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Original message sent by costumeczar
Right, more likely to get other non-paying articles published.
In this case, the value-added exposure is the link to the author's web site at the bottom. Given the amount of traffic a NYT article gets, it would only take a very small percentage of click-throughs and purchases on the author's site to make it worthwhile.
Whether or not the value of this exposure is worth the time spent to write the article will depend on the number of hits, click-through rates, and the availability/profitability of products on the author's web site.
Oh please, Jason, be realistic. You throw this crap around and sadly, some people here may believe it. Make up your mind about whose side you're on.
Jason because you seem to think exposure is actual payment I have a question to pose for you.
Do you know the print on the toilet paper roll you've been using all week?
My guess is no.
Yet its getting exposure day after day after day. You can't say "Well its not interesting or useful to you."
Because we would all know that is a lie.
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Original message sent by MimiFix
Oh please, Jason, be realistic. You throw this crap around and sadly, some people here may believe it. Make up your mind about whose side you're on.
I wasn't aware there were sides, I'm just giving my opinion. If you feel there is a flaw in my reasoning you are welcome to discuss it here.
Considering the author of the article has a book that is #13 in political humor on Amazon, his strategy seems to be working reasonably well.
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Original message sent by costumeczar
Like when they tell me that the exposure I'll get from making a free cake will get me requests...Yes, from other people who want free cakes.
Exactly
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Original message sent by smittyditty
Jason because you seem to think exposure is actual payment I have a question to pose for you.
I do not believe exposure is actual payment. All I'm saying is that widespread exposure with an international audience and direct links to web sites that convert visitors into paying customers has the potential to at least provide compensation for the time spent producing the free content.
This model only holds for certain types of products, e.g. digital content with a fixed cost to initially produce and zero variable cost. Cake has a high variable cost so exposure in most cases is not nearly as valuable. Given that the author of the article sells items that benefit the most from exposure, the article seems a little hypocritical to me.
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Original message sent by jason_kraft
widespread exposure with an international audience and direct links to web sites that convert visitors into paying customers has the potential for at least providing compensation for the time spent producing the free content.
I would venture to guess those customers are few and far between.
I very much liked the author and thought it was well written. I didn't even look for a link to his site. Quite frankly, although I have great respect for authors, I couldn't tell you his name.
Hundreds of people attended the gala. Many many of them gushed about how great the cake was. Because I am a bread cancer survivor, I am introduced and thanked. There's even a big publicity shot of all is survivors cutting the cake. My phone number and web address are listed on every piece of promo material. Not one single client. Exposure does not equate clients.
They loved the cake. They devoured the cake and droned on about how delicious it was. No difference.
ACertainly exposure is important. I'm sure some people will in fact click on his link. A few more may even purchase his book.
That is not where the majority of his clients find him. Just isn't.
Apples and oranges anyway....but I've never know anything to come from free cake except more people asking for free cake.
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Original message sent by DeliciousDesserts
I would venture to guess those customers are few and far between.
Exactly. When we are talking about the number of hits generated by a NYT article (not to mention the print edition), few and far between might be good enough.
I do not believe exposure is actual payment. All I'm saying is that widespread exposure with an international audience and direct links to web sites that convert visitors into paying customers has the potential to at least provide compensation for the time spent producing the free content.
Ah, you mean like all the money I make because I post on CC with no remuneration but do have my website link. Or the exposure you have that keeps your blog's donation box filled. Yup, I get it.
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Original message sent by MimiFix
Ah, you mean like all the money I make because I post on CC with no remuneration but do have my website link. Or the exposure you have that keeps your blog's donation box filled. Yup, I get it.
I can't speak to your website, but the donations from my blog have paid for the time I spent writing the articles. If one of my articles was picked up by NYT and got 1000x times the audience I would probably do quite well.
Also, I post on CC for fun (and to share my knowledge), profit is incidental since I have another source of income.
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In this case, the value-added exposure is the link to the author's web site at the bottom. Given the amount of traffic a NYT article gets, it would only take a very small percentage of click-throughs and purchases on the author's site to make it worthwhile.
Whether or not the value of this exposure is worth the time spent to write the article will depend on the number of hits, click-through rates, and the availability/profitability of products on the author's web site.
My cousin would be glad to tell you that it's a nice theory but reality doesn't work that way. She's changing professions because the radio show that she does for free exposure, as well as the books she's written and articles that she writes for free or next to nothing might be worth a ton of followers on twitter, but not enough in sales to support herself. Debating theory is one thing but the reality is that working for free doesn't draw enough follow-up to make it worth the effort.
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Original message sent by costumeczar
My cousin would be glad to tell you that it's a nice theory but reality doesn't work that way. She's changing professions because the radio show that she does for free exposure, as well as the books she's written and articles that she writes for free or next to nothing might be worth a ton of followers on twitter, but not enough in sales to support herself. Debating theory is one thing but the reality is that working for free doesn't draw enough follow-up to make it worth the effort.
Agreed that in many cases the numbers don't work out in the real world unless you hit it big with exposure on a very popular site. And that's why this article is so ironic: the author himself is probably an exception to his narrative of exposure not being worth it.
the donations from my blog have paid for the time I spent writing the articles.
Interesting, that's not what you wrote a few weeks ago when you said donations were so low it helped you decide to not write a book. And don't ask me to go digging up your old post. You find it. I'm going to sleep.
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Original message sent by MimiFix
Interesting, that's not what you wrote a few weeks ago when you said donations were so low it helped you decide to not write a book. And don't ask me to go digging up your old post. You find it. I'm going to sleep.
Donations were in fact lower than I expected, and that's why I decided not to write the book. Books take a LOT longer to write than blog posts, and extrapolating the donation level for the articles (just enough to compensate me for writing them) to potential sales indicated that the investment in writing a book would not be worth it.
So I spent a little time writing the articles, made a little money, and avoided spending more time and money to write a book that probably wouldn't have been worth it. Plus I don't have to retype the same posts when people ask about pricing, copyright, etc. Win-win. :D
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Originally Posted by Godot
"......You think writing is so easy? Well let's see you do it then......"
No thanks, I'm strictly manual labor. I go to work in steel toed boots & FRC's for 12 hour shifts.
What have you had published, What are your book titles? Maybe I'll buy one.
what are your book titles where are your paintings displayed where are your decorated cake photos what magazines are you published in
looking forward to hearing your story about creative struggles, how you overcame the difficulties set in your path, and how you managed to succeed in spite of the odds against you, may you answer these spoken requests for enlightenment whatever your name is.....
Waiting for Godot to take a physical form omnipresent omniscient can't be sure it exists
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what are your book titles where are your paintings displayed where are your decorated cake photos what magazines are you published in
looking forward to hearing your story about creative struggles, how you overcame the difficulties set in your path, and how you managed to succeed in spite of the odds against you, may you answer these spoken requests for enlightenment whatever your name is.....
Waiting for Godot to take a physical form omnipresent omniscient can't be sure it exists
Did you just quote yourself in this thread or am I missing a comment somewhere?
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My cousin would be glad to tell you that it's a nice theory but reality doesn't work that way. She's changing professions because the radio show that she does for free exposure, as well as the books she's written and articles that she writes for free or next to nothing might be worth a ton of followers on twitter, but not enough in sales to support herself. Debating theory is one thing but the reality is that working for free doesn't draw enough follow-up to make it worth the effort.
There's also the validation factor. None of my writer friends make a living from their writing as of yet, and chances are most of them never will. However, the gratification they see in the uptick of hits on their blog or a post being picked up by HuffPo or another widely read site is enough compensation for some of them, aka the Sally Field "YOU REALLY LIKE ME!" factor.
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There's also the validation factor. None of my writer friends make a living from their writing as of yet, and chances are most of them never will. However, the gratification they see in the uptick of hits on their blog or a post being picked up by HuffPo or another widely read site is enough compensation for some of them, aka the Sally Field "YOU REALLY LIKE ME!" factor.
For the ones who are trying to actually make a living at it that's not enough to pay the bills!
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For the ones who are trying to actually make a living at it that's not enough to pay the bills!
Oh, I know, I know. I know reality has already hit a few of them. I made a stab at it myself back in the pre-internet dinosaur days and found out very quickly that I had to pay bills! I don't like wrecking anyone's dream, though, so I stand back and pray that the reality will hit them sooner rather than later.
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Oh, I know, I know. I know reality has already hit a few of them. I made a stab at it myself back in the pre-internet dinosaur days and found out very quickly that I had to pay bills! I don't like wrecking anyone's dream, though, so I stand back and pray that the reality will hit them sooner rather than later.
Yeah...I think that as far as cake goes, people have to decide whether they want a hobby, a part-time job or a full-time job, then plan finances accordingly. And a lot of people who just like seeing their name in print and like to win cake awards aren't making enough income to support themselves, so while they look like they have a full-time job their income is more "enhanced hobby" income. Unless they get into teaching, which seems to be what a lot of people are doing these days. But I'm cynical like that and my BS meter is pretty active. You need to be business-oriented to make a successful business in any field, and whether it's writing or baking or plumbing or whatever, giving your work away for free just to see your name in print isn't a great financial strategy on its own. there's a lot of weirdness in the cake world these days overall, people giving advice when they shouldn't, emperors without clothing, blah blah blah. So that's my tirade for the day, now I have to go work.
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In the same way that we talk about educating our cake customers, we could be trying to educate people about writers. There was a recent thread where posters said how much money authors make. Not!
For the most part, writers come up with ideas, spend hours and hours and more damn hours, writing revising revising editing writing and writing more. We are paid nothing until our work is published. And payment is usually less than $1 per book sold. (I'll skip the part about people just getting a book from the library or writing nasty book reviews.)
In the meantime, most writers work at crappy part time jobs to pay their bills. I don't have parents with a basement, I have a family and a mortgage and a crappy part time job to supplement my real job, which is helping people create an income. Sorry MB, I wasn't directing this at you, I was just explaining the realities of the writers' life.
...well said.. I admire your honesty , and not being biased with what you have shared . ( now having a clear point of view)
Did you just quote yourself in this thread or am I missing a comment somewhere?
missing a comment also, how pozzo ge-doh
are there not dozens of threads about not giving stuff away for free. There are as many reasons as there are stars in the sky. Each one as valid as the next. Respect your financial situation and be mindful of your budget.
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Yeah...I think that as far as cake goes, people have to decide whether they want a hobby, a part-time job or a full-time job, then plan finances accordingly. And a lot of people who just like seeing their name in print and like to win cake awards aren't making enough income to support themselves, so while they look like they have a full-time job their income is more "enhanced hobby" income. Unless they get into teaching, which seems to be what a lot of people are doing these days. But I'm cynical like that and my BS meter is pretty active. You need to be business-oriented to make a successful business in any field, and whether it's writing or baking or plumbing or whatever, giving your work away for free just to see your name in print isn't a great financial strategy on its own. there's a lot of weirdness in the cake world these days overall, people giving advice when they shouldn't, emperors without clothing, blah blah blah. So that's my tirade for the day, now I have to go work.
WORD! Never a truer word spoken.
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what are your book titles where are your paintings displayed where are your decorated cake photos what magazines are you published in
looking forward to hearing your story about creative struggles, how you overcame the difficulties set in your path, and how you managed to succeed in spite of the odds against you, may you answer these spoken requests for enlightenment whatever your name is.....
Waiting for Godot to take a physical form omnipresent omniscient can't be sure it exists
You're the one who criticized writers generally. Godot never claimed to be one.
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Are you feeling slightly off today? You're not making a whole lot of sense.
are there not dozens of threads about not giving stuff away for free. There are as many reasons as there are stars in the sky. Each one as valid as the next. Respect your financial situation and be mindful of your budget.
True, there are many threads that explain the reasons. But regularly, we also have threads started by people not interested in learning how to price. They simply ask others to give them a price. Members who direct them to learn are often ignored. Members cognizant of this pricing issue still jump in to "help" and we succeed in pushing one more caker into the low-price club.
It's unfortunate that with so much competition and ignorance I see this as a losing battle. We have hobby bakers giving their goods away, new businesses that want to "get their name out," and those who consistently and ignorantly underprice so drastically they are subsidizing customers. All of these people are undermining themselves and every business striving to make a decent wage.
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Are you feeling slightly off today? You're not making a whole lot of sense.
mcaulir: Very kind of you to be concerned! Thank You mcaulir.
[ to answer you mcaulir, well, is it possible that it's just a result of having the screen name "MBalaska" denigrated as a means of displaying a contrary opinion . You may be assured that the object of the writers references I have made above, understands with perfect clarity. I apologize to you for any confusion, and will get back to CAKE TALK. Cheers.]
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