I did a kid's birthday cake for a friend's twin boys', and of course she wanted a "friend price". We're talking 2 layers of 11"x 15" made into a NASCAR track. $60 covers the cost of the materials alone! So I made the cake with cake mix instead of from scratch, which I normally would do but never specified with my friend, and they were none the wiser. heheheh...

Of course I would NEVER do this for a regular customer, especially if we had specifically discussed doing a cake from scratch. I know a lot of people use cake mix and do great add-ons (which I've never tried), but personally I MUCH prefer a cake from scratch.

This being said, I was wondering - does anyone ever give a cake mix option to the customers who don't want to pay what you think the cake is worth?

I don't tell anyone what I use to bake my cakes. (I use mixes by the way!). You get what you get. If they like my cake, it doesn't matter how I make it. I doctor my mixes anyway, so I don't consider them to just be mixes. If someone asks, I just say it is my special recipes, I don't share.

I have yet for someone to complain.

Stephanie

I don't usually ask outright......however I have found that most people ( if they are truly picky about a scratch cake) will know to ASK. I mostly do weddings as thats where the money is ...plus I just love the thrill of weddings. Many brides that I know are more concerned with the look and presentation. But if they are really INTO cake a few have asked ...were they scratch or mix and I tell them I can do either...I also tell them that it might make their cost a tiny bit less (to use mix) as in my opinion cake mixes are more predictable...but not much as the majority of cake cost is in the decorating. I truly make that call on my own. Many times when someone is more interested in the dollar than anything else and I know the budget is tight ...I just use mixes. I add extras and have never had one complaint. If the customer comes in talking about scratch or can you make an authentic Italian creme cake ...then I know that it is to be a scratch job.

I would never make an option like that....... but then I usually make my cakes from a doctored mix....... Your cakes are "HOMEMADE".... that is all they need to know..... and as long as they like them what is the difference ?

I use mixes with a special twist, but never tell anyone. It tastes better than what they can make at home, but more than the taste is the decorations that they pay for.

I forgot to mention ...your race car cake is ADORBLE!!!! I really like it! I truly feel that it is on the consumer to ask if they want it to make sure it is scratch... just as people who are very concerned let you know if they want vegan or diabetic.

I tell my clients EXACTLY what they are getting.

I make all my cakes from scratch and all curds,buttercreams,mousses, etc are from scratch as well. I also have a set of pans,mixing bowls and attachments that have never been used for nuts, dairy etc. in case I have a client that is concerned with allergies.

If they want "cheaper" they can use a local bakery or go to a supermarket bakery.

If you are proud of what you make why is it important to keep the fact that you use mixes a secret from your clients?? I've never understood that.

To me, if you use a cake mix but doctor it up then I would never say "I can do a cake mix cake for you". The reason is by adding more things it really is a scratch mix but you use pre measured dry ingredients.

I've never had anyone think my cake mix cakes are just a box cake mix. They don't taste a thing like them by the time I'm done with them.

I do not "keep mine a secret"....I love both types of cake myself...to me box mixes are fluffy and delicious and scratch cakes are usually more dense and maybe a little more flavorful in most instances. I simply do not tell what isnt asked ...if someone doesn't ask... I make the call. If someone really and truly is concerned they will let you know.If they name a flavor they want in 3 seconds and then talk for 45 minutes about the design...they do not care either way usually. I use real butter..sour cream...milk.. etc even in my mixes so....i dont see an issue. But as I said...if they seem to care at all I give them an option. When ordering from most any eatery establishments....does anyone ask the process of making the food? I also feel justified in that I may charge more that the walmart...but my ingredients icing and techniques are different than what you get there...I also do tastings and delivery..they dont do fondant...and as far as the bakeries... I am not that much different in price. But I offer services and carved cakes etc...that they do not. In the end...I say to each his own

I tell them I use a cake mix as an ingredient, adding my own touch.

I keep getting repeat business because people love the way my cakes taste--they say it's the most moist cake they've ever had. Most don't know (or probably care) that my cakes start with a boxed mix and then get "doctored". If they ask I tell them that, but most never ask. Once they've tasted whatever my recipe is they are very happy with it, so I guess that's all that matters to them.

Because in my opinion cake mix cakes are a totally different creature from scratch cake I do offer a choice. I discuss the difference with my clients and we decide what they want. MOST times they choose the Dr'd cake mix. Not becasue of price but because of what they expect when they have cake. I do the same with buttercream.

I have actually provided a amazingly delicious scratch cake to people with simple tastes who didnt like scratch cake....I am dropping out of this discussion....considering that I have been around cakecentral for a few years and seen that this is one of those topics that never comes to a peaceful ending...and in the end ...it never will..lol..I suppose I will concede that I am probably very liberal in the making of cakes as I am more the "decorator" than the lover of baking...although it is nice when they come together.

[quote]I'm not putting down the use of cake mixes but just wondered why it wasn't something that was told to your clients right out. If they are moist and delicious why not let the customer know exactly what they are paying for? Don't you like knowing what you are buying when you buy something?

I guess the "if they don't ask don't tell" kind of thing puts me off just a bit.

Sorry, I did the quote thing wrong.....................

Sorry, here's the corrected copy:

[quote]I'm not putting down the use of cake mixes but just wondered why it wasn't something that was told to your clients right out. If they are moist and delicious why not let the customer know exactly what they are paying for? Don't you like knowing what you are buying when you buy something?

I guess the "if they don't ask don't tell" kind of thing puts me off just a bit.


I am a stay-at-home mom who bakes out of my home. I do not advertise and get customers through word of mouth or because someone has had my cake at a party and asked the hostess about it, etc. This is a new venture for me that began as a hobby and took shape when the friends and family I was baking for had their friends and family ask me to bake for them. If someone calls me and says, "I just had your cake at so and so's party and loved it--could you possibly make a graduation cake for my son" that I need to say to that person--"Sure, I'd love to make a cake for you, and by the way, do you realize I am using a boxed mix that's doctored?"

If someone asks about my recipe I am always honest and tell them it starts with a mix. I don't think I am "not letting the customer in on what they're paying for" by not offering that info if they don't ask me first. By the way, I am notorious for "undercharging" for my cakes, so it's not like they're paying $200 for a 1/4 sheet and I'm giving them an inferior product.

In 25 years, I can count on one hand how many times I've had someone ask me. To those who have asked, I have responded with "One, you couldnt' afford me if I made everything from scratch, and Two, I use the same commercial mixes that are used by other bakeries and caterers." (Because I see them buy them when we are both picking up our orders at the Food Distributors, that's how I know.)

When I go to any restaurant, they don't tell you if the beef is ground fresh in their kitchen or if it's shipped in frozen. You don't know if they are kneading the dough for the rolls themselves or if they are popping the frozen dough in the oven.

They like my cakes the way they are (I actually tried changing it and my official taste testers shot it down fast!!) so I see no need to change it. And if the client likes the taste, what difference does it make?

As someone pointed out on this site a long time ago, a mix is "premeasured dry ingredients".

It doesn't make one way right or wrong ..... it's whatever works for you and whatever makes your business a success.

I wasn't implying that your product was inferior.

I was just curious about the question.

I've read many threads about how wonderful cake mix cakes taste and that customers give "rave" reviews. I wondered why then all the secrecy and why customers aren't told their cakes are made using box mixes that have been enhanced. I've also wondered why, if people like the taste of doctored boxed mix cakes why in the world they would be offered "cheaper" than something from scratch. It doesn't take that much longer to bake from scratch vs. boxed.

It wasn't my intention to revive the same old argument of scratch vs. cake mix but rather to find out about why all the secrecy when using mixes. Do you think that clients would want to pay less for a cake made using a mix?

OK, I know I said I was ducking out but that is one thing I would kind of like to address. YES I do believe that people think they are buying some surreal thing when it is a wedding cake. I believe it is one of the few times in food service of any kind that looks supercedes taste...(not that either should be bad) but sometimes I see people pay for nothing more than a logo..where does that make something superior?...of course it sounds loving and painstaking to say "all from scratch"...but sometime I have paid 40.00 for some knickknack in cracker barrels giftshop then went to walmart and found it for 15.00. Same exact item. Same brand ...everything. But it looked so cute the way it sat in that little country looking gift shop ...Yes, we pay for ambiance...part of marketing.

I do believe that its bad business to say...yanno this here beauty is really just an ordinary thing out of a box?...that somehow degrades all the decorating. I dont feel that it makes it any less of an art...but some little gals who eat nothing but McDonalds and dont have sophisticated tastes still want to feel pampered. They want fancy...Why do some people say "enrobed in chocolate" instead of dipped in it? It SOUNDS good. I think italian meringue bc never looks as smooth as pure crisco bc. I also prefer the taste of pure butter bc ...but never get to use it much because it doesnt pipe well.If someone knows the difference and or cares they will let you know. I think some who are more into the culinary aspect feel that we who are more into the decorating aspect are somehow bastardizing the craft. I feel we might all be in need of business before too many years due to the rental dummys.

I'm definately more of a "decorator"...in fact, I do not technically "offer" flavors. Most people buy cakes from me because they want some cool 3D thing in which case honestly flavor is secondary. Most of them know not to even ask for fillings because they know they are getting some kind of weird shape anyway. I do doctor my cake mix but I use cake mix because its predictable and people like it and since its "not broke" I don't plan to fix it.

Now if anyone asks for something other than a basic flavor I know to make it from scratch...for instance I have a carrot cake coming up and it will be from scratch. I also have a wedding cake coming up where they want authentic Italian cannoli cake and carrot cake and that will be scratch as well.

However most of my cakes end up being for parties, and they mostly just care what the cake looks like (some forget to even mention a flavor, I just run "vanilla" by them and they are cool with that), and a moist vanilla cake that tastes good is just a bonus...customer is happy and it works for me as well.

"I feel we might all be in need of business before too many years due to the rental dummys."

I've thought the same thing....but..I think those of us that can create and not charge ridiculous amounts of money will still be in business.

I think that if people can still buy creations that "mirror" the kind of stuff that the expensive"pros" turn out will they will spend the money.

I do tell my clients that it is the decorating...the sugar work..that makes their cake one of a kind. It still takes the same amount of time to create a sugar flower whether it will be put on a dummy or a real cake.

I hope you are correct becca....I have wondered about getting into the ground floor on some of that...renting dummy cakes...but hope that pure tradition will keep that from happening as well as folks like you said..wanting a "one of a kind". I usually tell people something similar...when they approach me with a line like ( and I got this yesterday from a guy at a wedding I did) he kinda sidled up to the cake table and says . "Ill call you when I have my wedding"..then .."how much does a cake like that cost?"....I reply...about 7-$800.00, he looks at me kinda funny and says..."I don't want one like that". I said... Well we do them smaller and with less gumpast work...and you could just tell that he couldnt believe ANY cake was worth that kinda $...I nicely at this point refer them to Wal-mart or one of my friends who is still in the practice stages wanting to do a first wedding cake.

Edited to add...Also on the cake dummys...I really dont want to see it go that way....i think that it will take much of the fun out of it for me..it will still look awesome...but I love it when one looks so cool and people are amazed that it is really a cake!

well to me a cake mix is better then homemade boxes you can do so much more i know i did the taste test compare try it plus box is sooooo much cheaper then home made [/b]

Here is my resoning for not telling. It is not because I am not proud of what I make, on the contrary. What has happened with me: I know a very picky woman who is very careful about what she eats. SHe was commenting on a cake that she ordered from a local bakery and how she was disappointed that they used mixes. This conversation occured at a party where I brought a cake. She could not put the cake down, ate 2 or 3 pieces (while on a diet, unheard of by this woman!) Had I said the cake was a mix, she probably wouldn't have even tried it!

So the reason I don't tell is because I don't like the negative stigma attached with mix cakes. I would not lie if asked directly though. I did taste tests with scratch vs mix and the mix cakes won out each time! I also use mixes because I am a stay at home mom without a lot of extra money, and ingredients for mixes are much cheaper.

However, I do think it is each to their own! Some of us are good with fondant, some with BC, and some with scratch cakes (not I) and some with mix. FInd what works for you


Stephanie

I make all of my cakes from scratch. I advertise that and charge more because of it. ( I also use eggs and milk from local farms, fair trade sugar and chocolate, no artificial flavors or colors etc.) I can make a scratch cake that mix eaters marvel at. That is my schtick. I do mostly weddings, where people buy "once in a lifetime" sorts of things, so I have never really had too much problem getting my higher than average prices.

That said, I did just make a wedding cake for a couple from a mix. The groom has a litany of food sensitivities, and his Mom said he could eat Duncan Hines..So doctored non-dairy Duncan Hines it was rather than try to reinvent the wheel.

To me it is a bit dishonest to call a mix cake "homemade" It's kind of like making tacos from the El Paso Kit and calling them homemade just because you add your own hamburger. That however is how most Americans eat, and that is what most Americans want to pay for as well, so it is a perfectly viable business model.

Whether you use scratch or mix...
If you are making decorated cakes you are charging for the art way more than for the ingredients. This may be the cause for so many people undercharging.

As for the people who charge what seems to be astronomical prices, they most likely are masters at their craft.

I will use myself for instance... I have been creating sugar art for 30 years and certainly don't expect to make beginners wages. My customers also don't expect to pay beginners prices for my work. In the job market beginners don't get paid what highly experienced people make. As with any job the more experience the more money you can and should make.
I have had customers (usually men) make comment about my prices and I have retorted... "and what do you do for a living and how many years experience do you have?" Ah-haha, that usually gets to men!

mpc