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Have a good day - Page 6

post #76 of 93
Thread Starter 
I freely did this certification process. I knew the accreditation was not going to add up more points toward becoming a pastry chef like for example attending the World Pastry Forum classes did.

Since I can't do stuff from home legally, this would give some spring board. I was gonna try with the zoning board again...But still I could use it to 'be it' in my area and be invited to teach and market myself in that way too. It could have been monetarily beneficial. Could perhaps guest teach at local pastry programs for example.

What would be wrong with being recognized publically for your life's work?
I totally fit the criteria they sent me. You had to hit 70% average or above. My stuff was not under a 70% average--not according to their own rules.

There's a step down from the 'master sugar artist' designation--it's a 'sugar artist' designation--Come on! Sure my stuff coulda been better--

Take your world on the road and pop out four displays in eight hours.

Dude, they not only charged me an entrance fee and I knew there would be spectators--the spectators had to pay too!!! Come see the panda exhibit!

Then I got into this incredible meat grinder...
one baker's 'never ever do' is the next baker's 'i swear by this'
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one baker's 'never ever do' is the next baker's 'i swear by this'
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post #77 of 93
Thread Starter 
I'd like to thank you all for letting me hemorrhage here over the holiday weekend.

I'm not bitter. I'm not full of myself (re the 'it' comment). Just meant it as a marketing tool type 'itness'.

So last month I sent my observations to Ices to make this better going forward.

And for you who might want to do this~~ I suggest as a good prerequisite that you have a cake competition win under your belt before attempting this. Or perhaps plan on investing a coupla years to accomplish it.

Maybe try for a percentage of the 'take' at the door icon_biggrin.gif
Should really go to a charity huh.

Just a thought for you. Thanks again guys.
one baker's 'never ever do' is the next baker's 'i swear by this'
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one baker's 'never ever do' is the next baker's 'i swear by this'
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post #78 of 93
Being bored at the moment, I perused this topic.

Wow.

Perhaps if you'd done a condensed version of why you were made to sit out for a time, and perhaps if you wrote it more concisely and easier to understand, it could've been condensed from 6 pages.

Sorry for your bad luck...stinks when you don't understand all the rules.
post #79 of 93
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by vtcake

Being bored at the moment, I perused this topic.

Wow.

Perhaps if you'd done a condensed version of why you were made to sit out for a time, and perhaps if you wrote it more concisely and easier to understand, it could've been condensed from 6 pages.

Sorry for your bad luck...stinks when you don't understand all the rules.



I haven't checked lately but pretty sure there were a couple other people contributing to the 6 page length not to mention the merry band of Cake Central's International Idol songsters.

On page four there's the Cliff Notes Version aka condensed version. I know I was all over the place--point taken.

Believe me nobody knows how much this effed me up like I do. I am gutted, flies are swarming and.... I am getting better.

It was difficult as you noted to bare my aching soul of it's public failure and passive humiliation once again. The first time it was to a packed house of paying spectators. ha!

My ultimate point is that I think it stinks more when the adjudicators don't know their own rules. This is neither the first year nor am I the first person they pulled this on. The plot thickens...

And my more ultimate point--that would be the ultimater point is that after I communicated these issues to Ices (much more succinctly than I did here icon_redface.gif ) and requested my $150 refund they reiterated thier refund policy. Ices never addressed my issues.

On the upside I should be glad that they did peruse their own rules to that extent eh? icon_lol.gif

"Icing and caring everyone sharing."
one baker's 'never ever do' is the next baker's 'i swear by this'
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one baker's 'never ever do' is the next baker's 'i swear by this'
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post #80 of 93
Thread Starter 
So I mean I had it all written out much better at first and people were following along to the tune of 250 look sees like I had mentioned back there somewhere.

Then I got scared that I was opening myself up to potential owies and that's when I deleted everything and put the 'Have a good day' stuff figuring the thread would just drop away and all's well.

But then some folks started replying and then I felt I needed to explain and everyone was singing and yes it is confusing.

How could the adjudicators conduct cake business in that manner? Put me loosing all aside. But to jerk someone around like that?

They did the secret decoder ring scenario last year too--where you expect to get your results days later at the banquet ok fine. They then change it up and have you sign a waiver to get them early if you say you'll keep them secret and then they never tell you for a week.

WTF
one baker's 'never ever do' is the next baker's 'i swear by this'
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one baker's 'never ever do' is the next baker's 'i swear by this'
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post #81 of 93
Quote:
Originally Posted by K8memphis-



How could the adjudicators conduct cake business in that manner? Put me loosing all aside. But to jerk someone around like that?

They did the secret decoder ring scenario last year too--where you expect to get your results days later at the banquet ok fine. They then change it up and have you sign a waiver to get them early if you say you'll keep them secret and then they never tell you for a week.



It sounds like they all have their heads up where the sun don't shine. This needs to be addressed, and if they won't address it with the person who complains, then maybe they'll address it when it's plastered all over the internet.

I think you were right to post this, so that anyone else who's thinking of doing the "certification" will be on the lookout.
post #82 of 93
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by K8memphis-



And my more ultimate point--that would be the ultimater point is that after I communicated these issues to Ices (much more succinctly than I did here icon_redface.gif ) and requested my $150 refund they reiterated thier refund policy. Ices never addressed my issues.

On the upside I should be glad that they did peruse their own rules to that extent eh? icon_lol.gif

"Icing and caring everyone sharing."



Only took 'em a month though, last week they decided that.
one baker's 'never ever do' is the next baker's 'i swear by this'
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one baker's 'never ever do' is the next baker's 'i swear by this'
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post #83 of 93
Quote:
Originally Posted by vtcake

Being bored at the moment, I perused this topic.

Wow.

Perhaps if you'd done a condensed version of why you were made to sit out for a time, and perhaps if you wrote it more concisely and easier to understand, it could've been condensed from 6 pages.

Sorry for your bad luck...stinks when you don't understand all the rules.



Most ppl here on cc read each others' woe stories and then either commiserate (sp?) with them, or give them advice. that's what most of us here were doeing, including the merry singers, who were trying to get Kate out of her funk.

and when I'm angry, I tend to babble. It all makes little sense until you read the whole saga a few times, then it starts to come together so you get the idea of what I'm trying to say. Our friend did quite a good job here.

Also, you seem to imply that she was at fault for not understanding the rules. It seems like the judges themselves didn't quite understand them either.

And she signed some sort of waiver to hear the results sooner, but didn't hear back from them til much later...

It sounds like these snotty ICES ppl are confused, full of themselves and full of %#*
When the going gets tough, the tough start baking!
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When the going gets tough, the tough start baking!
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post #84 of 93
Good gravey Kate what a freak fest! HUGS!!! You are good enough-you know it-we know it-their loss if you ask me! Sounds like a bunch of nuts who don't know what color their sky is.
¢¾Sarah
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¢¾Sarah
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post #85 of 93
Oh puuuuulease - I have come across threads that were over two hundred pages and gone way way WAY off topic, nobody forced me to read them!
"When choosing between two evils, I always like to try the one I've never tried before." Mae West.
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"When choosing between two evils, I always like to try the one I've never tried before." Mae West.
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post #86 of 93
Thank you very much Kate! I was considering joining ICES for quite a while now, but something just didn't sit right with me. Now I know I made the right decision in waiting.

Good things will happen for you, because you are a good honest person. I just wish that good people would stop being taken advantage of, I hope this gets straightened out for you and in a timely manor.
All the best
Shannie
post #87 of 93
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shannie13

Thank you very much Kate! I was considering joining ICES for quite a while now, but something just didn't sit right with me. Now I know I made the right decision in waiting.

Good things will happen for you, because you are a good honest person. I just wish that good people would stop being taken advantage of, I hope this gets straightened out for you and in a timely manor.
All the best
Shannie



I think it's very sad that the singular experience of Kate--in an event that has taken place only twice (2008 & 2009) for a total of less than 30 people--would bring anyone to the point of completely dismissing the HUGE positive impact of ICES !

Obvioulsy, Kate had a bad experience with her go at the certification process for CMSA/CSA (Certified Master Sugar Artist/Certified Sugar Artist). It's very hard to be told that you've failed, especially when you've invested a lot of time and $ into the process. BUT, there is another side to this story (and NO, I don't know it--I'm not part of the certification process, or the political hierarchy of ICES)--and NO ONE has heard any of that half of the story--and probably never will.

I can't defend everything that ICES does---as a member, that's not my job or right. Mistakes are made every day in every aspect of every life, but the detractors here have said some HORRID things about an organization THAT I FIND TO BE A WONDERFUL AVENUE FOR LEARNING AND SHARING ABOUT SUGAR ART.

ICES chapters worldwide are responsible for many, many of the opportunities sugar artists have for low cost, high quality classes with respected sugar art teachers. Nick Lodge travels and teaches tirelessly at many ICES mini classes--and there are dozens of others who do the same.

I found ICES as I was completing my Wilton 3 class about 5 years ago. Several months later, I attended my first OH Day of Sharing. I had no idea about what was out there for me as someone developing an obsession about sugar art, but thru ICES, I've been able to touch nearly all of the techniques in the field.

For my $60 a year, I get a regular publication that feeds my mind and curiosity, discounted costs to access ICES DOS meetings and classes, an option to apply for scholarships, and hours of "Free" talk and chatter with lots of people with the same interests.

No organization of human beings is ever perfect, but to assume that an entire group is bad, tainted, or worthless, just because one process didn't go smoothly for someone, is really cold...................

Supporting someone who is down is one thing--of course I hope Kate rallies and works thru this in a positive way--but this trend of going so far as to defame something that you're not part of, have not had a bad experience with, and don't fully understand the workings of................that's at least as "wrong" as anything that was done improperly during the Certification process.................

Just my very honest opinion
Rae
I love you, but your emergency is not my crisis!

They say that a little knowledge is a dangerous thing, but it is not one half so bad as a lot of ignorance.--Terry Pratchett (b.194
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I love you, but your emergency is not my crisis!

They say that a little knowledge is a dangerous thing, but it is not one half so bad as a lot of ignorance.--Terry Pratchett (b.194
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post #88 of 93
BlakesCakes- Just my take on the situation- Last year, my laptop broke. I paid $300 for a service plan on it when I purchased it so that if and when it broke, the store would fix it. It was only a year into it's 3 year plan, so I took it back to the store (Fry's) and asked them to fix it. Long story, short, they refused and said the damage was my fault- it WAS NOT! (initially, the rep said that he hated Sony laptops because my problem was such a common defect in Sonys). I left FUMING because my $1500 laptop was garbage and Fry's refused to honor their service plan.

My point? I have no problem with Fry's CUSTOMERS, but I have a HUGE problem with the store and it's management. I will not shop there, and I tell everyone I know not to shop there.

Same with ICES. If I hear that people are getting screwed, I'm going to be a little weary of joining. If their "customer service" sucked SO bad with one "customer" then I have to question whether I want to "shop" there. I'm sure the customers are awesome, though icon_smile.gif

I mean, the first rule in customer service is "The customer is always right" There are times I HATE that statement, but really, what would it have hurt to return K8 her $$$? It certainly would have made a better statement than to say "Screw you" OBVIOUSLY there was a problem with their rules, so they should have sucked it up and said "Sorry, we'll refund you your $$$ and re-evaluate the rules" Hell, they could have gone a step beyond and said "we'll even cover your cost to try again next year". That's how you keep customers happy and prevent the exact situation going on now.

I wonder how many people are NOT going to join or renew their membership now...
post #89 of 93
What you get out of ICES might also depend on your level of experience, and how active your local chapter is, too. My local ICES chapter does a lot of things in Northern VA and the VA Beach area, which is very nice, but I'm 2-3 hours away from all of that. I also tend to be on the more skilled end of the experience spectrum, so when I did go to the DOS that I was able to go to, I found it to be a pretty big waste of my time. The last convention that was close enough for me to think about going to had only about one or two demos/classes out of everything offered that I would have been interested in attending.

For beginners, ICES is a good way to gain exposure to some skills that you might not have seen demonstrated before, but once you get to a certain skill level it's not as useful. For my $60 I get a monthly newsletter that rarely has anything in it other than convention information, pictures of cakes that I can see online, and some ads.

I do understand that not every organization can be everything to everyone, and I'm not doubting that there are people who work hard, and try to make ICES better. But the point in K8's story was that they didn't respond or listen to her concerns, both during the certification and after it. If I did that as a wedding cake vendor, the bride would probably complain about me to the Better Business Bureau. It's not good customer service.
post #90 of 93
[quote="chefjulie If their "customer service" sucked SO bad with one "customer" then I have to question whether I want to "shop" there. membership now...[/quote]

Great minds think alike, ha ha ha! icon_smile.gif
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