For Those Who Dont Think The Copyright Law Is Real....

Decorating By morganchampagne Updated 7 Oct 2013 , 11:22pm by SystemMod2

morganchampagne Cake Central Cake Decorator Profile
morganchampagne Posted 7 Oct 2013 , 6:25am
post #31 of 152

ASo would I. But She just feels embarrassed by it. Which I do understand. Some people would rather hide their failures instead of using them to help others.

DeliciousDesserts Cake Central Cake Decorator Profile
DeliciousDesserts Posted 7 Oct 2013 , 9:11am
post #32 of 152

AFor most people, your warning IS lost.

Without verifiable info, it becomes another urban legend.

I neither believe or disbelieve. I just wanted to offer an explanation of why no one was responding as well as offer advice on how bed to appeal to people.

morganchampagne Cake Central Cake Decorator Profile
morganchampagne Posted 7 Oct 2013 , 11:19am
post #33 of 152

AIt really wasn't bothering me that nobody was responding...cause it was just me sharing a story. I didn't actually expect anyone to comment on it. But thanks for the explanation

liz at sugar Cake Central Cake Decorator Profile
liz at sugar Posted 7 Oct 2013 , 11:43am
post #34 of 152

Quote:

Originally Posted by BrandisBaked 

It's so important because people want to base their decisions on facts. We've heard/read many times the "it happened to a friend of mine" but no evidence is offered. If you really want people to KNOW that these lawsuits happen, why not offer up the case law?

There's a reason Snopes.com exists - because there are a lot of stories that are simply made up.

I don't believe or disbelieve you. I am just answering your question.

 

I don't get this logic . . . the copyright law DOES in fact, exist, and people should be basing their decision on that alone, not whether someone has had the law enforced, with evidence attached.

 

Some people continue to break the law, because of ignorance, but why someone needs evidence of prosecution to believe that they have to follow the law is just wrong.

 

Thanks Morgan for sharing the details of your friend's story.  I really don't need to know her name to realize the warning you were trying to relay. :)

 

Liz

Norasmom Cake Central Cake Decorator Profile
Norasmom Posted 7 Oct 2013 , 11:52am
post #35 of 152

Well, I feel badly for your friend, $200,000 is a lot of money.  LV certainly has to protect their brand.  I would think the bulk of their lawyers go after counterfeiters, my guess is that they do internet searches for fake purses and came across a cake.

BatterUpCake Cake Central Cake Decorator Profile
BatterUpCake Posted 7 Oct 2013 , 11:56am
post #36 of 152

Or some person reported her...maybe an angry customer

scrumdiddlycakes Cake Central Cake Decorator Profile
scrumdiddlycakes Posted 7 Oct 2013 , 12:03pm
post #37 of 152

Quote:

Originally Posted by BatterUpCake 
 

Or some person reported her...maybe an angry customer

If someone is going to report a baker for something like that, it is usually another baker, lol.

morganchampagne Cake Central Cake Decorator Profile
morganchampagne Posted 7 Oct 2013 , 12:05pm
post #38 of 152

AIt really is. It's such an avoidable thing too. Just don't do the cakes.

What I find a little funny though is that people don't want to accept the laws...but their creations are off limits. People want to chase after these people who use pictures of their cakes, or recreate the design with torches and pitchforks! And rightfully so. Of what right is it to someone else to take what you created.

Well apparently LV feels the same.

morganchampagne Cake Central Cake Decorator Profile
morganchampagne Posted 7 Oct 2013 , 12:14pm
post #39 of 152

AI think that DD is right really. And I didn't think there would actually be any discussion of validity. Short of my friend giving me all the details and allowing me to share, I'm unlikely to deter anybody who has decided it's OK to do these cakes

SecretAgentCakeBaker Cake Central Cake Decorator Profile
SecretAgentCakeBaker Posted 7 Oct 2013 , 1:00pm
post #40 of 152

AI read an article yesterday that Cake Boss software did with an intellectual property attorney. http://www.cakeboss.com/CopyrightCakes.aspx

I once posted a used light pull for sale on eBay for $5. In my description I wrote that ?Coupon=CC2015"the design looked similar to the Makenzie Childs style." The company emailed me, insisting I remove my listing, and if I did not, they threatened to sue. They also contacted ebay and had my listing removed. I received an email from eBay warning me to not relist my item or my account would be shut down. Just sharing this to show that companies do take action for smaller items.

jemchina Cake Central Cake Decorator Profile
jemchina Posted 7 Oct 2013 , 1:19pm
post #41 of 152

AThank you for sharing this information. If I was your friend I wouldn't want my legal woes posted on a public forum either. I've heard about the copyright infringement warnings time and time again on this site, but would have never imagined the penalty could be so stiff!

I recently saw some stencils that were from another well know purse maker, to be used for cakes as well. They were NOT made by that famously purse maker, I guarantee. I doubt they had permission to do this, and the first thing I thought was wow, what 'till "so-n-so" sees this advertised for sale. They would be all over that!

morganchampagne Cake Central Cake Decorator Profile
morganchampagne Posted 7 Oct 2013 , 1:36pm
post #42 of 152

ANo problem. She's really sensitive about the whole thing. It's really not a matter if an offender will get caught it's when. She happened to get a real stiff penalty.

angellove1955 Cake Central Cake Decorator Profile
angellove1955 Posted 7 Oct 2013 , 1:49pm
post #43 of 152

I used to work for Wal-Mart and when i would do a copyright cake you had to do it as the picture because if you didn't then the store could get into trouble for changing their cake.I think it is wrong that they put stiff fines on changing their cake because you are still using their kits and maybe the person can't have the color red for example and you made it a different color the store can get into a lot of trouble for that little change.

vgcea Cake Central Cake Decorator Profile
vgcea Posted 7 Oct 2013 , 4:24pm
post #44 of 152

A

Original message sent by morganchampagne

No problem. She's really sensitive about the whole thing. It's really not a matter if an offender will get caught it's when. She happened to get a real stiff penalty.

If I recall correctly from another of your posts, didn't your friend aggravate the issue by not heeding the cease and desist warning they gave her? I say this to point out that even with warnings folks who want to do these things will find some rationalization for it, thinking it only happens to 'other people not me.'

CalhounsCakery Cake Central Cake Decorator Profile
CalhounsCakery Posted 7 Oct 2013 , 4:50pm
post #45 of 152

Quote:

Originally Posted by morganchampagne 

Could I ask what the big deal is? I mean what's the concern with finding the judgement? I welcome it but I'm just curious why it's such a huge deal. Especially considering it was a warning to help ppl. I didn't accuse anybody on this site of doing anything...so I'm wondering why it seems so important to prove it to be false.

I may have the wrong impression so correct ms if I'm wrong

 

I don't think it's a case of proving it false, but more proving it true.  If people can see it in black and white, as opposed to word of mouth, they believe it easier.  Don't take it to personally.  People are going to talk about it and dissect it as you did post on a public discussion forum.  It's human nature.

CalhounsCakery Cake Central Cake Decorator Profile
CalhounsCakery Posted 7 Oct 2013 , 4:55pm
post #46 of 152

Quote:

Originally Posted by liz at sugar 
 

 

I don't get this logic . . . the copyright law DOES in fact, exist, and people should be basing their decision on that alone, not whether someone has had the law enforced, with evidence attached.

 

Some people continue to break the law, because of ignorance, but why someone needs evidence of prosecution to believe that they have to follow the law is just wrong.

 

Thanks Morgan for sharing the details of your friend's story.  I really don't need to know her name to realize the warning you were trying to relay. :)

 

Liz

 

It's simply because there are many many laws that NEVER get enforced.  They are just ridiculous.  Look up crazy laws sometime.  So if there isn't any hard facts to back it up, it's easy to believe it's one of those laws that are not really enforced.  I know I have never personally seen or heard directly from someone who has had this happen.  I do believe it can happen, don't get me wrong.  I've just never heard or seen concrete proof.  And when I talk about laws that don't really matter anymore, I'm NOT talking about anything that someone has actually been charged with in say the last 40 years.  Nothing that is actually enforced in this day and age.

BrandisBaked Cake Central Cake Decorator Profile
BrandisBaked Posted 7 Oct 2013 , 5:06pm
post #47 of 152

AI think the problem is in how a law is enforced/applied. Copyright laws are meant to prohibit profiting from someone else's product or idea.

If I sell a floral cake that serves 50 for $200, and I sell the same size cake but with a drawing of Hello Kitty on it for the same price, I am not profiting from the sale of Hello Kitty - having a copyright image on it didn't make the sale and didn't make me any more money - it only made a 5 year old girl smile. I will also only likely sell less than 10 cakes with Hello Kitty on them in my lifetime. I am not mass producing Hello Kitty cakes.

Cakes are not durable goods, they are disposable/edible so the laws [B][I]may be[/I][/B] applied differently where the products are meant to be eaten.

So it's not that anyone doubts the existence of copyright law, what some of us are doubting is that they can be applied in the same way to cakes as they are to knockoff designer bags.

DebbyJG Cake Central Cake Decorator Profile
DebbyJG Posted 7 Oct 2013 , 5:11pm
post #48 of 152

ABut this one actually IS enforced, and it's not a stupid crazy law. As cake artists we are rightfully protective of our work when someone steals a cake photo, for instance, and plasters their name on it. But then the same people throw a fit because they can't make Mickey?

kikiandkyle Cake Central Cake Decorator Profile
kikiandkyle Posted 7 Oct 2013 , 5:14pm
post #49 of 152

AI just saw a post on Facebook about someone stealing photos of some superhero cupcakes - never mind that the cupcakes in question had Marvel trademarks all over them.

Like I said in the other thread - if people don't want to believe its true then that's their gamble. It's no loss to me.

jason_kraft Cake Central Cake Decorator Profile
jason_kraft Posted 7 Oct 2013 , 5:17pm
post #50 of 152

A

Original message sent by BrandisBaked

If I sell a floral cake that serves 50 for $200, and I sell the same size cake but with a drawing of Hello Kitty on it for the same price, I am not profiting from the sale of Hello Kitty

The issue is not whether you are profiting from the infringement, in fact infringement can be charged even if there is zero profit. The reasoning behind the law is to protect the IP owner against lost profits. That's why there's no issue with a generic floral cake, but a cake with a Hello Kitty design copied without permission is causing Sanrio to lose money through direct sales, licensing, or potential future licensing. This applies regardless of how long the infringing product exists...a consumable product could even represent a greater loss of revenue.

There are some elements of copyright law that IMO don't make sense, but IP protection in general is essentially the foundation of a good portion of the US economy.

onmymind Cake Central Cake Decorator Profile
onmymind Posted 7 Oct 2013 , 5:18pm
post #51 of 152

AIf she was to be mind a example of than it would have been in the news big time.

If I was a cake deocrator being sued for making a cake with a copyrighted image etc, I would call every newspaper, media outlet etc. around to make the company suing me look like idoits.

I say this because you are taking about a cake that is being eaten and will not be around anymore, understand? It's differnent if you are sewing knock off purses and selling them. For God sake, you are paying homage to the purse by recreating it in cake form for a person that is a fan of the purse.

I would make the company look like bad guys if I was sued. Play it out in the media!

I have to say... if companys really wanted to go after people using their images on cake and sue them and make examples of them, they would just have to look on cake central. There are enough copyrighted images cakes on this site alone to keep them busy with lawsuits!!

Anyone on this site every been sued?? anyone??

This story sounds like a "fairytale"

costumeczar Cake Central Cake Decorator Profile
costumeczar Posted 7 Oct 2013 , 5:19pm
post #52 of 152
Quote:
Originally Posted by morganchampagne 

And this one was 5 years back! So it would take a dedicated person to find it. LV has been going after a lot of people for all kinds of infringements. There's a popular part of town here that sells knock offs. LV came through and rounded them all up!

 

I remember something in the news about that long ago about a bakery being sued by a famous label purse designer, so it might be the same thing. I remember what country it was in but not the designer. I won't post the country in case you're in trouble with your friend already, but I definitely saw a few news stories about it, so it did happen to at least that person. It might be a totally different situation than your friend's experience.

cakesage Cake Central Cake Decorator Profile
cakesage Posted 7 Oct 2013 , 5:21pm
post #53 of 152

AThese companies; Disney, Coach, LV, etc. should be flattered that there products are being advertised. They should pay cake decorators for promoting there films, pocketbooks, shoes...! Incredible, billion dollar company going after the little guy/gal working hard to be able to purchase their products or to be able to take their children to the movies.

This can really be a win win situation for both parties. Don't you think?

jason_kraft Cake Central Cake Decorator Profile
jason_kraft Posted 7 Oct 2013 , 5:22pm
post #54 of 152

A

Original message sent by onmymind

If I was a cake deocrator being sued for making a cake with a copyrighted image etc, I would call every newspaper, media outlet etc. around to make the company suing me look like idoits.

Your plan relies on your ability to out-spin the PR department of a business with millions of dollars at its disposal. Good luck with that.

costumeczar Cake Central Cake Decorator Profile
costumeczar Posted 7 Oct 2013 , 5:24pm
post #55 of 152

I did find the link, so it isn't a fairy tale.

BrandisBaked Cake Central Cake Decorator Profile
BrandisBaked Posted 7 Oct 2013 , 5:27pm
post #56 of 152

AI think cakes fall in line with things like face painting and caricature drawings you have done amusement parks. If you tell the artist you want to be drawn with Mickey Mouse's body, carrying a Louis Vuitton bag and wearing (insert famous shoe designer here) heels - are they SERIOUSLY violating copyright by doing so? It's similar to parody. And while the medium is different, it's still an artist's rendition of a character or good - just in a different medium.

jason_kraft Cake Central Cake Decorator Profile
jason_kraft Posted 7 Oct 2013 , 5:27pm
post #57 of 152

A

Original message sent by cakesage

These companies; Disney, Coach, LV, etc. should be flattered that there products are being advertised. They should pay cake decorators for promoting there films, pocketbooks, shoes...! Incredible, billion dollar company going after the little guy/gal working hard to be able to purchase their products or to be able to take their children to the movies.

This can really be a win win situation for both parties. Don't you think?

So a company invests time and money in creating original creative work and advertising said work to make it so popular in the first place, then they should pay again to cake decorators who will use the company's creative work to profit on cakes?

costumeczar Cake Central Cake Decorator Profile
costumeczar Posted 7 Oct 2013 , 5:27pm
post #58 of 152
Quote:
Originally Posted by cakesage 

These companies; Disney, Coach, LV, etc. should be flattered that there products are being advertised. They should pay cake decorators for promoting
there films, pocketbooks, shoes...! Incredible, billion dollar company going after the little guy/gal working hard to be able to purchase their products or to be able to take their children to the movies.

This can really be a win win situation for both parties. Don't you think?

 

Disney is happy to license their trademarked characters ets, here's the page that will start anyone who's interested on the journey to getting permission. Good luck and take a snack and your wallet with you, it's a long trip. And yes, somewhere buried in there is a bakery goods category, so they do have us poor little cake decorators in mind!

https://www.disneyconsumerproducts.com/Home/display.jsp?contentId=dcp_home_help_licensee_requirements_en&forPrint=false&language=en&preview=false&imageShow=0&pressRoom=US&translationOf=null®ion=0&ccPK=null

BrandisBaked Cake Central Cake Decorator Profile
BrandisBaked Posted 7 Oct 2013 , 5:28pm
post #59 of 152

A

Original message sent by costumeczar

I did find the link, so it isn't a fairy tale.

Are you going to keep us in suspense? :?:D

jason_kraft Cake Central Cake Decorator Profile
jason_kraft Posted 7 Oct 2013 , 5:28pm
post #60 of 152

A

Original message sent by BrandisBaked

If you tell the artist you want to be drawn with Mickey Mouse's body, carrying a Louis Vuitton bag and wearing (insert famous shoe designer here) heels - are they SERIOUSLY violating copyright by doing so?

Yes, if they do not have permission.

Quote by @%username% on %date%

%body%