my friend doesn't even ask. she just tells me i want a so and so cake for my birthday. it's expected. no payment. and i've made 3 cakes over at her house for her family baked, fbct, carved, iced..so she knows exactly what goes into them. this time she wants 2 cakes. one for one day, and another for another day. do i look like a cake fairy? that i can just poof them out out thin air?! for me, i let them know the first year is free, next year you want a cake, you will at least buy the ingredients and i'll bake them at your house.
I love that you bake it at their house - does that mean they clean up too? I may have to do that for friends/family who ask for cakes!!!
yup. while i do my "thang" w the decorating she cleans up the pans and mixing bowls. and she refills my piping bags when i get low on a certain color. works for me! 
I've just started REALLY decorating cakes about 9 months ago & give the cakes I make as gifts for close friends right now. I can't legally sell them, so I chalk it up to good practice. I'm not going to go through the steps of becoming legal in TX because my husband is retiring from the military this year, and we're moving to VA in another month or two - that's where I'll start the venture of becoming a legal business 
Cakes are NOT cheap to make, and my family back home tells me I'm nuts for giving them away, but how can I get better if I'm not practicing? And the requests - I've already had many from friends and family & they've already been told that if I make their cake to consider it their gift. (which is a pretty nice gift considering I'd probably only spend $25 on an actual gift lol) My issue with giving away cakes now is that when I actually do start to charge, I'll probably short change myself because I'm so used to getting nothing but thanks for them. I don't even know where to begin with pricing! If you look at my pics, you'll see that with each cake I get more and more detailed - how do I charge for that? Oi - I guess I'll figure it all out as I go...
Sit yourself down and create a price list:
2 tier round __ __ size - FROM $____
3 tier round __ __ ___ size - FROM $_____
Flowers:
small - $____ per flower
Med. - $
Carved ___ Size
Flavours:
(well you get what I mean)
Now sit them down and just show them the list.
Have them pick out what they want. When they are done give them a discount because they are a "friend".
This should chase away anyone who wants something for nothing.
And if that doesn't work, have something out that you are working on. Tell them you have another 3 more hours before they will be finished and you better get them done. (this tells them there is a lot of time going into your work and also gets them out if they are not serious).
She was flabergasted and proceeded to trash my cakes and tell me they weren't that good to begin with!! SERIOUSLY!!!
Then, since I use cake mixes (doctored of course) she tells me I can not charge professional prices for Betty Crocker cake mixes! WHAT!! I have never hidden the fact that I doctor cake mixes from ANY of my customers. I can not scratch bake so I doctor! Needless to say we are no longer really friends.
Wow. She sounds like a piece of work. Some "friend", huh? 
Sorry if I am hijacking the thread.... but Jason, you seem to know a lot about legality..do you happen to know if it is legal to have your friend or relative purchase the supplies themselves and then make the cake at their home together? Just curious.
The food safety laws in many states specifically exempt you from inspection if you make your products at the customer's home, the exemption is meant for personal chefs but I don't see why it wouldn't apply here. I believe you would even be able to charge for your services in that case, although you may still need a business license and of course liability insurance is a must.
Just a question, is she paying you for your time to come to her house and bake the cake supplies that she purchased? If not, then legality shouldn't even be a question. Since when does our government have any say in how friends get together at one friend's home to bake?
Sorry if I am hijacking the thread.... but Jason, you seem to know a lot about legality..do you happen to know if it is legal to have your friend or relative purchase the supplies themselves and then make the cake at their home together? Just curious.
The food safety laws in many states specifically exempt you from inspection if you make your products at the customer's home, the exemption is meant for personal chefs but I don't see why it wouldn't apply here. I believe you would even be able to charge for your services in that case, although you may still need a business license and of course liability insurance is a must.
Just a question, is she paying you for your time to come to her house and bake the cake supplies that she purchased? If not, then legality shouldn't even be a question. Since when does our government have any say in how friends get together at one friend's home to bake?
They don't, hence the exemption I previously cited. The concern from a food safety perspective is when food is made in an unlicensed kitchen and then sold to someone else in exchange for cash (or supplies, or bartered services, etc).
If you make the cake in your kitchen and sell it to your friend for the cost of ingredients (or the ingredients themselves), that is a commercial transaction and your kitchen must be licensed. But if you go to your friend's house and bake a cake together for compensation (or even bake it yourself using your own supplies or her supplies) then you fall under the personal chef exemption. However, even in the former case the risk of noncompliance is relatively low if you only sell to close friends and family members, do not advertise, and make sure everything is kept under the table with no records.
Of course, if the cake is a gift and no other cash/goods/services change hands, the transaction is not considered commerce and it falls outside the purview of government regulations.
Unless the cake is made with cannabis. 
I love this. I was at the park today with my playgroup and one of the gals I know pretty well asks me to make her daughters birthday cake. A tangled tower nonetheless. I always say yes in person...talk up how great the cake will be and then when I get home I email the person saying how much materials will cost and when I need the $ by. This works better for me then talking money in person. I know I need to grow a pair, but atleast I am asking. LOL
As hard as it is for me, I am learning to say "no". I will do cakes for immediate family and my two best girlfriends - however, everyone else is expected to pay my normal rate (although, sometimes I still make adjustments).
I have learned the hard way that doing these 'free' cakes limited my ability to work on (or accept) cake orders from actual clients.
My problem is the "donations". While I love giving back (and actually do a monthly promotion where 50% of my cupcake sales goes to a charity) it seems like every person under the son asks me to donate this or donate that. It's harder for me to say no to a fundraiser trying to raise money for a child or some cause. Sadly, it's getting to a point where I'm getting angry about it. But, how do you say no to that???
I refuse to make cakes or cupcakes for family or friends for free. I just won't do it. They know they time and cost involved so they don't mind paying.
Again, I get that money changing hands "construes" a business, but, you know what, I just don't care. I won't ever get "caught". I agree with those that said the goverment has better things to do than to go after me if my sister pays me to do cupcakes for her kids party. They don't know how she is paying me. She could say I picked up some stuff for you, whether it is stuff for my kids or supplies, or she could give me money, or take me out to lunch.
Unless big brother has a camera in my house,... and if he did, I would get arrested for other things, not a "black market, underground cake club!" ROTFLMAO! I don't sell to anyone but my sister, brother, mom and dad, and cousins and close friends. I don't see them suing me if they got sick. I have gotten sick on crap they have served me and I have never thought to sue my family for my diarrhea! It just aint gonna happen! I don't sell to strangers, so..whatever.
... Unless big brother has a camera in my house,... and if he did, I would get arrested for other things, not a "black market, underground cake club!" ROTFLMAO! I don't sell to anyone but my sister, brother, mom and dad, and cousins and close friends. I don't see them suing me if they got sick. I have gotten sick on crap they have served me and I have never thought to sue my family for my diarrhea! It just aint gonna happen! I don't sell to strangers, so..whatever.
I was CRACKING up a this!! You're too funny!
@ Caralovescake - be careful what you say around here about selling illegally...there are those who will hunt down your IP address and turn you in! lol
Cara this is so funny! HA! Also, I don't think everyone knows you can't sell cakes. People ask me all the time and I tell them no and say it is illegal and they are shocked! Also, I have mentioned it to people who sell and they are floored. One woman looked visibly shaken! I had ruined her day big time with that news. So not everyone knows!
My problem is the "donations". While I love giving back (and actually do a monthly promotion where 50% of my cupcake sales goes to a charity) it seems like every person under the son asks me to donate this or donate that. It's harder for me to say no to a fundraiser trying to raise money for a child or some cause. Sadly, it's getting to a point where I'm getting angry about it. But, how do you say no to that???
I just tell people that due to time and budget, I have to limit my donations to one organization (which is true). Or that my budget for donations has already been exhausted for the year.
WRONG!!! If my dad changes my oil and I reimburse him for the cost of the oil, that DOES NOT make him a mechanic who is doing business.
We're taking about food safety here, not auto repair. The food safety laws on the books deal with commercial transactions, i.e. one party exchanging food for cash, goods, or services.
It is considered a business when someone is SOLICITING business from the GENERAL PUBLIC.
That's a pretty good definition of what a business is, but we're talking about the definition of a commercial transaction, not a business.
Doing a favor for a friend or relative DOES NOT COUNT.
You are correct that making a cake as a favor to a friend or relative is not a commercial transaction, since there would be no cash, goods, or services changing hands other than the cake.
This is exactly what I was talking about earlier. Misinterpretation of the laws to try to instill fear in others.
As I've said many times before, flying under the radar and only making cakes for close friends and family is a very low risk proposition. No one is fear-mongering here, just stating the facts of the law and the realities of how the laws area interpreted.
I challenge everyone here to call their local health department and ask if they would be in ANY trouble for baking a cake for a friend who then reimbursed them for the ingredients.
Most health departments probably wouldn't bother enforcing the law in that situation, but that doesn't change what the law says. If you made cakes for hundreds of friends a year in exchange for cash, though, you might have an issue.
I think that the idea of doing a period of time once a month or once every six months or however often you want to do it and giving a percentage of your proceeds to a charity is very generous. If I were you I would just tell the next person that asks you to give or donate that I already do donate to charities and I do have to make a living and pay bills so I can not donate to every charity out there. Your heart is in the right place and do not let someone else try to make you feel guilty for not donating to their cause.
If they want to donate to that cause. They could buy a cake from you and give it to the charity of their choice or fundraiser. Let that be their gift, but to expect you to give past your funds and givng already is not fair.
Since the problem you face actually happens to both LEGAL and UNLISCENSED kitchens, that part is TOTALLY IRRELIVANT to your post. Your post was about something we all have faced.
Even when you have a shop, friends expect cheap or free cakes. They think that because you use Betty crocker, that the cake you baked costs $1.50 and another $1.50 for a can of icing. Even if it is 3 tiered, their heads can't get around the fact that it costs more than that. They don't understand the need for cake boards and foils. They think you use a piece of cardboard, and wow, your aluminum foil has a pattern. They don't actually "see" that those little extras are what make your cakes look so much better than home cakes.
Sometimes also, they think that they are doing you a favor- since the cake will be "seen" by other people and you might get orders from it. I've been doing cakes for a long time, and I still get that reaction sometimes. Just don't take it personal- tell them that you enjoy baking but with the prices going up, you can't do it for free anymore. (actually, I used to "blame" it on my husband!- I'd say "matt would kill me if I made anymore free cakes!) Then, they either go to Costco, or they ask you how much would it cost....
Recently I got asked for an affordable cake for 12 people....I say "I have to check my calendar" and lo and behold, I'm booked!" Once they think you are booked up, they'll be wanting to pay you to make those cakes!
Recently I got asked for an affordable cake for 12 people....I say "I have to check my calendar" and lo and behold, I'm booked!" Once they think you are booked up, they'll be wanting to pay you to make those cakes!
I used to take overflows into the place I worked on Fridays. "Overflows" were the extra cookies leftover from that week's cookie orders that I wouldn't hold until Monday. Some Fridays I wouldn't have any overflows, but my fellow co-workers soon began to expect them.
More than once, someone would ask "when are we getting more cookies?" and I'd tell them, "My oven time is now at a premium. As soon as I get a check from you, then I'll reserved some oven time for some cookies for you." I'd then tell them "payment today will give you a baking day 3 weeks from now."
I actually had a couple of people write me a check, but the thing I accomplished was getting people to understand "the freebies are at MY convenience!"
I have a very close friend who always wants a discount!!
IMNTBHO - a real friend would never ask me for a discount.
I buy things from friends, I never ask them for a discount. I pay retail. That's what real friends do. They expect you to earn a living or at the very least not pay for things out of your own pocket.
End of story.
Turn me in ? Lol! For what? Who has proof of anything! That is just pathetic
just to throw in another angle of the legal/selling issue, our county food code is such that all food must be made in a licensed kitchen that is going to be sold or distributed to the public. No money has to exchange hands for it to be an illegal situation.
I've mentioned it before, but they shut down a woman who was purchasing and making hot meals and taking them to the park to feed homeless people. She fed about 300 a week and gave a sack lunch. Her own dime, her own personal mission shut down because of health codes.
If it were a personal party in her own backyard, it wouldn't be a public health issue. The follow up was that she could still distribute food, but it had to be prepackaged or non-hazaradous. the health department didn't make many friends on that PR front.
As for getting hit up for freebies, i got suckered in last month. My cousin's three girls have been to my boy's birthday parties and have ogled the cakes i've made for them, and probably that they get parties in general.
My cousin hasn't really done any parties for her girls birthdays (13/10/7), even though i've offered to help organize and conduct a cupcake decorating party for the middle daughter who has taken a big interest in my cakes in the past, but her mother didn't get organized enough to do it 
So this past month they were actually having a party for the two oldest and she asked me to to the cake. She also said that she wasn't paying for it. To her it was 'in the family' and the same as bringing a bowl of potato salad to a potluck, instead it was a cake. Then she told her girls that I would make them a cake, and sent them to my blog to pick one out. So they called me four times in a row in an hour leaving messages that they wanted the fairy cake. yeahhhhhh....
So I had to have another convo with my cousin and said that if this was a pot luck cake, i'd be bringing a pound cake or sheet cake and present for the girls. Still, "i'm not going to pay for it, I'm family". I really wanted to drop it then and there, but i wanted to do something that made the girls feel special for their first real party.
So they got a cake--but not the two tier fondant fairy cake! And if you could just imagine the thanks I got from them (you can't? yeah i didn't get any either. ) If it comes up again, family pays with a slight discount for their request, if they want a deep discount/for cost then it's bakers choice, and i get to try something new or what time allows for. If they want it for free...then they can taste the freedom of an empty cake plate.
Still, "i'm not going to pay for it, I'm family".
Unbelievable!! 
so she just figures that everyone "took her to raise" as my elders used to say. 
Another example of those kind of relatives who think "family" is a one way street. They are supposed to be treated like some diva because they're family, but they dont' seem to figure they have any responsibility to "do unto others". It's all a one-way street to them.
Big sigh!
@ Caralovescake - be careful what you say around here about selling illegally...there are those who will hunt down your IP address and turn you in! lol
I realize this was said in jest, but if you are operating illegally you do have to be careful about what you post on your blog, web site, facebook page, and public forums. There have been instances where health dept investigators have done web searches and busted illegal bakers because they talk about their sales (or worse, solicit buyers) online. The same is true for posting character cakes, as there are several companies that specialize in searching the web for copyright infringement on behalf of copyright owners.
You probably don't have to worry about it too much here on CC since most people are anonymous, but if you include your contact info on your web site or FB you can be easily identified.
just to throw in another angle of the legal/selling issue, our county food code is such that all food must be made in a licensed kitchen that is going to be sold or distributed to the public. No money has to exchange hands for it to be an illegal situation. I've mentioned it before, but they shut down a woman who was purchasing and making hot meals and taking them to the park to feed homeless people. She fed about 300 a week and gave a sack lunch. Her own dime, her own personal mission shut down because of health codes. If it were a personal party in her own backyard, it wouldn't be a public health issue. The follow up was that she could still distribute food, but it had to be prepackaged or non-hazaradous. the health department didn't make many friends on that PR front.
I agree that it wasn't a very good PR move, but you can also look at it from the perspective of the city's liability. If 300 people got sick because of food made in an unlicensed kitchen, and the city knew about it but didn't enforce their food safety regulations, the city would be on the hook for compensatory and possibly punitive damages in the case of any potential lawsuits arising out of that situation. To pay those damages, the city would have to cut services or raise taxes.
It's the city's job to enforce food safety regulations uniformly to protect public health. The woman making hot meals could have worked with local soup kitchens or homeless shelters, since they would already have the necessary licensing and inspection in place.
I think one thing we can all agree on is that municipalities, counties, and states do a lousy job of communicating what the rules are regarding food safety, especially relating to making food at home.
My philosophy is that I do NOT give away for free what I do for a living. IF you happen to get a free cake from me, it's likely that you did NOT ask for it. Because if you did, I'd probably say no.
For every cake I do for free, that's one cake order I couldn't take at full price for that week. I am one person. I have a limited amount of time. Doing a cake for someone at a discount or for free ties up my time and prevents me from taking paying orders. So technically it costs me a LOT more than just ingredients. It could cost me ingredients plus a $300 order!
If you are in business to make money, you need to keep that in mind.
Look at it this way. You wouldn't even think of asking your friends to give up a days pay at their work to come and landscape your yard for you because you didn't feel like paying a landscaper. Same idea...
Get perspective and you'll find you aren't such a pushover.
Doing a cake for someone at a discount or for free ties up my time and prevents me from taking paying orders. So technically it costs me a LOT more than just ingredients. It could cost me ingredients plus a $300 order!
A great example of "lost opportunity cost"!
The best policy I have heard is, "if I offer, it's free. If you ask, it's gonna cost you."
Now I feel really bad cause I asked a legal question about cakes for friends and family. But only after I expressed the same concern as the op! I can't believe the looks people give when I tell them how much ingredients cost! And that is just cost....part of me can't wait to become a legal cottage baker, but the other part is not at all excited to deal with all the money stuff when it comes to friends and family. Thanks to some of these cc posts at least ill be a little more prepared! I really cannot believe the attitude of some the people you are all talking about on his thread! Everyone thinks they are so entitled! That is aggravating.
I guess I don't have much of a backbone, because I've given away too many cakes to count! 
I finally have a fix--I went to FatCow and created a website. (FatCow is fairly user-friendly, there is 24-hr. customer real-person-to-talk-to support, and it's free!) I posted pictures of several of our cakes, and the price of the cake next to each picture. I also posted our pricing guide on the website.
Now when somebody asks about a cake, I give them our web address and ask that they go to the website, look at the cakes to see if there is a cake they might like, then ask that they give us a call when they are ready for us to work up a design for them. Since doing this, nobody has asked if we could make a free cake for them! 
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