairstylist and look through their books on different hair cuts. It is to give the client an idea, it doesn't mean that THAT particular stylist has done all of those cuts and styles. It is cake. Why does everything need to be such an "issue" these days. Just my 2cents.




My thoughts exactly!!

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Maria071 Posted 29 Jun 2007 , 7:29pm
post #18 of 43

Well since the photos on here are public and open to anyone on the internet I would think that just your disclaimer would be fine.

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southerncake Posted 29 Jun 2007 , 7:32pm
post #19 of 43

I do not see anything wrong with what you are going to do! I too have tons of pictures and have no idea where a lot of them came from. I would be flattered to see my pics on an "ideas" page for another decorator as long as they were not taking credit, which you clearly stated you are not going to do. I think it is a great idea.

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Hippiemama Posted 29 Jun 2007 , 7:42pm
post #20 of 43

I personally would check with an attorney to see if your simple disclaimer would work. In this sue happy society I would hate for someone to come after you.

If you are using photos on your site that are not yours you should have permission from the owner of the photo to cover your butt.

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paolacaracas Posted 29 Jun 2007 , 7:56pm
post #21 of 43

How good are you copying a cake? If you show a client a photo, many times she's expecting the very SAME cake, and you know two people don't have the same hand, and it never looks the same. There's another post were the client wasn't happy cause in the cake she choose the shoe said PRADA and in the cake she got it didn't. For the baker wasn't that important but for the client was, so now you know, making somebody else's cake is asking for trouble not with the baker but with the client
This said, if you like any of my cakes and you don't live in caracas, don't worry copy away, If you send me a picture I'll be happy, if not, then I will just never know.

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Eggshells Posted 29 Jun 2007 , 8:14pm
post #22 of 43

I'm not going to give you an opinion one way or another.

But I will tell you what we did with some particular bakers. They were familiar with our quality of work and when we asked if we could use a few of their pictures are "place holders" until we made one they were fine.

Also, we post a cake that was inspired by another baker, we put their name or web addy on the photo; why not?

I do tell people when they come in waving a photo of a cake they want, that if they want that SAME one they need to contact that particular baker and I would be more than happy to help them, that what I would give them would be my interpretation of someone elses work.

they seem ok with this, and we proceed.

So, if you need to do what you need to do and there are many websites that you can post pictures and give your client a password to get into that particular gallery, FREEWEBS is one, then go for it. I don't see anything particularly wrong with this if you have your disclaimers in place and give proper credit where you can.

Good luck

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lardbutt Posted 29 Jun 2007 , 8:14pm
post #23 of 43

I personally, would not want customers sent to CC. Then they would see how much talent is out there and may not want me anymore!lol

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mbelgard Posted 29 Jun 2007 , 8:47pm
post #24 of 43

Even if you state that the photos aren't yours you are still opening the door for problems. My photographer cousin has told me that ANY photo taken is automatically under copyright and it's held by the person who owns the negative, it doesn't matter if it's a professional photo or a snapshot that your kid takes. That's why you can't go to your local Walmart and get cheap copies of the professional photo you had done last year, they watch for those and won't do them to avoid trouble for themselves.
It's also why the people who get caught posting other's pictures are so quick to take them down, they might enjoy CC and not want kicked out but they've been caught and have opened themselves to legal problems. That's why the have the rules about posting other's photos on your website, not to protect delicate feelings.
Unless I've understood wrong even saving photos to your hard drive is infringing, you probably won't get caught over that since they aren't online for everyone to see.

Asking permission of the owner of the photograph and then posting it is fine, you probably should keep a copy of the email or pm that gives you permission though.

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leily Posted 29 Jun 2007 , 9:00pm
post #25 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by Maria071

Well since the photos on here are public and open to anyone on the internet I would think that just your disclaimer would be fine.




But the person who did the cake is the one who posted the picture on this site. Everypicture has who uploaded it so we are not posting other peoples pictures.

I believe this is a fine line, but I would personally want someone to ask to use my photos before the just posted them and said "this isn't mine" Will the photos on your website be locked so no one can copy them? If not then anyone can take the photo of my cake and use it somewhere.

Would you be willing to share the link with your friends here at Cake Central and then we could do a massive search for all of the cakes that you want to use? I know that we have found other cakes by posting them here and someone somewhere has seen it and we find out where it came from. Just another idea

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Cynita Posted 1 Jul 2007 , 11:51pm
post #26 of 43

great info

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bertie Posted 2 Jul 2007 , 12:19am
post #27 of 43

I guess I have one question that has me puzzled.When a person places his or hers cake on cc I myself would think it would be a honor to use the design.I don't understand why we have to have permission to try and do the same design on a cake.

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mbelgard Posted 2 Jul 2007 , 12:24am
post #28 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by bertie

I guess I have one question that has me puzzled.When a person places his or hers cake on cc I myself would think it would be a honor to use the design.I don't understand why we have to have permission to try and do the same design on a cake.




That's a whole other can of worms, this is about using other people's photos. There is no rule that you can't copy another person's cake, some people feel that you should ask permission and others that you should say who inspired you when you post the photo. Search the forums, there are lots of threads on this and most get locked.

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Granpam Posted 2 Jul 2007 , 12:35am
post #29 of 43

I personally think no picture should be posted on any website without the permission of the creator. I'm not sure a disclaimer is enough to avert possible legal ramifications. I have no problem giving permission but someone like Toba, Bronwyn or Duff etc. would. And a lot of people on CC could duplicate a lot of Duff's cakes.

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Cake_Princess Posted 3 Jul 2007 , 6:39am
post #30 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by ShirleyW

If you have no idea who originally created the cake I would not use that particular photo, as you would not have that persons permission. I think you are putting yourself in a precarious position doing that. I personally am willing to share how I did something on a cake with just about anyone, but I would not want my photos on another person website without my agreement or permission, even with credit.





Well said Shirley!!!!

I personally think if you can go to the trouble of looking through other people's sites for pic you can take the time to obtain permission to use their artistic property (photos).

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