My son turned 18 last October and graduated from high school this last May. Since his graduation he doesn't feel like he has to answer to anyone. We bought a truck for him to use which will be passed onto our next son when he gets his license (probably next summer). I haven't seen my son since Sunday morning when he came in to get a shower. In fact, we left while he was in the shower. We have told him that as long as he lives with us he needs to go to church. Well, that hasn't been happening. I've told my husband repeatedly that we need to know where he is. I don't care where he is but we need to know. Especially when he doesn't come home at night. We lost a very dear friend of ours (she was 20) last week in a pretty bad car accident and this has heightened the anxiety even more. He works with the same company as my dad. They started working evenings yesterday and got off work about 10:00. We don't know where he went after that. He didn't spend the night with my parents. My husband says that I can't control where he goes and what he does. I'm not trying to. I just worry and would like to know where he is. I haven't even talked with him on the phone. I honestly don't know what to do. I'm trying really hard not to be like my mom who is constantly telling my younger brother what he needs to be doing.
What should I do?
when I was about 20, I too spent the whole night out only to walk into the house in the a.m. at the same time my dad was leaving to go to work. He said nothing as his expression said it all.
I knew and have the same viewpoint now.
a home is NOT a democracy -- at best it is a benevolent dictatorship. The children are not, nor never should be in control.
Parent's house, parent's rules.
simple manners dictate telling where you'll be, even when back for a visit, no matter how old or how long you've lived on your own.
quick way to get his attention: pull the spark plug wires out of the truck...won't be going anywhere until he gets them back --- and of course he gets them back only after meeting YOUR terms.
________________
and now a rant:
WHAT GIVES WITH ALL THESE PARENTS ACROSS OUR COUNTRY BUYING THEIR KIDS CARS???
This past school year, I actually had parents buy their son, who is on the 5+year plan to graduate HS, a brand new sports car when he was failing EVERY subject in "hopes" it might make him want to work to pass. HMMM...let's see, bad behavior, failing, has been rewarded w/ a new car. Where's the incentive to do better?
if a kid wants or even needs a car -- he/she should HAVE to buy it him/herself! And insure it and pay for the gas and pay for the insurance. This teaches personal responsibility.
we wonder why they act like spoiled, rotten brats...well...look no further than the mirror and how we, yes WE, indulge them.
NO -- you don't need that! No, I'm NOT getting that for you. << both need to be said MUCH more often.
I don't think you are asking for too much at all!! It is called respect! A friend of mine had her son move back in with her and her husband after living on his own for a year. Before he moved out he was basically doing what your son is. She made him sit down (with her husband) and sign a contract and go over what they expected. They said he wasn't acting like the son they raised and he wasn't treating them with respect. I truly believe that if they treat their parents without respect this is how they will treat someone that they marry. She said he is acting like a totally different person!! So don't give up but you are going to need you husband to show you some support in this or it is going to be a bigger struggle.
Good luck! Hang in there!
Charlotte
Thanks for your support! I finally took the bull by the horns this morning. I used my boss' cell phone and called him. He picked up and then when I asked where he was he hung up (or lost connection as he said). He then called me back a little bit later on. He said he spent the night with a guy he graduated with (which is not a real good situation). I finally told him that he needs to let me know where he is. I wasn't trying to tell him he couldn't do it but I needed to know where he was. He is on his way home now and I told him before he did anything today that he needed to clean his room or I was getting in there tonight and doing it. We'll see. My husband's response: if he's going to do something stupid, he'll do it. I think the truck is going to come up missing when he gets home from work tonight. He leaves it at my parent's house and he rides with my dad and brother. See, the major issue here is that my husband is afraid of losing him. My older sister, older brother and younger brother have all been in major trouble since they were 18. My older siblings haven't been in church for over 10 years. My husband backs me up when it's just the two of us talking but not when it comes down to a confrontation with Josh. Now, the last time I talked with my husband (after I finally heard from my son) he did state that he was going to take the truck away. We'll see.
Doug:
We didn't purchase a new vehicle. It was a 98 Ford F150. My husband's company shut down and we were able to get his work truck for $1,500.00 (which we used his severance package to pay for). Josh is responsible for any and all repairs plus paying for insurance. This will be the same with my next son. Josh worked through his senior year (after football season was over) with my husband's company during the week and worked on the weekends at our church and is now working for the same electrical company that my father and my 2 brothers work for. I have the same opinion and pet peeve that you do. Nothing frustrates me more than seeing a teenager driving a brand new vehicle that "mommy and daddy" are paying for. My first vehicle was a 1978 Chevy Chevette (who hasn't owned on of those!!!) which constantly broke down until I finally went and purchased a brand new Chevy Cavalier. My parents gave me the down payment for my graduation gift but I made the payments on it. Our family is by far the richest family. My kids are hard workers and are held responsible for their actions. This goes for my 11 year old on up to my 18 year old.
Well said Doug......Long gone are the days when a teenager has to work for something!!
I hope you didn't think I was attacking you personnally....just after 30 years of teaching and seeing the authority of teachers undermined at every turn by parents who spoil, spoil, SPOIL their children and comparing it to my upbringing...well rant I had to.
My first vehicle was a 1978 Chevy Chevette (who hasn't owned on of those!!!) which constantly broke down until I finally went and purchased a brand new Chevy Cavalier.
well, mine was a 1960 ford fairlain in-line 6 cylindar w/ manual choke! and it was already 10 years old when I got it (inherited via death in family) it was already begining to be a "flintstone" car. rust is an "intersting" thing -- tho' I could start it when no one else could get their cars started in winter....luv that manual choke.
after that had a "banana" bug..vw super beetle in bright yellow!
keep the faith and if need be kick the boy out. I know it sounds harsh but my brothers were (and one still is) a royal screw up. My brother Dexter has now gotten his act together and my brother Chris is still lost in the sauce. (they are both in their 30's) I've learned from watching my parents that the more you allow the behavior the worse it is. Don't tell him as long as I know where you are it's ok. That's what my parents did and it does not work! Either thy lied about where they were or just said screw you, you don't need to know. If he thinks he can live under your roof and not follow the rules, show him whose boss, after all he can't go far without a truck that belongs to you and your husband. I feel sorry for you, because I know what you are going through, and I would hate to see what has happened to my brothers happen to your son. I thought for sure my parents would be dead by now from broken hearts. It sounds as if your son has lost respect (and the fear of a parent) for you and your husband, I wish you the best. I'll pray for you and your husband.
Ok, here's my $0.02.
The plain & simple fact is that your son IS going to do whatever he can get away with. He is merely pushing your buttons, IMHO. And, honestly having been an 17/18 yo that literally drove my mother crazy, he's going to go against what you say to him, what you tell him to do and he'll also go against things he's been taught & knows is right...like church.
The fact is, he'll probably move out, only to move back in later. He probably still thinks he's invincible.
It took me quite a while to straighten up. In order to do it, though, I had to see for myself what I was doing wrong. And, I had to get away from the wrong people. What did it take to do that....time. I moved in with my loser bf and almost failed hs and I lost all of my friends.
So...to answer your question, No, you're not overbearing at all.
My dm badgered me all of the time and she did nothing but push me away even farther.
So, I think you shoud just remind him of the already set ground rules and merely enforce them.
Also, he graduated, right? Is he going to college or anything? And, if he's keeping down a good job, then that's great!
Good luck to you, and sorry if I rambled, there's just so much in my mind about being young & what I did wrong...it was only 9/10 yrs ago and it's still VERY FRESH!!!!
I hope you & your son can find a solution to this.
Good Luck to you!
Doug:
No, I didn't think you were talking to me personally. I just wanted to make it clear that we don't in any way spoil our kids.
I don't want anyone to get the wrong impression of Josh. He is a wonderful young man. We have had a really tough year in our family. I really don't want to go into any details but I will say that our family faced something pretty bad. It just seemed like as soon as he walked across the stage in May to accept his diploma, he changed. I don't know if I want to face this with my remaining 3 children. Josh went through a rebellious time in 8th grade but ever since then he was almost a model teenager. We loved watching him grow and spent a lot of time as a family. Most parents complain about the teenage years but we loved them. We didn't have the problems that seem to effect other families. The job that Josh has will be paying for him to go to technical school as long as he keeps his grades up. This is a wonderful opportunity for him. He had the world to choose from. We couldn't afford to send him to college but would have helped in any way we could. He was also thinking of the Marines (be still my heart - I would have been proud of this decision but would be scared to death at the same time). I'm sorry if it seems like I'm rambling. Quite honestly, I can't do anything until my husband realizes that he needs to back me up not only when we are alone but in front of the kids, too.
here's an interesting idea -- maybe --
taking a hint from what others have said about time for him to move out and get place of own....
give him one last "late" graduation gift.
target "complete kitchen in a box" 75 items -- pots/pans, utensils, silverware, plates, bowels, glasses -- on sale this week.
target ad
wrap it up w/ note to effect of for your new apartment. -- this is your 30 days notice that you have to move out.
(or you could do what my mom did when I moved into my first apt. -- used it as an excuse to be rid of all her old chipped, miss-matched and unwanted stuff and buy all new for herself!)
Doug,
Not to change the subject but when my oldest son was in 9th grade he had to take tech (use to be called wood shop when I was in school). He's a smart kid, always high 80's or 90's. Well, he brought home a 53 in that class first marking period. I called the school for a conference to see what was wrong and how to help him. Well I met with his teacher and the principal. Long story short, he didn't like the class so he wasn't putting the effort into the work. I actually had the PRINCIPAL tell me that this wasn't an "important" class so not to worry about it. I said that it's a required class and it brings his whole average down so YES it's important. My son got grounded until he got his grade up, and I had the teacher contact me frequently with updates on his work and attitude in class. He went from failing that course to having the highest average in it. He was so mad at me for awhile but he ended up going to Clarkson University and getting an engineering degree. Boy I'm a bad mom.
Doug,
Not to change the subject but when my oldest son was in 9th grade he had to take tech (use to be called wood shop when I was in school). He's a smart kid, always high 80's or 90's. Well, he brought home a 53 in that class first marking period. I called the school for a conference to see what was wrong and how to help him. Well I met with his teacher and the principal. Long story short, he didn't like the class so he wasn't putting the effort into the work. I actually had the PRINCIPAL tell me that this wasn't an "important" class so not to worry about it. I said that it's a required class and it brings his whole average down so YES it's important. My son got grounded until he got his grade up, and I had the teacher contact me frequently with updates on his work and attitude in class. He went from failing that course to having the highest average in it. He was so mad at me for awhile but he ended up going to Clarkson University and getting an engineering degree. Boy I'm a bad mom.
ah....the kind of mother teachers dream all students would have!
My hubby went through this with his mom. After he graduated she wanted to know where he would be and approximately what time he got hom. He was upset about it. Told her he wasn't a child. He finally got it through his head that it was not because of that. It is just good manners to let someone know where you're going to be etc. At our home now, we let each other know where we will be and approx. time to get back home. My mother lives here too and she follows it too. Every once in a while he'll revert back to that being upset about everyone wanting to know where he is going. He also paid his parents at least $200 a month to live and eat there. This was not asked of him just something he did. His father didn't know this for a long time. He just gave the money to his mom because he knew she couldn't buy groceries unless he did. When he moved out, his mom had to get a job so they could make ends meet.
With me, my father was older and on social security already. So my brother and I received money from that. Mom took out to pay for utilities, food, and eventually a car. My father passed away when I was 15 but we continued to get the money until we turned 18. Mom always took out her part and then gave us the rest for spending (had to buy our own clothes, school supplies, etc. out of this money). Like I said my parents always let us know where they were and required the same of us.
My hubby went through this with his mom. He graduated and went to college for less than a semester and dropped out. She told him he had to work as long as he was under her roof, so he got a job bagging groceries at the local store. Well that lasted all of 3 or 4 months then he quit and began doing construction with his step-dad and that lasted oh about 3 months, then he got tired of her nagging so he hopped in his car and drove to Tennessee (he was in Arkansas) to come see me for my Spring Break. Well he ended up staying and working with my dad. He lived with us for about 6 months before he enlisted into the Air Force (BEST THING HE EVER DID other than marry me.. 
) His mom was LIVID at the time and could not believe that my parents would allow him to stay in our home. My mom and dad loved him like he was their own son and he was working and paying his due so WHY NOT!!! We got married a year after I graduated from HS and moved to NC where he was stationed. He was in the Air Force for 4 years and got out to become a firefighter and he has been doing it ever since!!!
We now have 2 daughters ages 6 & 2, and I know when the time comes and they are ready to leave the nest I am going to FLIP OUT just like his mother did, but I will have to let them go. It doesn't mean I won't worry about them every day!!! 
Doug in my opinion you are 100% correct. If your child lives under your roof they need to live by your rules - I don't care how old they are. It is important that you stick to your guns for many reasons including the fact that your younger children live in your house as well and they are going to take their cue from their older brother, set the rules and stick by them it will be the best thing for your family. Good luck!
Just wanted to let everyone know that Josh called me when he was on his way home from work last night and let me know he would be home soon. He was home about 15 minutes later. We'll see how long this will last. Thanks for all the support and advice!
Good deal!! See, with all of us pulling for you it had to work right??!! lol
Glad he called. He may forget everynow and then and need a gentle reminder. Just hang in there.
OK, now, having said that, please remind me of all of my words of wisdom when I need it. My oldest DD is 16 my son 6 and youngest DD 3 so I am sure that they are going to put me to the test!! LOL
ok when i was growing up, the rule for living with my parents was that if i wsn't coming home i needed to tell them and let them know so my mom wouldn't worry. you deserve that respect. it is your home. it is also your vehicle. part of being an adult is learning respect and appreciating what you have. i didn't always like reporting in but in the same aspect it was great knowing they didn't want to throw me to the curb just because i wasn't their responsibility anymore.
I'm glad to hear that he seems to be understanding. I certainly don't think you are being overbearing. Yes he is a legal adult now but he is still living in your home. It is all about respect. Yes he can stay out all night but he owes you the respect to let you know so you don't worry. Its not like you are trying to pick out his clothes for him. If he doesn't like it he can get his own place but he likely wouldn't have the amenities he is used to living with now.
When I turned 16 I got a radio - not a car like everyone else seemed to. I can't tell you how many of them wrecked or trashed their first cars and mostly because they didn't respect it. When I bought my first car I treated it like a baby because I had to work for it myself - insurance and all. I can understand your situation though and I'm glad he is responsible for it. I can't believe how kids today get brand new (or close to it) cars, wreck them, and the parents just replace it with a better model!
My kids are: boy 21, girl 20, boy 18. I wouldn't ever kick a kid out! My two boys are very responsible and are usually home. My daughter often spends the night out; she usually tells me if she is not coming home and I always know whose house she is at. Keep telling your son you need to know if he is coming home or not for your peace of mind. As far as WHERE he is, it sounds like he has a cell phone; so I wouldn't fret too much about where he is ... unless you think he is into some wrong-doing.
As far as church. I am a strict Catholic. I NEVER dreamed in a million years that MY kids wouldn't go to church. My two oldest don't go. With the first one who decided as soon as he was 18 that he didn't have to go, I was REALLY ANGRY. My husband said We don't want to drive him out of the house by harping on such issues. I have to agree; because I'd rather have him home and happy than have me piss him off enough to leave. My daughter who was next to quit church ... what could I say? We were already setting the example with the first one! My youngest, however, sits beside me in church every Sunday. A good thing is that his two best friends also are church-goers. I guess that helps a lot!
I agree he needs to let you know where he is but under no circumstances do I agree with forcing someone to go to church. He is old enough to know his own mind and his own feelings about religion by forcing him to go you'll just build up resentment. By all means encourage him to go to church but do not insist.
Vienneaus - try not to worry they may come around. I was raised in a strict Catholic family. I backed away from the church when I was getting married because of some incredibly hurtful statements made about my DH by the church (he is not Catholic nor baptised). I am trying to get the courage to go back but everytime my mom gets on my case and tries to guilt me about my kids I tend to back away - and I'm 32 
- did I just admit that - lol. I am a true case for why forcing just doesn't work. You've done the right thing. If given patience and time they will find their way back if that is what they choose. You are doing the best you can. You have given them the tools and they will almost certainly use them when they are ready.
Vienneaus - try not to worry they may come around. I was raised in a strict Catholic family. I backed away from the church when I was getting married because of some incredibly hurtful statements made about my DH by the church (he is not Catholic nor baptised). I am trying to get the courage to go back but everytime my mom gets on my case and tries to guilt me about my kids I tend to back away - and I'm 32
- did I just admit that - lol. I am a true case for why forcing just doesn't work. You've done the right thing. If given patience and time they will find their way back if that is what they choose. You are doing the best you can. You have given them the tools and they will almost certainly use them when they are ready.
we have a member in the family who too dropped away from the church only later to rejoin a bible church. he found the rituals and formality to "distancing" for him, too impersonal and wanted a more modern, personal style of worship. High church style is not for everyone.
one of the neatest things about the christian faith I ever heard came from a nun:
"we're all ice cream -- just different flavors."
so pick you flavor!
one of the neatest things about the christian faith I ever heard came from a nun:
"we're all ice cream -- just different flavors."
so pick you flavor!
I love that quote! I always tell my mom that although I do not currently practice it in no way means that I have lost faith. I pray more now than I ever did. Thanks Doug!
My son turned 18 this past July and has definitely been experimenting with flexing those "I'm 18 now so I can do what I want" muscles. My DH (his stepfather since age 7) and I are letting him flex those muscles, but within reason. We told him that we need to know where he is, not because we don't trust him but if, God forbid, something happened, we would at least know where to start looking to find or reach him. Just yesterday he went with his father (my ex-husband) and got a tattoo. I can't really say anything about it since I have one, too. But I got mine when I was 40!!
A couple of weekends ago when I was away with friends for a much-needed girls weekend, my DH told my son he could stay overnight at a friends house, but that he had to check in the next day so that my husband would know what was going on. Well, you guessed it, my DS didn't call, and was unreachable by cell phone. This was the proverbial straw for my DH after we've been putting up with a bunch of stupid @$%* courtesy of my son. Well, my son finally shows up at home with his father in tow to find my husband changing the locks on the front door! He, with his father present, got an earful from my DH. And when I finally reached him by cell phone, he got another earful from me.
Bottom line, I guess, to this long story, is that you have to choose your battles, and you have to be firm and consistent. Eventually, after much prayer and graying hair on your part, it will finally sink in and they will come around. At least that's what we're hoping for - are we in denial?
Well i agree with you one that said why do parents buy kids cars? They are so spoiled and they don't take care of any thing they have to pay for. my neighbor girl got a car for getting PG at 18 cause they said she will need a car to get to the Dr.
well with in two weeks she wrecked it and what did they do they went and got here another one.
I am with the sheriffs dept and some of the kids that get introuble are the ones that the parents do every thing for and all i hear is my dad wil get me out. What they need to do is leave them in there may be they will get the message.
when i was growing up if i wanted any thing i worked for it and u bet i took car of it. If they have to work for it they will maybe take care of stuff better.
I think insisting that he let you know where he is and keeping his space neat is reasonable but I don't think insisting he go to church is going to help. My MIL once said that you raise your kids with the values you want them to have but once they're adults you really can't make them follow your religion or anything (one of the few things the woman has said that makes sense).
He may or may not go back to church at some point but there isn't much you can really do about it and he might go back sooner if you don't push.
well I'll start with the first item posted.... I did the same thing as your son when I graduated (it actually started a few months before graduation) I was testing the limits... (even though I already knew them) It took my Dad to come to me and ask me the question and make one statement, that I was not ready to admit the answer too-even though I knew it. He asked one simple quesiton that changed my thinking/feelings/and thoughts and relieved a lot of stress I was having.
What are you scared of?
It is ok to be scared.
I was freaking out (in my own way that seems to be standard "typical" teenager way) I came from a small school, only 50 in my graduating class. Everyone was going to college and I knew that was what was expected of me, from my parents, family, peers etc.... Well I wasn't ready, I didn't want to go to any type of school, I wanted a break. But at the same time I had no idea what I was going to do and I thought I needed the answer-well come to find out. I didn't have to go to school, it was ok to take time off, and I didn't have to know what i wanted to do (it made a big difference just to hear this) Not sure if this might be part of the problem or not. When my mom found out i think she freaked out a little bit, but my Dad kept her calm.
Now after a four years off of school I am going into my 3rd year of apprenticship through my employer and know that what I am doing will actually benefit me in the future.
The contract is another good idea i think. I had to sign one with my parents after doing simliar things as your son. And if I didn't follow it then I was going to receive a 30 day notice. It was no different than renting a place to live (except rent was a little cheaper!) I was held to the same standards as I have been renting any other place. Keep it clean, pay the bills, etc.....
I might suggest talking to him, just let him know you are there and there isn't pressure to do anything he doesn't want to do. But you respect him and expect the same in return.
Now for the car issuel... I SOOO AGREE!!!
I had to buy my own car and was responsible for all of it. Up until I got my own vehicle I could use my parents vehicle for things I had to attend (music lessons, school events, work, etc..) but if it was just for a night out then I had to find another way. I just don't understand it. I had people in my class that barely graduated but had a new car as soon as they could drive... grrr... oh well, at least I learned to appreciate what I had.
That is all I will say on this issue, I could go on for a day.
Guess i'll sign off now... think one chapter in the novel today is enough for all of you
Before my son even turned 16 we told him that he shouldn't expect to wake up on his birthday and see a car with a bow on top of it in the driveway. We told him that if he kept his grades up and had a job that we would match him dollar for dollar up to a certain amount, seeing that we don't have any trees in our backyard growing $100 bills. If he wanted a car that would cost him more than that amount then he would have to come up with the difference. It was hard for him to see a couple of his friends driving around in new Mustangs, courtesy of Mommy & Daddy, but those kids have already had accidents, and one even got his license suspended for a year for racing. My son, in the meantime, has had a good driving record for the last two years because he doesn't want all of his hard work scrimping & saving to go to waste. He also knows that if he screws up and wrecks his car, he won't be driving ours. We won't reward him for bad behavior & being irresponsible.
It does mean more to you when you have to work for it, IMHO.
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