Iâm starting a new thread to give everyone a level playing field.

If you read this thread, please note that I cannot update the original post after a period of time. However, I will check the thread frequently, and be sure to BOLD any suggestions that come in.

Also, Iâd like to thanks the entire CC community for a respectful (albeit lively) discussion of the pans. I welcome any one to try their recipes and see what works for them.

The best thing to do is to test the pans for yourself.

Here is information about the 2 pans:

Place of Manufacture:

FD: Made in China
ML: Made in USA

Method of Construction:

FD: formed aluminum
ML: welded aluminum

Pan Finish:

FD: matte
ML: mirror

Sorry, everyone, I have been trying to get you this info, but am constantly locked out.

After baking a scratch, butter-based white cake at 300 F degrees on regular oven heat, here is what my subjective opinion is:

Baking time for 6â pan: 51 minutes. Internal temperature: 184.1 F
Crumbs on Crust:
FD: C
ML: B

Square Corners and Edges after baking: This was a problem at 300 degrees â I found I had poorer quality corners with both.
FD: C
ML: B

Quality of Pan:
FD: B+ tiny sharp nicks on edges
ML: A smooth edges, no visible flaws

Ease of Removal from Pan (flour and shortening pan prep)
FD: A
ML: A both were great

Ease of Handling Pans: both were comfortable to grip, level, and handled well, even with oven mitts
FD: A
ML: A

Ease of cleaning (hand wash):
FD: A easy and quick
ML: C difficult to clean corners (suggestions were made by CC members to use a toothpick or small brush)

Ease of cleaning (Dishwasher): both came out pristine
FD: A
ML: A

Availability of Other Shapes (comma, hexagon, etc.)
FD: A+
ML: C-

My conclusions (my opinion only):

FD had a better bottom crust, but continued to have problems with crumbs on the corners and sides. After speaking with Greg Skinner, an owner of FD, I used a very thin, flexible spatula to very gently work the edges of the FD pan. I still had crumbing problems with FD.

I used a butter knife on the ML, and had fewer crumbs. ML does not perform very well at the lower temperature, the crust is very soft, but had stable sides.

Suggestion: Bake ML at 320-350, and I will continue to experiment to find an optimal temperature for the FD. The two pans do not do well baked together, since they require different optimal baking temperatures.

Thanks everyone!

Edited for clarity.

Ok, some photos:

And this gives a a sense of the crumbs. The FD has a better crust at the lower temperature, but, still, I had crumb issues. I am going to try a boxed mix next at 275 degrees.

this might be a dumb question but in the pic which pan is which?

Yes, an excellent question! FD on left, ML on right.

Sorry- I have been kicked off so many times that my posts are getting shorter and shorter.

Both pans seem pretty sucky to me. I wouldn't want to have to deal with either of these cakes - too many crumbs!

Very interesting thread. I use FD just b/c those are the only ones available to me in my local cake stores. You'd think a city the size of Columbus would have lots of cake stores and a large variety. Not a chance.

My cakes come out perfect with FD's and I don't even run a knife along the edge to loosen them. I grease and flour the bottoms and sides, remove from the oven, let cool slightly, and shake them to verify they are completely loose. It's amazing how nicely they pop out. Properly greased and floured, my cakes come out perfect and the pans are basically free of all cake.

petit-four
Thank you so much for your thorough examinations. I know those of us who have been wondering the difference between the pans really appreciate it!!! Thank you so much for your hard work!!!

Thank you for redoing your test, this is coming from someone in the market to buy a whole new set of pans I wasn't sure which way to go. Your thoroughness, time, effort and literally unbiased opinion is MUCH appreciated!

Thanks everyone. I've been trying to write a quick thank you, but I keep getting kicked off.

FD's owner also suggested to me on the phone to try baking at 275.

I'm having problems with CC this morning too- keeps telling me something or other about a "fatal error". oh well. thanks again for the pics and comparison!

Thank you PF for your stubborness (hehe) to show us the difference! I appreciate it! -- but then I am a stubborn person too and we get things done no matter what or how long it takes! Thanks again!

I have a couple of magic line pans and LOVE THEM!! The corners and edges always come out perfectly. I use amplified mixes and bake at 325. The finish is always a perfect, light shade and the tops are usually perfectly flat. I'm going to slowly start replacing all of my Wilton pans with ML pans.

I appreciate the comparrison - I've been eyeing the FD pans - I love the name!

Thank you but a question for

#1 did you bake each cake separately- to give each pan a good comparison.

FD baked at 325

ML bake at 325 to 350 (325 gives less of a dome cake)

#2 - do you oven temp. to make sure the oven is baking a temperature. Some ovens can be off and due to the difference in material it can make a difference.

Just asking because I have FD, love them. I bake them at 325. Cakes come out easy for me and I have very little crumbs.

I also have a ML (which like too) which I bake at 325 to preventing dome of my cakes. Cakes come out good, very little crumbs.

I need to buy a few more pans and for my I will be purchasing FD.

Again thank you for posting your opinion.

JustSweet: Thank you for the questions.

I have baked 4 different scratch recipes in the pans. The first at 350. ML was fine, FD crumbled. I never posted those results, because I wanted to give it another try.

I baked again, 340. That is the post that was deleted by CC. The ML was level, sharp corners. FD did well, but crowned, and I'd have to give ML slightly higher marks. I baked again at 320, FD did well, but again, ML had fewer crumbs and sharper corners.

At this point, I had contact with FD's owners, who suggested going down to 300, even 275. The results from the 300 test are page 1 of this thread. I'm currently baking a mix cake, just to give a comparison.

Thanks for sharing your experience with FD. I hope all CC members can find the pans that work best for them -- my intention all along!

As for me, honestly, my scratch recipes seem to work better in ML.

Oh, yes, and I double-checked the oven temp with a thermometer.

Thanks for the info! I personally like to be a well informed consumer, and don't have the time (all these little people running around) to test every product that I'm in the market for! You've made my life much simpler!

Thanks Janebrophy.

Ok, thanks for everyone's patience: here are the results of an oil-based MIX (DH white), baked at 275:

ML did well, and I think so did FD. There were hardly any crumbs on either. And here is where Greg Skipper (FD owner) and I agree: with a mix, the FD took 5 minutes less at 275. Do note though, this was the only time (mix, 275) that this was true.

Conclusion: Bake at low temps (275, 300) for FD with a MIX. For butter-based scratch, I would strongly suggest ML.

So, for me, ML is the best choice....but choose and compare for yourself.

Edited to add: FD on left, ML on right

That's a good looking cake. At 275 what was the overall baking time?

Thanks,
Mike

Here's another Q for ya, or anyone. Have you ever tried baking in a water bath? You know like you would do for a custard. My kitchen won't be operable till the weekend sometime. I'll give it a shot then if no body has tried it before.

Mike

Hi Mike -- for 6" square (2" pan, filled half way) the FD took 54 minutes at 275. THe ML took 59 minutes (white cakes, mix).

When I did the scratch cake at 340, ML took 38 minutes. FD took 42. That was a chocolate fudge, scratch.

Here's the scratch cakes at 340: (FD left, ML right).

As for the water bath, no, I've never done that, but I've heard of them. I'd love to know how it works out if you do it!

Oh, and I read Greg's post in the "old" forum. Yes, I agree that FD is shorter then ML at 275 -- sure -- but since you are baking a lot longer anyway? Nearly an hour for a 6" cake?

Do note at all other temps ML was faster, or the same as FD.

Edited to add last 4 sentences.

Thanks. If I'm up & running this weekend I'll try the WB. I'm almost thinking that the center, and the outside should be about the same doneness. It all depends on if I feel like drywalling, or not. LOLOL

Mike

OK Mike -- good luck with your whole project!

I'd like to clarify something about baking times:

Greg Skipper wrote: "However, if a baker can save several minutes off their bake time AND bake at a lower temperature, that translates into substantial dollars in your pocket and creates greater profitability for each person."

I saw Greg was browsing the forum, and sent him a PM, and would like to share a little with you:

"Hi Greg --

Yes, Petit-four again. ....when I called you this afternoon, what I meant was yes, FD did bake faster at 275 (and at 275 only) than ML -- but the entire baking time was much, much longer. From 38 minutes to 55. As you know, that's not helping out with the savings in electricity at all. ..."

I also wanted to share with CC members, that Greg Skipper told me that the majority of his testing was done with mixes, and that he himself tested the pans using mixes. He also mentioned that his pans are used in commercial baking; as CC members know, most commercial, large-production baking uses vegetable oils and hydrogenated fats.

I stand by my conclusion that FD pans are a possible good choice, but don't work as well for CC members who use traditional butter-based scratch recipes. Greg himself indicated that FD pans require the use of that pan only, due to the lower temps.

I hope this information can assist CC members who are looking for square pans. I regret Heath and Jackie have still not restored my original post.

I know this ight sound stupid and dont shoot me down for saying it but doesnt anyone line their tins with baking paper anymore? I could bake in a saucepan (and have in my swiss diamond) and as long as i have lined the vessel i get sharp perfect edges every time.
It also makes it incredibly easy to get cakes out of the tins.
As we cant get either tin on Oz i am not going to enter into any discussion on the pans but i just thought people might like to think of that as an option.