Less Sugar In Wasc?

Baking By sparkledee3 Updated 16 Jul 2015 , 12:02pm by SquirrellyCakes

sparkledee3 Posted 11 Jul 2015 , 8:29pm
post #1 of 32

I've tried 2 WASC recipes from this sir and BOTH were delicious! One used egg whites only the other whole eggs. I used Duncan Hines with the whole eggs and Betty Crocker ( measured out enough cake mix from a second box to equal 18 oz). Both were very sweet! If I cut the sugar down by half will the end result be a disaster? Or will it just cut the sweetness down a bit? Since I'm going with a BC frosting I want the vanilla flavor to shine in the cupcakes not the sweetness alone. Not sure what other role the sugar plays in the grand scheme of things in baking other than sweetness. :)

31 replies
sparkledee3 Posted 11 Jul 2015 , 8:30pm
post #2 of 32


SquirrellyCakes Posted 11 Jul 2015 , 9:04pm
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Sugar plays a few roles. It makes a cake more moist, it affects texture . When you cream butter and sugar you affect the volume of a recipe. You get air into your recipe and then the leavening agents affect the air and make the rise. It attracts moisture to your cake and acts as a preservative and a browning agent.

Sounds like you need a different recipe. Did I give you the cupcake recipe or the Martha Stewart recipe? They aren't as sweet.

sparkledee3 Posted 11 Jul 2015 , 9:12pm
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Squirrelly I don't think I got those recipes. I've saved the info you're given me. It is so valuable!! I'd love to have the cupcake and Martha Stewart recipe please. 

I feel so much more confident about this project just from all your help and the help from others on this site too. 

You have really put a lot of time into helping me and it is GREATLY appreciated! 

Hugs to all! 

mccantsbakes Posted 11 Jul 2015 , 9:35pm
post #5 of 32

I have used 2/3 c sugar in the wasc recipe with no issues in quality.  

I actually prefer it at 2/3 because I was getting a really thick crust on my cakes that my stinking low quality leveler couldn't cut through    

This is has disappeared since cutting the sugar   

I haven't tried 1/2 cup,  will try it when I am bored and run out of other things to play a with

mccantsbakes Posted 11 Jul 2015 , 9:37pm
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Gah....what I meant above, was that I was getting the crust on the full cup of sugar in the recipe (I wasn't over baking)

my silly phone keeps freezing on me and I didn't read what I said before hitting "submit" 

sparkledee3 Posted 11 Jul 2015 , 9:55pm
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@mccantsbakes, Did you notice much of a difference in sweetness in the cake with 2/3 cup?  Thanks for your help.

SquirrellyCakes Posted 11 Jul 2015 , 10:41pm
post #8 of 32

The cupcake recipe is at this link on this site:


The white cake recipe is part of the Neapolitan Wedding Cake recipe which you can find by doing a search on 


It makes about 6 cups of batter but I don't know how many cupcakes it will yield. Likely takes about 18-22 minutes at 350F to bake the cupcakes.

SquirrellyCakes Posted 11 Jul 2015 , 10:46pm
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Looks like you will have to cut and paste the link on this site for the cupcake recipe because it isn't working.

mccantsbakes Posted 11 Jul 2015 , 11:03pm
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Yes, it did cut some of the sweetness of the cake.   

I use BC french vanilla as my base for white wasc cake....I think it is very very sweet in general so it could afford a sugar trim down :)

mccantsbakes Posted 11 Jul 2015 , 11:08pm
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I am gonna bake one now, I will add 1/2 c and let you know the result 

sparkledee3 Posted 12 Jul 2015 , 3:41am
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Thanks mccantsbakes! I will be looking forward in seeing your results. I'm going to make half a recipe tonight of the vanilla cupcakes from this site that squirrelly recommended.

sparkledee3 Posted 12 Jul 2015 , 3:42am
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Does anyone know, when you cut a recipe in half such as the cupcakes do you cook less time? I usually start checking at 15 min.

FlourPots Posted 12 Jul 2015 , 6:41am
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I use the incredible Super Enhanced recipe from this site: http://www.cakecentral.com/recipe/1953/super-enhanced-cake-formula for my yellow & white cakes...

(For chocolate, I make a scratch recipe)

I cut the sugar to 1/2 cup in the yellow, and 1/2 cup + 1 tsp.  in the white...no problem at all.

I tried to play around with the sugar in my scratch choc. recipe and it was a disaster.
Scratch is much more of a science...you can do almost anything to a box mix without ruining it.

Cupcakes always take less time to bake.

FlourPots Posted 12 Jul 2015 , 6:47am
post #15 of 32

Dammit...why doesn't this site allow editing anymore!

The amount of sugar in my white is 1/2 cup + 2 Tb.

sparkledee3 Posted 12 Jul 2015 , 3:42pm
post #16 of 32

Thank you FlourPots. I'm going to try a batch today. I tried SquirrellyCakes vanilla ones last night and they are delicious. 

I'm making a lemon cupcake as well. Can I add lemon juice to the white or yellow and if so how much? I don't want an overpowering or bitter lemon flavor. The filling will be lemon curd as well. BC frosting.

sparkledee3 Posted 12 Jul 2015 , 3:44pm
post #17 of 32

Thank you FlourPots. I'm going to try a batch today. I tried SquirrellyCakes vanilla ones last night and they are delicious. 

I'm making a lemon cupcake as well. Can I add lemon juice to the white or yellow and if so how much? I don't want an overpowering or bitter lemon flavor. The filling will be lemon curd as well. BC frosting.

SquirrellyCakes Posted 12 Jul 2015 , 5:33pm
post #18 of 32

Lemon juice isn't going to make your cupcakes taste lemony. The zest of the lemon will and if you want them to taste extra lemony, you make a lemon glaze and poke hole into your cupcakes and brush the glaze on top.

SquirrellyCakes Posted 12 Jul 2015 , 5:40pm
post #19 of 32

I should have added that basically the taste of lemon juice disappears in the baking process. But the oil from the zest (peel) of the lemon gives the taste. Just make sure you use only the zest (the yellow part) and not the bitter pith (the white under the yellow). Once cupcakes are cooked, if you mix the heated juice from the lemon with either powdered or granulated sugar and poke holes in the cupcakes and brush on top, this gives the true lemon taste.

mccantsbakes Posted 12 Jul 2015 , 10:00pm
post #20 of 32

Ok, back to report....using 1/2 cup of sugar worked perfectly fine.   The cake was definitely less sweet, in a great way!   I did notice a slight texture difference.  It wasn't anything bad per se.   I am having trouble trying to describe what the difference was....a more fine crumb is the best way I can describe it.   

With the cake I did, I paired it with a carmalized pear filling with lots of bits of homemade toffee and some toasted almonds.   The cake itself was flavored with maple praline powdered flavor.   I think the balance of a less sweet cake with the very sweet fillings will be a nice combination. 

sparkledee3 Posted 13 Jul 2015 , 5:24pm
post #21 of 32

Thank you all so much for all your help! Mccantsbakes, thanks for posting for the results of your trial. I will try that today too. I'm doing cupcakes with lemon filling in half and chocolate filling in the other half. I've canned the raspberry filling for now anyway. I'm trying to make this project simple - one type of cupcakes (but half with vanilla flavor and half with lemon) with 2 fillings - lemon with lemon and vanilla with chocolate.

I've made a couple of different buttercream recipes so far, one from squirrellycakes that was light and delicious, but I need to adjust the water to stiffen it up for what I need. Then, last night I tried the Two Of Everything (kakeladi I believe posted that) and while much sweeter it was easy to work with as well. It didn't crust for me although I cut down the amount of butter and shortening as recommended for it to crust. I can't find squirrelly's post to me about "crusting" buttercreams and why you use that type. I had a cupcake from a bakery yesterday and it had a crusting buttercream on it so I was able to detect the difference.  I will need that type for my ruffle border anyway. What is your preference for a BC icing that crusts? I am still going to try squirrelly's recipe for her own today. So many choices. I have to get all my recipes set in the next day or so and move onto practicing the ruffle on a trial run baby buggy with all the cupcakes I've made for practice!!! LOL Got a freezer full.

Your cake sounds fantastic!  

SquirrellyCakes Posted 13 Jul 2015 , 5:53pm
post #22 of 32

You usually use a crusting buttercream because you want it to set up so you can ice your cake perfectly smooth. People use a paper towel or something else to smooth it out.

For what you are doing, you don't need a crusting buttercream, you need a buttercream that pipes well.

mccantsbakes Posted 13 Jul 2015 , 7:12pm
post #23 of 32

I just tried indydebi's buttercream this past weekend because I was wanting a great performing crusting buttercream for a cake to hold up in hotter weather.  I LOVE it.  It is quite sweet but it didn't feel greasy to taste like the wilton classic buttercream does. (I have tried many variations of ABC and have found one way or another to dislike either the mouthfeel or the performance) 

I typically use SMB for most cakes, but have noticed that kids don't appreciate the taste of a good SMB......ok maybe just MY kids???  They tend to gravitate toward the sweeter stuff like an ABC.  

sparkledee3 Posted 15 Jul 2015 , 4:31am
post #24 of 32

I tried the ABC recipe on YouTube from Global Sugar Arts. Performed beautifully for both icing the cupcakes and piping the border. It was VERY SWEET though. I'm worried about that. I've been trying different ones and am getting nervous about finding one that will ice the cupcakes (need it softer than for piping the ruffle), and one that holds up to piping. I love the fluffiness of the one that squirrellycakes posted, but I need to make it again and use less water, plus maybe add some meringue powder. I've never worked with that stuff and am not sure at what point to add it.


SquirrellyCakes Posted 15 Jul 2015 , 1:48pm
post #25 of 32

I have never added meringue powder to it. Not sure why you want to because it won't make it pipe better and might make it gritty.

sparkledee3 Posted 15 Jul 2015 , 4:36pm
post #26 of 32

SquirrelyCakes, The fluffy frosting you posted (must be from another post of mine because I don't see it here) was very soft for me. I know I probably added too much water in the beginning. I love the texture and want to make sure it will pipe the ruffle as well and hold up in the heat .Temps here are usually around 75, but just saw on Weather Channel its going to be in the mid to high 80' next week!  I'm going to make it again today. I thought I read somewhere to add meringue powder to stiffen and crust a recipe so I thought if it came out too soft for piping that I could do that.

Does the recipe crust? I have to find your post and see what you said about it. Sorry if I'm repeating myself with questions!!  

SquirrellyCakes Posted 16 Jul 2015 , 12:13am
post #27 of 32

I wouldn't add meringue powder to this particular recipe. You don't need a crusting recipe for what you are doing. Add less water and if need be- a bit more powdered sugar. I think you should be fine to about 85 f and probably  higher because there is only the 6 ounces of butter in it and the high ratio shortening holds up to much higher temperatures. You could make it with all shortening and it works well too. Go with the smaller amount of water.

If you cannot get it to pipe the ruffle, then make a smaller batch of the recipe that you were able to pipe the ruffle with but this one should work.

I posted pretty much the same response to you on the other thread but posted here too just in case.

When you take the Wilton course they will have you using their recipe as it works well for beginners learning to pipe. But once you get practice in, you will be able to pipe with almost any recipe although everyone has their preferences.

SquirrellyCakes Posted 16 Jul 2015 , 12:32am
post #28 of 32

Just seeing on a third thread where you are asking Indydeb whether her recipe crusts and since you asked about this on two threads where you asked me - I am wondering if you are mixed up about what crusting means. The only reason people want a crusting buttercream is if you want to use a Viva paper towel method to smooth the icing. Crusting doesn't mean that the icing holds up better in warm weather, nor does it mean that you can decorate better with it. It just means that it sets up enough that if you put a paper towel or piece of parchment or piece of cloth on it after you have let it set up for about 20 minutes, that those things won't stick to it.

Some people think you need a crusting buttercream if you are going to completely cover a cake with fondant. But you don't, I cover non-crusting buttercream iced cakes with fondant.

If you are piping your buttercream on your cupcakes, you don't need a crusting buttercream but you can use one if you want. You don't need a crusting buttercream to attach your little fondant decorations either. They will be fine on a non-crusting or crusting buttercream.

Hope that clears it up for you in case you were confused.

sparkledee3 Posted 16 Jul 2015 , 4:02am
post #29 of 32

SquirrellyCakes, Thanks for the explanation! I did think I had to have a crusting BC to set out for a few hours because I thought if it didn't crust then it would melt. LOL  I also want to make one just to see the difference for future uses. I think I left you a message earlier if it went through, that I post in different areas regarding the topic. Questions about decorating or icing I put in decorating, questions about baking I ask in the baking forum. It has gotten rather confusing. I think I've started new topics because I didn't know if I kept posting in the same topic if my questions would get seen. I think after today I can find my way back to the posts!

My second attempt at the Whimsical BC was great! Frosted and piped the ruffle and it was beautiful. Mine didn't crust (not sure if you said it was suppose to or not.) It was quite shiny. I practiced on the back of a paper plate and was surprised to see the grease ring about a half inch wide going in a circle where I piped the icing. I guess the plate absorbed it and made it spread. I mixed it on low for 15 min. Its light and airy, but a bit gritty at the same time. Wonder what I did wrong there?! 

SquirrellyCakes Posted 16 Jul 2015 , 10:13am
post #30 of 32

The grittiness would be caused by one of two things - the salt or if you used beet sugar or anything less fine than 10x cane sugar.

Dissolve the salt in the boiling water. Try to use really fine powdered pure cane sugar. I find it works better than beet sugar. Sometimes it is just a good idea to sift your powdered sugar regardless of what kind it is. Some people can only get beet sugar and if that is the case, try sifting it.

No, crusting recipes don't hold up any better in the heat than non crusting recipes. It is really dependant on the type of fat and amounts or ratio of one fat or another. On a paper plate any icing with fat in it is going to leave grease spots.

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