AWow that's crazy ass backwards. No offense. You should never touch ready to eat food with out gloves.
ASorrry, I'm just shocked. I overreacted. You know us zooks, we like our toast butterside down.
Wow that's crazy ass backwards. No offense. You should never touch ready to eat food with out gloves.
There is much worse than having nice scrubbed, gloveless hands on your food. And there is lots that can happen while wearing gloves... I once saw one of those hidden camera shows where a guy narrates, while they show clips of all sorts of nastiness. The guy on camera is preparing salads, and had a pile of washed lettuce on a cart. A waitress comes in and they flirt and he paws at her, and she goes out again, and he prepares salads. This happens several times, and then there comes a time when pawing and kissing leads to more, and she pulls her britches down, SITS ON THE LETTUCE CART BARE BUTT, and they proceed to do the unthinkable. And then he zips up and continues to make salads, USING THE BRUISED LETTUCE THE HO WAS SITTING ON, but at least he was wearing gloves the whole time, right?
AI agree that that is freaking crazy. But just because I like gloves doesn't mean that I don't like proper glove usage. Using a glove for more than one task is not proper usage. Not washing your hands before and after wearing gloves is not proper glove usage. You treat your gloves like you woild your hands. If its a situation where you would have to wash your hands. Then take the gloves off and wash your hands. I've seen plenty of improper glove use and lots of improper hand hygiene. this is not directed at anyone here. Just food service in general. Gloves or no gloves, if your hands aren't raw by the end of an 8 hr shift. Youre probably doing it wrong.
AAnd I can't shake the thought of the "ho" and the salad. Wonder what the customers thought of the vinegarette that night. :X
A
Original message sent by kaylawaylalayla
And I can't shake the thought of the "ho" and the salad. Wonder what the customers thought of the vinegarette that night. :X
There is much worse than having nice scrubbed, gloveless hands on your food. And there is lots that can happen while wearing gloves... I once saw one of those hidden camera shows where a guy narrates, while they show clips of all sorts of nastiness. The guy on camera is preparing salads, and had a pile of washed lettuce on a cart. A waitress comes in and they flirt and he paws at her, and she goes out again, and he prepares salads. This happens several times, and then there comes a time when pawing and kissing leads to more, and she pulls her britches down, SITS ON THE LETTUCE CART BARE BUTT, and they proceed to do the unthinkable. And then he zips up and continues to make salads, USING THE BRUISED LETTUCE THE HO WAS SITTING ON, but at least he was wearing gloves the whole time, right?
I try not to watch those, but everytime I get sucked in I spend the rest of the day convincing myself it's all an act and nobody is actually that disgusting...
As far as gloves go, I think everyone who wants to handle food in anyway should have to read these.
There is much worse than having nice scrubbed, gloveless hands on your food. And there is lots that can happen while wearing gloves... I once saw one of those hidden camera shows where a guy narrates, while they show clips of all sorts of nastiness. The guy on camera is preparing salads, and had a pile of washed lettuce on a cart. A waitress comes in and they flirt and he paws at her, and she goes out again, and he prepares salads. This happens several times, and then there comes a time when pawing and kissing leads to more, and she pulls her britches down, SITS ON THE LETTUCE CART BARE BUTT, and they proceed to do the unthinkable. And then he zips up and continues to make salads, USING THE BRUISED LETTUCE THE HO WAS SITTING ON, but at least he was wearing gloves the whole time, right?
I try not to watch those, but everytime I get sucked in I spend the rest of the day convincing myself it's all an act and nobody is actually that disgusting...
As far as gloves go, I think everyone who wants to handle food in anyway should have to read these.
Who Scrumdiddly, thanks for that! These are my favorite parts! Make me want to run out to the nearest restaurant!
A recent UK Food Standards Agency survey showed that one-third of caterers fail to wash hands after using the toilet.[8] Efficacy of a thorough hand washing sequence using antimicrobial soap, lathering well, rinsing and drying may be greater than 3-log reduction (99.9%). Combined with alcohol sanitizer treatment this can be raised even further. For example, long ago it was shown that Salmonella spp. can survive for several hours on fingertips, but that handwashing followed by hand drying with paper towels effectively reduced the risk of transmission to food.[9] If it were only that simple. There are important parts of the hand that are typically missed during the hand washing process. Thumbs, palms, spaces between fingers and fingertips, including the fingernail area, are areas where contamination is most likely to remain. The nail region presents special problems because more than 95% of hand flora resides in these areas.[10] Toilet paper poke-through results in fecal contamination of this part of the hand, commonly used hand hygiene protocols render this intervention largely ineffective, thereby additionally requiring fingernail brush use.[11-13] It is uncertain what role that the fingernail region plays in foodborne transmission of human pathogens and depending on glove strength at finger tips, whether glove use would increase or decrease the probability of transmission, when the nail region is heavily contaminated. It is known, for example, that artificial nails are linked to poor hand washing practices, more glove tears and to outbreaks.[14-15] In gloves that trap heat and moisture, the potential exists to liquefy nail contamination and release it when punctured.
yeah, I had to stop reading the article. too late for me to compute. must try again in the morning. basically what I got from it is, your ****ty hands will never be clean enough, but gloves won't help either.
the false nail thing really bothers me,i know they won't let food service workers have them. which I agree with, but then why do so many nurses have them?
A
Original message sent by kaylawaylalayla
yeah, I had to stop reading the article. too late for me to compute. must try again in the morning. basically what I got from it is, your ****ty hands will never be clean enough, but gloves won't help either. the false nail thing really bothers me,i know they won't let food service workers have them. which I agree with, but then why do so many nurses have them?
I haaaaaate fake nails and long nails. They gross me out, thoroughly.
yeah, I had to stop reading the article. too late for me to compute. must try again in the morning. basically what I got from it is, your ****ty hands will never be clean enough, but gloves won't help either.
the false nail thing really bothers me,i know they won't let food service workers have them. which I agree with, but then why do so many nurses have them?
Yep, pretty much!
My nails grow like crazy, but I like to keep them short. Regardless of the length, I scrub them thoroughly. I used to use a nail brush, but found a medium bristle tooth brush works so much better, since I can focus on each nail individually, rather than the huge brush that misses areas. And then I soak them in my freshly made bleach water (not the sanitizer for the sink, but my bucket I wipe up spills with and soak my wash cloths in, it is bleachier) then I love to blast them with my prerinse sprayer. (high pressure, low volume) They feel amazing afterward, and are bright white. I wish I could get them swabbed and see how clean they really are.
yeah, I had to stop reading the article. too late for me to compute. must try again in the morning. basically what I got from it is, your ****ty hands will never be clean enough, but gloves won't help either.
the false nail thing really bothers me,i know they won't let food service workers have them. which I agree with, but then why do so many nurses have them?
I meant to say something about that. SICKENS ME! Especially the nurses in the NICU, who had claws, handling my babies... I was worried they would accidentally dig their skin off.
AI used to work in McDonald's when I was a teen, it used to really annoy me that everyone assumed we did all the gross things people assume is done with McDonald's food because we actually took care about our jobs and the food we served.
I actually have a major problem eating food that's been prepared in someone's home, stemming from a very bad experience in a home with a dog when I was a little kid. I never eat at potlucks apart from whatever I brought, and I always offer to bring a dish when we're invited to someone's house. It's kind of a pain but I just can't get over it!
I used to work in McDonald's when I was a teen, it used to really annoy me that everyone assumed we did all the gross things people assume is done with McDonald's food because we actually took care about our jobs and the food we served.
I actually have a major problem eating food that's been prepared in someone's home, stemming from a very bad experience in a home with a dog when I was a little kid. I never eat at potlucks apart from whatever I brought, and I always offer to bring a dish when we're invited to someone's house. It's kind of a pain but I just can't get over it!
Agreed! I have seen some gross dog related stuff.
I read the article, it reads very journal-like. The 1st 1/4 of it establishes a problem = poor handwashing. Then spends the next 3/4 of it basically saying that although poor handwashing is bad, the improper use of gloves is more widespread, makes instances of poor handwashing even worse, and is ultimately much more dangerous so here is XYZ that needs to happen in order to make gloves more effective and how to attempt to minimize this problem. In fact, all you really need to read is this:
"Glove use has been proposed as a risk reduction strategy by public health authorities.[16-17] Even though gloves have also been shown to transfer or amplify risk, the U.S. FDA believes that handwashing with soap and water or even use of alcohol hand sanitizers may not be enough to prevent transmission of viral and protozoan microorganisms via the fecal-oral route.[13,17] Herein lies the advantage of glove use. There is general agreement that food safety managers should reduce bare-hand contact when possible, especially with ready-to-eat foods. Thus, glove usage should be considered whenever utensils or deli/bakery papers don’t work efficiently. For glove use to make sense, workers must be trained to use gloves properly, but that’s just a starting point. Workers and management cannot put blind faith in glove use, but must evaluate potential for hygiene failure.
When a failure occurs, both worker and product can be compromised in several ways, dramatically increasing risks. The risk may be minor, only involving sporadic spoilage problems or a non-event, but it also can cause shelf-life or product safety to be compromised.[3] Two such failure factors are well-documented:
• A single glove hole can release tens of thousands of bacteria from overly moist internal glove surfaces.[19-21]
• Glove fragments can end up in food.[22]"
Please don't get judgy of me (or others like me) that live in an area with a huge food service industry and a HD that have very good reasons for deciding glove usage during food prep and handling ready-to-eat food is a violation.
What this boils down to: if someone is nasty and doesn't wash their hands, no glove in the universe is going to help. I hope we can all agree on that.
Comparing food handlers to nurses or those in the medical industry is like comparing an apple to a Porsche. I could list many, many reasons why that comparison fails but it's really not the point I want to make. The point I want to make is: if your HD says that you need to wear gloves, then you need to wear gloves. I am a by-the-book kind of gal and totally respect you and that - but there are many, many reasons why the false security of gloves are not accepted by health departments - mine happens to be one of them and the article cited does a great job of explaining why.
Proper use of gloves is difficult even for people in the medical profession. That may be one reason hospitals are breeding grounds for bacteria. I spent a lot of time with my mom when she was in the hospital and it drove me crazy that no one seemed to care that they touched the gloves with unwashed handed contaminating them on the outside while they were putting them on. I suspected a lot of medical people forgot they weren't just trying to protect themselves.
Also, they expect nurses to do a lot of things on their own with kits designed for one person to perform something in a sterile way but many couldn't manage it. The necessary procedure was so convoluted for one person -- many needed some help.
AI apologize if I sounded judgey. I dont want to judgey you.I tried to make it better by saying that I overreacted and then compared the situation to dr. Seuss's butter battle book. I hope that makes sense.
Absolutely we can agree that someone who is nasty and doesn't wash their hands cannot be saved by gloves. Thats why I've repeated that glove wearing is not a substitute for proper hand hygeine.
My intent was not to compare the medical field to the culinary food to say that were better because we don't wear fake nails. Or to try to justify wearing fake nails as a cook. But to say if its unsafe even for apples to wear fake nails then it makes sense to me that porsche's should also not be wearing fake nails due to the effect they have on gloves and hygeine.
I totally respect that you are a by the book gal, I am too. thats why we are both so adamant about our positions.I just never knew that books completely the opposite to the one thats been drilled inside my brain existed. I totally overreacted. now im totally saying totally too much.
Check out these sites, and you may never want to eat again.
http://mentalfloss.com/article/29133/how-much-rodent-filth-does-fda-allow
LOL! That's what CC is for, hopefully to totall show all total sides of topics :D
Check out these sites, and you may never want to eat again.
http://mentalfloss.com/article/29133/how-much-rodent-filth-does-fda-allow
After reading this I have to eliminate some things from my shopping list. Maybe I should just go on a liquid diet, lol. Ignorance was bliss.
Everytime I have watched 'ace of cakes' I have thought that even if someone gives me a free cake from there I'm not going to eat it. Those decorators are always talking, laughing, coughing when inches away from the cake, it always grosses me out.
I saw one episode of Chopped where a contestant did not have terribly long hair (looked like 4-5 inches), but he kept running both hands through it. Scott Connant got a dish with a hair on it and refused to touch it. The contestant had to do something to hold his hair back before the next round. I don't think he won.
:nodding:
There was one contestant who double-dipped his tasting spoon without realizing it, and I remember when Chris Santos (I think) called him out on it, he -- the contestant -- was completely gobsmacked. It just never occurred to him that you don't do things like that, whether or not you're on TV.
Also a lot of people don't know to wash there hands before you go to the bathroom, in the bathroom and again when you return to the kitchen.
And all jewelry is a safety hazard in the kitchen.
Oh, and I just remembered -- you always take off your apron when leaving your work area for any reason. I never knew this until my current job. We got a new manager who had gone through the ranks, and he was beside himself over the fact that none of us ever took off our aprons. He insisted it was a sanitary code violation. One of my now-old coworkers took him to task for it only to find out he was correct.
AI have never (before today) seen any of these shows, but after reading this thread I was curious so I visited YouTube and watched a bit of CakeBoss and some Ace of Cakes. Oh my goodness! Hair everywhere! So gross. I've got to say, too, that CakeBoss seemed to me to be a badly acted farce of a bakery, not realistic at all.
:nodding:
There was one contestant who double-dipped his tasting spoon without realizing it, and I remember when Chris Santos (I think) called him out on it, he -- the contestant -- was completely gobsmacked. It just never occurred to him that you don't do things like that, whether or not you're on TV.
I like that about chopped, I just saw an older episode where one chef used raw chicken on her cutting board, and without switching or flipping it, she put the cooked chicken on and was cutting things up on it in the raw chicken juices.
None of them would taste her food, made me all warm and fuzzy inside.
I used to work in McDonald's when I was a teen, it used to really annoy me that everyone assumed we did all the gross things people assume is done with McDonald's food because we actually took care about our jobs and the food we served.
I actually have a major problem eating food that's been prepared in someone's home, stemming from a very bad experience in a home with a dog when I was a little kid. I never eat at potlucks apart from whatever I brought, and I always offer to bring a dish when we're invited to someone's house. It's kind of a pain but I just can't get over it!
I want all the horrible details, I love this stuff, lol.
I have a story about eating at a person's home when I was a teen runaway, staying with my uncle in this trailer park. We all had a neighborhood cookout where it was pot luck, so I made some canned beans, since I he already had them there, and I didn't have any money, either. These people were all poor in this trailer park, but it was decent and their trailers were very clutter-free and organized, just kind of sparse. Soooooper friendly, nice people, no judgement. Looked clean, and beggars (me) can't be choosers, so I was happy just to eat! The lady of the house next door made beans too, and said I should try them, because they were home-made from scratch, dry beans and seasonings, beer and other stuff, been cooking all day, yadda yadda, so I scooped some on my plate, and thanked her. It was getting later and darker but I am picky, so I was trying to see if there onions in the beans, holding it up to my face, lol. So I noticed shiny stuff in them, and wasn't sure what it was, so I brought them in the house to see,(yeah, I hate onions) I pulled the shiny thing out, and picked at it, and noticed it had legs! And antenna and little tiny black eyes! A COCKROACH! I almost had a heart attack! I started picking more, and the whole dang portion was full of roaches! I scraped it into the garbage and got to looking at the other food on the plate and it was all clear, but I couldn't eat it, regardless.
So I went out, all nonchalant, and mingled, not saying anything... So the lady sees my beans are gone, and I compliment her and stuff, and she asks me to me to get her cigarettes out of her trailer so I go in, and notice the crock pot with more beans still in it, is half under the upper cabinets, sitting on the counter, and the upper cabinets don't have doors on them, and the roaches were literally jumping in the damn beans, out of the cabinet. And she had water boiling in a pan, with a long serving spoon sitting at the top of the pan with the handle on the counter, and the roaches were marching up the spoon and diving in the boiling water. She comes running in, while I am holding her cigarettes, and says she forgot her macaroni, and grabs the pan with the roaches, stirs it, then pours the water out of the pan into the sink, and I hand her the cigarettes and a roach crawls out of them and runs up her arm, and she just swipes it to the floor, and lights up, like it was a mosquito, or something. While she puts the powdered cheese in, and stirs, with a cigarette hanging out of her mouth, I see ashes going in the macaroni....and she is stirring, and I see all these dark brown spots in them...And this whole time I am talking, while I am literally screaming on the inside, trying to be polite.
I swear, I sifted through every meal I ate for about 5 years, after that! And I would just start shuddering when someone even said the word "beans" for 10 years. I still hate eating at other people's homes.
I saw one episode of Chopped where a contestant did not have terribly long hair (looked like 4-5 inches), but he kept running both hands through it. Scott Connant got a dish with a hair on it and refused to touch it. The contestant had to do something to hold his hair back before the next round. I don't think he won.
:nodding:
There was one contestant who double-dipped his tasting spoon without realizing it, and I remember when Chris Santos (I think) called him out on it, he -- the contestant -- was completely gobsmacked. It just never occurred to him that you don't do things like that, whether or not you're on TV.
YUCK! Though, I must confess I do this to my own family, lol. I eat right off the mixing spoon, and stick it back in. I figure that my kids were in my body, swimming around for 7 months or more, a little of my spit wont hurt, and my husband and I are married, with all that entails...... I would never, in a billion years do that for company or clients. I have dozens of spoons in a drawer in the bakery that I use to sample batter or filling or icing, since I taste everything that goes out the door, just in case. I use the spoon, and throw it in the basin. If I need to taste again, I get a fresh spoon.
Oh, and I just remembered -- you always take off your apron when leaving your work area for any reason. I never knew this until my current job. We got a new manager who had gone through the ranks, and he was beside himself over the fact that none of us ever took off our aprons. He insisted it was a sanitary code violation. One of my now-old coworkers took him to task for it only to find out he was correct.
Where I used to work, the OWNER worked there, and go into the bathroom with her apron on, and come out, wiping her hands on it. No hand washing involved, just wiping on the apron. She would also lick the small angled spatula she was icing with. (I have told this story on her lots of times, in the past) But she would actually have so much spit on it, that you could see it glistening in the bowl, and even on the cake. I called the health department and they said they couldn't test for spit in icing, but they did an inspection a week later, but we had been cleaning for the ICES meeting that was taking place there that Sunday... ugh. CLEAN AS A WHISTLE! I was so disappointed!
:nodding:
There was one contestant who double-dipped his tasting spoon without realizing it, and I remember when Chris Santos (I think) called him out on it, he -- the contestant -- was completely gobsmacked. It just never occurred to him that you don't do things like that, whether or not you're on TV.
I like that about chopped, I just saw an older episode where one chef used raw chicken on her cutting board, and without switching or flipping it, she put the cooked chicken on and was cutting things up on it in the raw chicken juices.
None of them would taste her food, made me all warm and fuzzy inside.
YUCK! I throw my PINK raw meat cutting board in the sink or dishwasher, and use my BROWN cooked food cutting board once it is done. EAsy peasy, color coded like that. The green one is for fruit and veggies.
AI have no problem eat at other people's homes. But if I am in a house with a dog I always check my clean cup for hairs before i pour anything in.
Yeah I knew about the apron thing. When I worked at a private club the members couldn't see you with out ans apron and a toke, but you also couldn't go to the bathroom with your apron. So if you were at an event where the members and the staff used the same bathroom *gasp* you were advised to walk as quickly as possible and try not to be seen.
I started gagging the moment I read 'legs' and still haven't stopped. Oh my gosh, that is so revolting!!!
I trust restaurants more than most people's homes, at least there are rules to follow, and most at least try to stick to some of them, lol. In someone's home, there is nothing.
There's a lady who sells shish kabobs at the local farmer's market, her truck broke down one day and she only lives a few minutes away, so I offered to help her drive all her equipment and stuff to sell.
We go into the house to collect stuff, and she is 'marinating' the skewers of meat on a giant painting tarp on her living room floor. she just skewers the meat, tosses it on the tarp, dumps the oil/spices on top and lets it sit for 24 hours. Totally uncovered, at room temp.
Oh, did I mention she has a cat?
I don't eat anything from the farmer's markets now, unless it is mine or I know the person and have been in their kitchen.
I started gagging the moment I read 'legs' and still haven't stopped. Oh my gosh, that is so revolting!!!
I trust restaurants more than most people's homes, at least there are rules to follow, and most at least try to stick to some of them, lol. In someone's home, there is nothing.
There's a lady who sells shish kabobs at the local farmer's market, her truck broke down one day and she only lives a few minutes away, so I offered to help her drive all her equipment and stuff to sell.
We go into the house to collect stuff, and she is 'marinating' the skewers of meat on a giant painting tarp on her living room floor. she just skewers the meat, tosses it on the tarp, dumps the oil/spices on top and lets it sit for 24 hours. Totally uncovered, at room temp.
Oh, did I mention she has a cat?
I don't eat anything from the farmer's markets now, unless it is mine or I know the person and have been in their kitchen.
wow it amazes me how little people know about time and temperature rules, or believe them.
when I got out of culinary school I was telling my mom about some of the stuff she shouldn't do and she was like " i'm fine, I haven't died, I've been doing it all my life, just cause you go to college and get a degree doesn't mean you know everything"
and I was like "oh yeah, when you get "random and unexplainable" "stomach bugs" and you have diahrea and throw up for what you think is no reason then maybe you are not fine. and then maybe I do know what I was taught and you should listen to me."
it took her almost two years to realize that her actions had consequences (as in, if I leave a atco in the microwave overnight, of course I can have it for breakfast) and to make the connection between food safety and her health.
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