Another Pricing Vent And Not What You Think
Decorating By leah_s Updated 4 Jul 2007 , 8:22am by jouj
I agree with all of you, we shouldn't underestimate our cakes and our time, so STICK to your prices and as I learned lately: NO MORE FREE CAKES!!!
I usually make a cake and take it with me whenever I'm invited to a friend's house for lunch or dinner, I used to think that this is like publicity for me, that way they will see my cakes and taste them!! I WAS TOTALLY WRONG!!! The people to whom I took free cakes to NEVER order from me!!! 
One of my friends asked me to give her a paper with photos of some of my cakes and cookies with my prices on it, she said she wouldshow it to her friends at work. I was invited to dinner at her house 2 weeks ago, and I made a cake and took it with me. I accidentally saw her exchanging looks and mean smiles with another friend that was there, while they were cutting a piece of cake to eat it!! I'm not sure what they were telling each other, but I have the feeling that it was like: This cake is for that much???!?!!! Like it's too expensive. I swear I'll NEVER take a cake to them again!
What these 2 so-called friends don't know, is that THEY'RE definitely NOT the customers I want, and that I have a lot of customers who really appreciate my work!!
By the way, the 2nd of these 2 friends didn't order a cake from me for her sons birthday (for 50 persons), but she bought one from a cheap place for only $25 less than what I asked for, and she was bragging about it in front of me!! 
I totally agree...however, sometimes I just make cakes for the girls at work because I figure maybe someday I'll get a paid cake order...which I did. I figure if people see my cakes, then maybe they will order one too for a special occasion or just because. But, I can definitely see your point. Maybe I should start asking for a few dollars per slice of cake, even the ones I bring to work just because. You've made me think. 
Amen!! I am sure to print this out and save it for when I start selling my cakes.
I think I will too!
Since I'm reading this on Sunday, I just feel the need to say AMEN to Leah's post !! Just when I was feeling that my prices are too high, and feeling that ol' lower-my-prices-some $-is better-than no-$ syndrome, you post popped up on CC. I really appreciate your comments and many of the responding comments as well. Not only does the wisdom of mama & Dr Phil apply to cakes, but to life in general!!!
Thank you all. I was hoping that I wouldn't get flamed for this, as it might have been perceived as a bit stern. Thank you for taking it in the spirit it was intended.
And about that cake in People--everyone keeps telling me it was so cheap, but it was a 6/8/10. It was very small, so the price worked out to nearly $5 per serving.
Since I'm reading this on Sunday, I just feel the need to say AMEN to Leah's post !! Just when I was feeling that my prices are too high, and feeling that ol' lower-my-prices-some $-is better-than no-$ syndrome, you post popped up on CC. I really appreciate your comments and many of the responding comments as well. Not only does the wisdom of mama & Dr Phil apply to cakes, but to life in general!!!
Heck, I'm working on my Sept 1 price increase as we speak!!!! This motivated me to get going on it! (This weekend, I noticed my napkin cost went up 15%! If it's going up, so is everything else .... including ME!)
Thank you, Leah! At first I started to feel a bit put-off, but then I got to thinking, doggone it, SHE'S RIGHT!
I also checked out your "Read This First" and will be incorporating your "No other cakes at the wedding" rule into my contract, that seems to be coming up a lot lately with me!
Thanks for the kick in the butt-ercream!
Shelle
I went back through this thread to see if there was a link to the cake you made that was published by PEOPLE Magazine and I couldn't find it. So for anyone who would like to see it, here's the link:
http://www.people.com/people/package/gallery/0,,20042118_20041107_17,00.html
It's cake #17 
I agree, too!! Though, I must say, the last 2 cakes I did were my first order. Most of my cakes that I make have been for church events, so I just willingly bring my cake to show off. One I made for a couple who was moving to another state-we had a little going away party for them at the church-and I wanted the couple to see it before people start eating it and there were people already trying to cut into the cake! I stopped them and let the couple see it before it was cut, but I'm thinking, "Do they really see what I did or read what is on it?" (The people trying to cut the cake-not the couple-they did see and read it.)
Anyway, on my last order, a lady at church was talking about how she didn't like the Wal-Mart cakes and needed one for her son's birthday party. I started talking to her about it and asked what she would want and she decided on a baseball cake. I told her I would get back with her on the price. I didn't really figure how much it actually cost me because I had all the ingredients already at home.
I figured $30 would be good since this was my first charge. She wanted to know how many people the baseball cake would feed and I looked all over the box and directions, but could not find how many it would feed, so I took the pan to church to show her to give her an idea and she asked if I could do a sheet cake with it so I could write, "Happy Birthday" on it. Plus for the number of people, it didn't look like the baseball cake would be enough to feed everyone. So I made the baseball cake and the 9x13 cake.
On the day of the party, she came to my house, and I said to my husband, "I'm going to deliver the cake-why is she here?" They said they wouldn't be able to pay until the next Friday when they got the paycheck, so I didn't think about the money. Well, what do you know? She pays me
and when we finish talking she goes back out to her car and I realize she gave me $40! I go out and told her that I only asked for $30 and she says it is alright.
While she was in the house the first time, I didn't even think to show her the cakes, so I invited her back in and showed her and she said they were worth $40. She really loved them. Much better than a $20 Wal-Mart cake!! This was the first time I have ever charged for a cake and I was glad to get the extra $10! It may not be much to some CCers, but I was happy that she liked it and said it was worth it.
You've inspired me to review my pricing as well...I KNOW I am underpriced because I have tried to keep it at a level of competition with a local bakery - but then I remind myself that I can't buy wholesale or bulk like they can, don't have a tax ID, etc - so my cost is much higher than theirs - my prices should increase so my profits will!
My mother-in-law lives in a large city and I live out in the country. She has often told me that I undercharge. ($20-9x13, $25-11x15..) I have some customers that have changed their plans to work around me getting to do their cakes and some that come from across the state line. I'm not bragging because I have ALOT of improving to do and lots of things to learn. But, my point is, I'm really afraid to raise my prices because of the area I'm in, but on the other hand there are some people that REALLY want my cakes.. I'm afraid I'll price myself right out of business. I would like to raise the prices because I am a stay-at-home mom with 2 children and really need more extra money. Take a look at my cakes and see what ya'll think. (For the 8" rounds I charge $25 and the big firetruck cake I think I charged $85)
bakermomof2 .... my eyes popped when your gallery opened up for me! Holy Moly, girl, you rock!! Your hamburger cake is flawless .... the best one I've seen! LUV'D your Texas Chainsaw cake!
You need to read every word on leahs website and follow her lead ... you are way underpriced for your talent.
If you bake it ... they will come. I promise. With work like yours, I promise!!!
I still encourage you to charge by the serving. An 8" cake per the Wilton party cake chart serves 12. From me you'd get the cake with a simple message and five roses on top. Anything more is extra. I'd say you're in the ballpark on your pricing on that one, bu with all the extra decoration you do on the sides of your cakes and the custom work on the tops, you could charge a bit more.
I can't see the firetruck (maybe I missed the pic) but if it's sculpted, then it should be worth a lot.
You might try testing the waters a bit. Start charging $27 ($2.25 per serving) and/or add a few dollars for "custom work" on your round cakes and see what happens.
My mother-in-law lives in a large city and I live out in the country. She has often told me that I undercharge. ($20-9x13, $25-11x15..) I have some customers that have changed their plans to work around me getting to do their cakes and some that come from across the state line. I'm not bragging because I have ALOT of improving to do and lots of things to learn. But, my point is, I'm really afraid to raise my prices because of the area I'm in, but on the other hand there are some people that REALLY want my cakes.. I'm afraid I'll price myself right out of business. I would like to raise the prices because I am a stay-at-home mom with 2 children and really need more extra money. Take a look at my cakes and see what ya'll think.
(For the 8" rounds I charge $25 and the big firetruck cake I think I charged $85)
Girl... how much do you spend on ingredients??? Now, add in the pans you've had to buy, the food coloring, the tips, the bags, the electricity, the water use... EVERYTHING... Now... how much do you have left over? What does that give you in per hour salary?
If you are good (which you are), people will come to you with higher prices. Not only are you hurting yourself, you're hurting every other cake decorator because you are basically giving them away for free and setting up expectations that people can get something for nothing. Your mom is right. You are NOT costco, but a custom cake designer.
Melissa
Leah - do you then use the wilton party chart for party cakes and wedding chart for wedding cakes? The reason I ask is because some people use the wedding chart regardless and tell them to order more cake if they want to cut bigger slices. I'm currently using a chart that sizes cakes at 2x2 for party cakes, then use the wilton chart for wedding sizes...and wanting to convert to your method of per slice charging, regardless if it's for a wedding or for a party.
Thanks!
All I can say is that this are the most inteligent post about prizing I've read on CC so far. I agree 100% thank you
yellobutterfly, I'm not intending to jump in on a question you have for leahs, but if it's helpful, see my post on this thread - http://www.cakecentral.com/cake-decorating-ftopicp-3894203-.html#3894203 - I use the charts to determine pricing, not necessarily to determine servings. same chart ... same cake ... same work .. same price.
thanks indydeb, I don't think I've seen that chart yet. So, to clarify - the chart has wedding, party, and family sizes listed - so you refer to the wedding serving sizes for pricing, for instance someone wants and round to serve 17 people - according to wilton that would be an 8 in which serves 20 - so you multiply whatever your price is times 20 servings. But let's say they then see that in order to get that they'd have to cut small, and they they want to cut bigger sized slices...so you say, that's a 10in round, cut in party sized slices, and then figure the price by multiplying 34 (wilton wedding size for 10in round) times your price per serving. And, the price per slice is the same whether they want a stacked cake (wedding or party) or just a two layer occasion? But, the price per slice is more if they want fondant, or flowers, or a "specialty" type cake (say Italian creme)? Did I get it? (lol - sorry I'm not trying to kill this topic, just want to understand)!
thanks Leahs! For sheet cakes do you just do one layer and the wilton party sizes, or do you not do sheet cakes? (sorry if that was already mentioned I missed it).
To further clarify, and this is only the way I do things, not written in stone, is always to charge by the serving.
First it eliminates the feelings of a lot of brides that they're being gouged. Typically, when they call a bakery for a price for a certain size cake, its a set price. However, when the bakery hears the word wedding the prices go up Brides get really pissed off and who can blame them.
So, I charge everything by the serving. The fact that a wedding serving is smaller than a party serving frankly never comes up. Pricing by the serving just eliminates all the questions of why is wedding cake more, and eliminates having to deal with a bridezilla.
If the party cake is tiered, then I still charge by the serving, provide according to the Wilton party chart and charge my usual fee for the equipment for the tiering process. Yes, I have a separate equipment fee. I think that's only fair to charge people for equipment if they use it.
A one tier birthday cake does not incur an equipment charge, and I'll throw in a couple of foil wrapped cardboards on the bottom.
I don't charge extra for "premium" flavors. I have costed out my recipes by the ounce of ingredient and can verify that the "premium" flavors don't cost me that much, if any, more to make. And most people order white or chocolate which are reasonably priced anyway. It really does all work out on average.
I also don't charge extra for fillings, because when I costed them out they didn't cost but a couple of pennies extra, literally, than the icing I have to put in between the layers anyway. Something's got to go in there. And for a few cents, I'm not going to piss off customers by nickel and diming them to death. And frankly the "no extra charge for premium flavors and no extra charge for fillings" brings in the customers.
You guys should be getting a sense of how I run my business and you know I don't give cake away. These policies were based on a solid costing out of my recipes.
I am fortunate enough to have gotten to the point where I can buy wholesale and I know that gives me a cost advantage. I'm certainly not big enough that I can negotiate my pricing. (Think Walmart beating suppliers' prices down.)
I also buy things when it makes more sense to buy them. That was a tough lesson. Can I make gumpaste flowers? Sure. Am I proud of the artistry I can create? You bet. Is it cost effective for me to do so? Generally not. I buy a kilo of beautiful pearls for something like $12. That will last about a year. I give those away free. Brides can't believe it. I sell gumpaste callas for $3-4 each. Cost me about 90 cents each to buy. Fresh callas are $7 a stem at the florist. Again brides love my prices.
And frankly, me too!
Good point Leah, thanks for explaining. Do you do everything scratch? (icing, fillings, cakes)? I buy my fillings (which is why I usually just charge a few dollars extra to the total cake), but for the cakes I start with a box and doctor it...for the icing, scratch. Do you have a storefront? Hope we all will go as far as you have one day!
98% scratch.
My fillings are 2 parts of my whipped bc (very light and fluffy) plus 1 part sleeved filling. It has the taste and consistency of mousse and is shelf stable (needs no refrigeration.) Customers love it.
Cakes and icing are scratch. Oh except that I buy fondant. So take that number down to 90% scratch, I guess.
Funny you should ask about a storefront, as I'm getting the retail bug again . . .
thanks indydeb, I don't think I've seen that chart yet. So, to clarify - the chart has wedding, party, and family sizes listed - so you refer to the wedding serving sizes for pricing, for instance someone wants and round to serve 17 people - according to wilton that would be an 8 in which serves 20 - so you multiply whatever your price is times 20 servings. But let's say they then see that in order to get that they'd have to cut small, and they they want to cut bigger sized slices...so you say, that's a 10in round, cut in party sized slices, and then figure the price by multiplying 34 (wilton wedding size for 10in round) times your price per serving. And, the price per slice is the same whether they want a stacked cake (wedding or party) or just a two layer occasion? But, the price per slice is more if they want fondant, or flowers, or a "specialty" type cake (say Italian creme)? Did I get it? (lol - sorry I'm not trying to kill this topic, just want to understand)!
sounds like you got it!
I have a question about prices. What would you all charge for a 3-d figure(bears, trains and so on)? I charge $40 but I dont know if it too much or not enough. I mean really where is anyone going to get them but people like us? Not a bakery! great forum!!
Thanks... I guess what you are saying is that I should raise the price.
also does anyone do naughty cakes in here and what should I charge for them?
I read what everyone wrote and I have to say Thank You!! I graduated from Culinary School (Pastry) two years ago and among friends I'm known as the cake person. I plan to start charging for cakes as soon as I finish with my Wilton Classes. I know it'll be a shock to friends and family but no longer will I be able to do freebies.
Thank you so much for the information that all of you are willing to share that is so important.
Wow, you're all lucky to be able to follow the Wilton chart for serving sizes! I don't live in the US, and here all the good pastry shops have huge portions! You never see an 8-in cake here. The sizes start from 9-in, and that serves 8 to 10 persons! I know it could easily feed at lease 16, but this is how they do it here. I have to follow their sizes, because if I follow the Wilton chart, nobody would buy from me, they would think that I'm robbing them off 
.
Above that, the good pastry shops usually don't take orders for less than 50 persons for complicated cakes, and they charge $5 to $8 a portion!! A 50 persons sheet cake would be around 20"x24", and priced between $250 and $400.
I'm still new at selling cakes, so my prices are around $3.5 per portion.
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