OMG! I was just over on the Wilton site and a poor girl is doing 48 6" 2 layer scratch Red Velvet cakes with cream cheese frosting and pecans for - $500 total! This after she got a lot of advice to charge $20-$25 min per cake!
Why do some decorators feel obligated to under charge so vastly?
We all have done that at one time. And all will learn to charge what we are worth soon enough. I am one still learning.
I too am guilty. I cringe when it comes to telling someone a price, so I way under charge. I think alot of people feel like their work isn't worth what it really is worth.
And I thought I was undercharging! I know the feeling and I'm trying to get over that habit too. I always undercharge and hope that that cake will lead to other orders....but that does not always happen.
Its taken me years to finally charge enough for my cakes (and still there are those who charge more than me, and say I should charge more for certain designs).... I guess it comes to a point when you are up late doing your best and using up all your weekend and you look at the money and you are like "This is SO not worth it" and I guess its when you start getting sick of it that you decide to raise prices or not do it at all.
I love decorating... however, with three boys and a fourth on the way and a part time job and other things, I don't have time to decorate cakes unless its actually helping boost our income a little bit. Which, I'm not rich...but its nice, it helps buy the extras for the kids and etc so that the family budget can stay where its supposed to.
I have made cakes for my firneds and family for some time and have been asked to do a shower cake. It is a 2 tier i rolled fondant with bears, a train and a hand made drum kit. I have started my planning process but it is going to take me some time. I have never charged before any suggestions?
prterrell wrote:
This after she got a lot of advice to charge $20-$25 min per cake!
What I want to know, who has the guts to give such horrible advice for such a large order?
Side note to Kitagrl - - - OMG Four boys - - - four, seriously four? I had one child, a boy and at times it was too much, but four 
and just look at the great work you do!!!!!!! Four boys, I just can't get over it.....
Now back to the subject at hand........we ought to tar and feather the bad advice giver. Hopefully you turned the pecan cake lady onto CC. But then again, I understand if you don't - I like holding this site as my little secret also.
Side note to Kitagrl - - - OMG Four boys - - - four, seriously four? I had one child, a boy and at times it was too much, but four and just look at the great work you do!!!!!!! Four boys, I just can't get over it.....
Side note back.... Yep I have a 6 yo, 4 yo, 2 yo, and an "oops" on the way who has also been ascertained to be male. 
I have a husband who helps around the house and watches the boys to help out, and I use alot of time at night after the boys go to bed to do most of my decorating. And yeah that's why, if you remember my threads a couple weeks ago...why I am not interested in taking up gumpaste flowers yet. HA!
I can relate with the undercharging,.. however every time I try and charge a 'fair' price here in STL... people squak about it. For example: I have someone that wants an 8" MMF covered snickerdoodle cake. It is for a Partylite Candle Consultant and they want it done as a pillar candle type cake and then add text and originally she wanted gumpaste roses and ivy trailing the side. (I did one in my gallery and they just wanted to add words.) I computed the cake at $30 with the MMF icing and then said $15 for the roses and ivy making it $45. There was silence on the other end of the phone. I tried then to explain that the roses were gumpaste and that it takes a bit of time to do each of them and that the material isn't cheap. I then offered to loan her the roses that were on my original cake as they're on toothpicks and can easily be pulled out. I also explained that those were my first ever roses (not that great) and I had just put them on my candle cake for a bit of decoration as opposed to something plain (and if you read my description you'll read that I was trying to hide a horrible bubble that kept forming under my fondant.) It was originally just a cake for a friend. Then today in the mail I get the 'logo' she wants on it with the text. Her logo is the pink Breast Cancer Ribbon with 'Hugs of Hope' for the text. I got an idea and e-mailed her a suggestion of having the ribbons go around the sides of the cake with leaves all around the base, and the text on top with the candle and forego the roses. I'll have the MMF made anyway and there will be some leftover for sure, so keep it simpler. She has not responded yet so I don't know what the verdict is. What do you all think that price should be?... I was going to try for $35.
I guess people think you don't have to do much timewise to get these cakes done... ha! Mixing, baking, icing, making MMF, coving a cake, cutting lettering, making shape,... it's all done in a matter of minutes so to pay someone $35 for a cake that you can go buy a box of cake mix for $1 and a can of frosting... guess they think it's all profit!
OK, I'm done venting! (for tonight!) Thanks! 
- Paula
mjs4492 wrote:
well, just out of curiosity, what do you charge for a 6" cake?
Well normally with out anything special like cream cheese frosting and pecan nuts and such a large order - 25 cakes - whew - it would be $2.50 per slice. I live in a metro area that can sustain decent prices. The order before the pricey ingredients would be $500. I would have to take the calculations for the pecans and cream cheese and adjust accordingly. Plus a bump the the size of the order. And OMG if she had to transport them that is another story.
I guess people think you don't have to do much timewise to get these cakes done... ha! Mixing, baking, icing, making MMF, coving a cake, cutting lettering, making shape,... it's all done in a matter of minutes so to pay someone $35 for a cake that you can go buy a box of cake mix for $1 and a can of frosting... guess they think it's all profit!
Yes they do! I have relatively new sister in law who checked out my website and prices out of curiosity (she lives in another state) and she emailed that I was "quite the entrepeneur" (sp?). Which to me sounded like she thought I was charging astounding prices for my cakes.
People don't realize that for some of my 3D stuff, once I buy a nice sturdy wooden cake circle and the ingredients and especially the fondant, I can spend $40 just on a cake to serve 40 or so...and that doesn't count the 6-8 hours of work put into it.
Kitagrl wrote:
People don't realize that for some of my 3D stuff, once I buy a nice sturdy wooden cake circle and the ingredients and especially the fondant, I can spend $40 just on a cake to serve 40 or so...and that doesn't count the 6-8 hours of work put into it.
Ditto 
Why would anyone do that much work for $500? That is nuts!
well, just out of curiosity, what do you charge for a 6" cake?
It depends on what kind of cake it is and how it is decorated.
For the order she described - 48 cakes (I bake from home, so I am so not set up to do this many cakes at once - I just don't have the space - so I would never have taken this order to begin with) - I would have quoted them $1500. The ingredients alone are going to be expensive, plus since it's such a large order, you'll be spending more time on the order than you normally would for a single order. PLUS when you look at how many that will feed: 384-480 if you did a per slice charge of $2.50 that comes to $960-$1200, which is a heck of a lot more than the $500 she's charging.
prterrell wrote:
This after she got a lot of advice to charge $20-$25 min per cake!
What I want to know, who has the guts to give such horrible advice for such a large order?
Ok. I'm confused. $20-$25 PER cake comes to $960-$1344 total, and that is the absolute MINIMUM people were telling her to charge! They were saying that she should charge at least that much, but an even higher price for the total order would be better. How is that bad advice?
And here comes Debi round the bend with calculator in hand!
48 six-inch cakes will use slightly less than 48 cake mixes, so let's say 45 for simplicity sake.
I use 7 mixes per 100 guests, so 45 mixes will serve approx 650 guests.
650 servings x my a la carte wedding price of $2.50 per serving = $1625. Divided by 48 cakes = approx $34 per cake. Plus the PITA factor in transporting 48 itty bitty cakes. Plus the extra cost for premium ingredients like cream cheese and pecans!!!
If I assume these are centerpiece cakes so there will be one cake per table. Assume round tables that seat 8 guests .... She's really expecting 384 guests? And she's buying enough cake to serve 650?????
I've said it before .... the problem with this "oh it's so much cheaper!" idea is that they end up buying MUCH more cake than they actually need!
I wish I could take credit for this idea, but let's all sell our cakes at the RIGHT price of $1500 and up, then just hire this chic to make them for us for $500. Lots of profit - zero work! Whatta deal!
I really hate that I logged on here today to listen at the pity party you all are throwing for the "poor girl" who is "nuts". I AM the poor girl.
Not everyone lives in areas where you can charge $25 for a 6 inch cake. That would never fly in the rural, dirt road town with a population of about 2000 people who I was quoting this to.
I am no fool. I sat down and calculated the ingredients for the cakes. I was more than doubling my money, as I could get 3 six inch cakes per my recipe for red velvet cake. Do you normally charge $75 for a red velvet cake?? I was getting 3 per recipe.
I wasn't to do anything for the cakes but put a shell border and one rose on the top of each. The pecans for the layers were to be provided by the bride.
Some of us do what we can with where we live. You all should feel blessed that you can truly get what you are worth to do what you do. Some of us have to get what we can and take joy in what we create.
Lastly, I feel a need to let you know that I don't want or need your pity. No, you can't hire me to bake anything for you. I'm not a "girl" who needs your guidance. I am a full time nurses assistant, a wife, a mother of 3, a full time college student with a 3.8 gpa, and cake decorating is a hobby on the side. I start nursing school in August, and my life is just fine.
I am on vacation right now celebrating my anniversary, and specifically chose a hotel with a wireless internet connection just so I could browse CC during our down time, and this thread has really pissed me off.
Sometimes, CC really gets on my nerves.
Guilty as charged. If you enjoy what you are doing and how much you make for it, then that is definately your own business. Kudos to you for wearing so many hats and doing a great job with all of it.
Sorry to have given a sour taste during your vacation.
Probably a good reminder to all of us to watch what we say. I know I have customers that check out this site for ideas, and they would be extremely upset to find threads about them. Its a growing site with alot of participation.
Cassandra, I am sorry and I am apologizing for my closing remark. It was made tongue in cheek but I realize it doesnt' read that way.
In all seriousness, we are all concerned when we see what appears to be a decorator giving away her/his talent, because we know what is involved. All of us understand the influence of our own market area and we know that has an impact.
The reason I always run the numbers on a situation like this is to show exactly how much cake is being made. While the bride may see it as only 48 cakes, and she may be figuring 4 or 5 pieces per cake, in reality she is asking you to do as much (or more) work to and use the same amount of batter and icing that it would take to make cake for 650. You are making cake for 650 servings for only $500. That concerns us because we don't want any decorator to get 'cheated' out of the talent and skill she has.
These numbers are offered so you can share them with the bride to show her what she is really getting. Many times they are looking at the number of cakes and not the number of servings.
I hope you accept my apology. It was more of a remark toward the situation and not toward you personally. I am sincerely sorry.
Well, the original poster of this thread failed to mention that I made that post at wilton one year ago today. It is a year old. And so that everyone feels better I DID NOT DO THE CAKES!
cass--as i said in my PM, you & i both know what we got into living here in the boondocks, i finally have people willing to pay $35.00 for a 12x16, when we both know that our time is worth so much more than that (especially the time i put in one-still a snails pace here 
)
enjoy the rest of your vacation & come back to MC safely.
Thanks Tara, I know you know where I am coming from where we are in the middle of nowhere. I appreciate your concern! And one of these days, we will get what we're worth! (We might have to relocate, but we'll get it!)
Also to indydebi and kitagrl, I appreciate your apologies, and I am sorry also if I came back as being a harsh person. I wasn't fishing for apologies, I just was uspet at the moment and wanted to explain the situation. I just never really expected to be upset ever by a post. I thought that if I ever was the subject of one ,it would roll off my back like water, but for some odd reason, it didn't. I don't know why, and like I pm'ed to Tara, I wanted to go back and retract the post, but I didn't think I could since it had already been replied to. I think it showed weakness on my part to even respond.
Now, I just got back from dinner, and my sweet hubby is waiting on me ,so I'm off to enjoy the rest of my evening.
I, too, sold my cakes for next to nothing when I lived in South Carolina...I just didn't have anybody on CC to tell me different. Not that I could have changed...as it was I was getting a few complaints from strangers on my prices (unbelievably low prices too!).
Hi everyone.....
I got called on my bad manners again in a PM and want to apologize for my reaction on this thread.....Yes I'm sorry about the whole thing including, reading it, and reading it wrong. I got called on it and I reposted and told everyone it was a late night. So now I will make a public apology.
Unfortnately I should not have been on the threads that night since my husband was having surgery in the morning. I could not sleep and thought the threads would keep my mind off his surgery and the complications. It was not my intent to hurt anyones feelings, but obviously I have. On this thread and another thread. Man oh man, I just was not thinking straight that night.
Unfortunately people get so upset....There is so much more important things to worry about. Well all I got to say is nobody died, nobody is out any money and all in all, it really is just cake we are talking about here.......Right?
Again, sorry.
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