Question For Those Who Bake From Scratch And Use Mixes...
Decorating By TamiAZ Updated 17 Jul 2011 , 1:21pm by GrandmaG
My business I'm working towards will only be from-scratch recipes with as many organic & natural ingredients as possible. I have a few great ones so far but a few are still being tweaked. My chocolate cupcake recipe is AWESOME and they come out super moist and fluffy. They are not dense at all and oh boy do they go down easy... While it's great for cupcakes though, I wouldn't use the recipe for a cake because it simply is too moist/soft to hold the structure that a layered cake needs.
I've been pretty unimpressed with a few scratch recipes but twice it was my fault (that I'm aware of anyways)- expired baking powder for one resulted in a flat dense icky cake and the other recipe had a really weird taste that I just couldn't get past- the cake itself was much too sweet for my liking.
I also make sure to always use room temperature ingredients unless the recipe states otherwise!
Okay, seriously, how would one taste one of these amazing scratch cakes? Can I order a tasting cake and have it mailed? I don't care what it looks like when it gets here, I'll lick it off the wrapper! lol! I would like to pursue the scratch baking if it is as good or better than a box, and I am a fast learner. I bake from a box because I have never liked scratch cakes, but I would like to be a little more upscale. I have a hard time trying recipes over and over when I have never had a good one. I tried several pancake recipes before I found one and perfected it, because I knew it existed. I do not actually know if this amazing scratch cake exists! I also am getting more and more customers with allergies, I would like to offer cakes that even the people most sensitive to artificial ingredients can eat.
Well, where are you???
Haha! Extreme Northern Kentucky, (transplanted from Arizona.)
I would like to start on finding a good chocolate scratch recipe because I am not happy with any of the boxes I have had. They are all shiny and weird. Really bouncy and spongy. I like the texture of box of white cake better. I did chocolate for a customer yesterday that was a re done mix. It was much less weird, and really good, but I feel if I have to do all kinds of additional things that take time and energy and much more measuring than 3 eggs, 1/3 cup oil and 1 1/4 cup water, why not just use a good scratch recipe? I will use the white as-is, and the yellow, but NOT the chocolate.
And what is up with red velvet? YUCK! It glows in the dark! I really need a more natural one, that is similar to Duncan Hines, because I have 2 customers that RAVE about it and look for it at all our church functions. I won't make it for my kids except for birthdays because i am afraid all that red dye is going to shut down their kidneys.
3) Follow the directions to a "t"
One of my biggest pet peeves is when I'm reading reviews of recipes and the reviewers are complaining that the recipe is inferior when in the next breath their writing about all of the substitutions they made from the original recipe.
I see this all the time! It is the dumbest thing I have ever heard of! "This was flat and dry and weird. I didn't have butter, flour, vanilla and I am a vegan so I used soy margarine, sprouted wheat bread crumbs, and vanilla weight gainer. It was too thick so added some almond and substituted tofu for the egg."
Gee I can't believe it wasn't good!
Thank you for the responses!! The recipe I used this weekend was from Rose Levy Beranbaum's Cake Bible.. It was the yellow butter cake. It was ok. She has another recipe similar to the yellow butter cake except you add white chocolate. I might try that to see if the chocolate makes a difference.
And what is up with red velvet? YUCK! It glows in the dark! I really need a more natural one, that is similar to Duncan Hines, because I have 2 customers that RAVE about it and look for it at all our church functions. I won't make it for my kids except for birthdays because i am afraid all that red dye is going to shut down their kidneys.
I made Bobby Flay's red velvet cake and it was pretty good..
I have some very moist cakes. I know exactly what someone is looking for in a very moist cake. They are nothing like box mixes that have that coated-looking crumb. But I can't define in a few sentences, how I get them moist. .
This is my point you say you have "very moist" cakes--what is that? What defines it is as "super moist?" Not asking you to define how you get them that way, rather what is it that make is "super moist" as to just moist? When does it cease it to be moist and become "super moist"? I don't think these are unfair questions given folks use this terminology to describe their cakes as well make claims about box versus scratch.
If it simply well it is more moist than box cakes, that is not particularly useful since I do not find box mixes particularly "moist." Not that they are dry, but I don't think when I try them "Wow this is super moist" (despite the name of the product). Other things make them unappealing to me which is why I only value moistness as one element among others. What good is a super moist chocolate cake that has a mild chocolate flavor and a poor crumb?
The more people talk about it the less able they seem able to define its qualities. This is not unique to this site as a search of baking sites are not particularly good at explaining the concept either. If it is wetness that really does not seem like moistness of cake--no one describes molten cakes as "moist" yet they are quite "wet."
3) Follow the directions to a "t"
One of my biggest pet peeves is when I'm reading reviews of recipes and the reviewers are complaining that the recipe is inferior when in the next breath their writing about all of the substitutions they made from the original recipe.
I see this all the time! It is the dumbest thing I have ever heard of! "This was flat and dry and weird. I didn't have butter, flour, vanilla and I am a vegan so I used soy margarine, sprouted wheat bread crumbs, and vanilla weight gainer. It was too thick so added some almond and substituted tofu for the egg."
Gee I can't believe it wasn't good!
L..O..L
The more people talk about it the less able they seem able to define its qualities. This is not unique to this site as a search of baking sites are not particularly good at explaining the concept either. If it is wetness that really does not seem like moistness of cake--no one describes molten cakes as "moist" yet they are quite "wet."
I think this is an excellent point, and well made. I think people use the term "moist" too loose, when it's really a subjective term. I also think Super Moist has been adopted as the term for a moist cake because it's on the box of cake mix. It just stuck as the general adjective when describing the texture of cake, much like calling all brown soda Coke regardless of brand.
IMHO, cake is not supposed to be "super moist", and it's not supposed to last for longer then a day or two after it leaves my hands. If you take a slice of bread and leave it on the counter, it's gonna dry out. Same with a muffin, danish, doughnut, and every other gluten concoction out there - yet nobody complains. I don't get the obsession and mindset that a cake should last for days and days and be "super moist" when it's basically the same ingredients in different proportions.
Well, without the yeast, but you all get my point, right?
Anyway, I have had lots of grocery store cake, local bakeries and local cupcake shops that use mixes, and sure, it's moist... but it almost always tastes stale and chewy. Probably because it was baked several days beforehand and had been sitting on a shelf. But hey, it's still moist, right?
I use the word moist to describe the moisture/wetness in the cake. Some cakes need the balance of frosting or fruit filling (or even ice cream) to create a balanced taste while some very moist cakes you could be completely happy eating even without frosting.
I consider a cake to be dry if I can't eat more than a few bites without thinking about downing an entire glass of milk or something with it. If it crumbles easy, is more dense and the crumbs don't stick to your fork when you smush it down, then to me, it's dry.
Moist on the other hand, would be a very fluffy cake with 'sticky' crumbs, as opposed to what I described above. I could eat it with or without a drink and if I used my hands, I'd probably have cake crumbs stuck all over them. The crumbs easily stick to your fork and one another.
I don't know much about moisture vs dry when it comes to box mixes- I dislike them mainly because of all the added and unnecessary ingredients but I can definitely see why many people would use them.
People think that "moist" is the same thing as "spongy" which is the texture that you get from the chemicals in boxed mixes.
People think that "moist" is the same thing as "spongy" which is the texture that you get from the chemicals in boxed mixes.
I think of the chocolate mixes when you say "spongy", it is spongy, just like an actual bathroom sponge with the scrubby on it to clean the tub! It is full of holes and chewy and shiny, but tastes like chocolate.
The white is much finer, but still bouncy.
As Jen said above....I believe that determining just "how" moist a slice of cake is, is subjective, just as taste is subjective.
I also think that some people feel if they place a "super", "very" or "amazingly" before the word moist then it will hold more weight and mean they make a better product. lol
I have a SIL like that. She'll never say that something was just nice, or great, she always has to place an adjective or two in front just to be more convincing. We call her on it all the time. lol
Now take tres leches cake, that's about the wettest cake you'll ever eat. I personally hate it because to me it's like eating pudding, not cake. Maybe that's what it's meant to be, I don't know.
I wouldn't call tres leches cake super moist...I'd call it wet.
I hate my cake to be wet, but I love my cakes to be moist. Just plain ol' moist.
People think that "moist" is the same thing as "spongy" which is the texture that you get from the chemicals in boxed mixes.
I think of the chocolate mixes when you say "spongy", it is spongy, just like an actual bathroom sponge with the scrubby on it to clean the tub! It is full of holes and chewy and shiny, but tastes like chocolate.
The white is much finer, but still bouncy.
Bouncy like a sponge, squish squish!
IMHO, cake is not supposed to be "super moist", and it's not supposed to last for longer then a day or two after it leaves my hands. If you take a slice of bread and leave it on the counter, it's gonna dry out. Same with a muffin, danish, doughnut, and every other gluten concoction out there - yet nobody complains. I don't get the obsession and mindset that a cake should last for days and days and be "super moist" when it's basically the same ingredients in different proportions.
Well, without the yeast, but you all get my point, right?
Anyway, I have had lots of grocery store cake, local bakeries and local cupcake shops that use mixes, and sure, it's moist... but it almost always tastes stale and chewy. Probably because it was baked several days beforehand and had been sitting on a shelf. But hey, it's still moist, right?
Important to remember though that cakes vary so much from recipe to recipe...mud cakes for example are at their best after a few days. I have one particular recipe for a white chocolate mud cake that stipulates it must be wrapped well and stored at room temperature for a week before decorating & eating. And traditional fruit cake should be aged for a minimum of three weeks...I generally age mine for 3 to 6 months, which is common. But a light & airy true sponge cake needs to be baked & eaten the same day - you can't serve it up next day, by then it's stale.
Important to remember though that cakes vary so much from recipe to recipe...mud cakes for example are at their best after a few days. I have one particular recipe for a white chocolate mud cake that stipulates it must be wrapped well and stored at room temperature for a week before decorating & eating. And traditional fruit cake should be aged for a minimum of three weeks...I generally age mine for 3 to 6 months, which is common. But a light & airy true sponge cake needs to be baked & eaten the same day - you can't serve it up next day, by then it's stale.
Very true - my American brain only thinks of our sweet butter cakes - I've never had or seen a mud cake, and fruit cake is something people re-gift at Christmas because they are gross. And totally NOT the same thing you are talking about . Actually, I've been wanting to try mud cake after chatting up all you Aussies, or at least see a picture of what one looks like on the inside. Do you have a picture of a sliced cake? Do you happen to have a recipe to share? Is the texture really dense like the word mud implies?
Totally off topic!
Jen 
Important to remember though that cakes vary so much from recipe to recipe...mud cakes for example are at their best after a few days. I have one particular recipe for a white chocolate mud cake that stipulates it must be wrapped well and stored at room temperature for a week before decorating & eating. And traditional fruit cake should be aged for a minimum of three weeks...I generally age mine for 3 to 6 months, which is common. But a light & airy true sponge cake needs to be baked & eaten the same day - you can't serve it up next day, by then it's stale.
Very true - my American brain only thinks of our sweet butter cakes - I've never had or seen a mud cake, and fruit cake is something people re-gift at Christmas because they are gross. And totally NOT the same thing you are talking about
. Actually, I've been wanting to try mud cake after chatting up all you Aussies, or at least see a picture of what one looks like on the inside. Do you have a picture of a sliced cake? Do you happen to have a recipe to share? Is the texture really dense like the word mud implies? Totally off topic!
Jen
Hear, hear! Me, too! I'd gladly muddle my way through translating a recipe. Especially a caramel mud.
Yeah! I'd love to try a mud cake too...please please share your recipe! It just sounds like rich sweet heaven!
As for the scratch debate...I love seriouscakes scratch yellow cake recipe and the scratch was recipe...both are so easy to tweak with different flavours. The only people who have ever complained about my cakes are people who are only used to box cakes. Personally, I have never found the cakes to be dry..I've had the yellow cake for almost a week, sneaking a slice here and there and it was awesome...now my friends and family are ruined! They hate box mixes now!
Yeah! I'd love to try a mud cake too...please please share your recipe! It just sounds like rich sweet heaven!
As for the scratch debate...I love seriouscakes scratch yellow cake recipe and the scratch was recipe...both are so easy to tweak with different flavours. The only people who have ever complained about my cakes are people who are only used to box cakes. Personally, I have never found the cakes to be dry..I've had the yellow cake for almost a week, sneaking a slice here and there and it was awesome...now my friends and family are ruined! They hate box mixes now!
I've ruined many people...I consider it my calling One of my daughter's friends wouldn't even eat her own birthday cake because she said it wasn't as good as mine.
Very moist cakes from scratch: All are moist in their own right, but then I add more moisture.
Pumpkin Carrot Cake: Unusually moist because of the pumpkin. My Carrot Cake is already moist when the fresh pineapple is added. The pumpkin brings it to another level of moist. One of the best cakes I offer.
Pineapple Upside Down Cake: Unusually moist becuse of the fresh pineapple/butter/brown sugar that starts the process and seeps through th batter during baking. Adding Myers Rum to the batter moistens it more.
Bailey's Irish Cream Cake, Coconut Cake, Boston Cream Pie, Chambord Cake: All more moist than the average cake due to the homemade custards and pastry cream used as fillings and allowed to mingle with the already-moist cake.
Hummingbird Cake: Due to the bananas and pineapple in the cake batter.
Chocolate Cake: one of my recipes is dense and has a very moist mouth feel even though it is a firm cake.
Directly opposite the hummingbird cake, I have a banana cake that is as light as air. I pair it with a mocha FBC for a decadent flavor combination.
Buddy's Pastry Cream Cake: The ultimate in moist cake... two cups of homemade pastry cream in the batter... optional. The cake can stand alone without the cream.
Shall I go on... no I do not just say it to make it more appealing in written word. I have many more where those came from. These moist cakes are huge crowd-pleasers and all except for the Pumpkin Carrot Cake can handle fondant. Pineapple upside down can be turned right side up for a clean edge.
I work hard to create cakes that will blend in with the fillings and frostings, not just introduce three unrelated flavors. I'm sure you can tell that I'm anal about my recipes. As I said before, many people who taste my cakes, etc., have not had an opportunity to taste a really good scratch cake. And again, it is rare that I have had a really good scratch cake.
Not all cakes need to be moist or super moist, it just needs to blend. That banana cake I mentioned is close to feeling dry. But together, it is one of the best cakes I have ever had.
I have shelves of books by chefs who bake similar to me. It isn't a secret, but it is time-consuming and expensive to bake like this. And obviously, the experiments are expensive. My cost is usually between $20 to $25 in ingredients for an 8 inch cake. So a tiered cake or sheet cake can get quite expensive.
My dairy products, including my sour cream comes from a local dairy. The difference is night and day and I think this has a huge impact on my cakes, fillings, and frostings. The heavy cream has to be shaken out of the bottle. And these ingredients are expensive. Vanilla bean paste will add moisture in a cake. I am heavy-handed and it is suspended in a syrup. This is just a tiny factor, but it all adds up.
These are just the super-moist examples. I have many that are normal (but still moist), as that is the texture I need with a particular combination. And a few are very light.
I've never heard of a humming bird cake, what is it? I guess I could google
My daughter's 16 year old boyfriend loved it so much, he ate seven pieces... and the threw up.
You westerners don't know what you are missing. This is a southern cake. Bananas and pineapple, pecans, cinnamon... with a cream cheese frosting and sprinkled with more pecans.
I don't know if it's traditional or not, maybe it's the island girl in me...I add a sprinkling of shredded coconut to my hummingbird cake...I think it comes out delicious that way!
Cayman, I have always thought that Hummingbird cakes could use a little coconut. In the cake or on the frosting, or both?
It wouldn't be traditional, but I specify in the descriptions whether they are classic or a new version. On some cake flavors, I offer both.
Well that sounds really good, does it taste like pineapple or does that only add sweetness and moistness? Now I'm intrigued. I just googled a recipe and it looks really similar to my carrot ginger cake sans carrot/ginger + pineapple/pecans. Hurm, maybe an experiment soon!
Do you use fresh or canned pineapple? I wonder if I can get that organic?
Jen
I use Southern Living's (not the new "light" one, but the old one from about 2005) as a base and of course I have to change it, but so do you. I use real pineapple and juice. It doesn't taste like either one... just like a carrot cake. Add more cinnamon, use lots of vanilla bean paste, a little homemade vanilla if you have it, 4 bananas, and my cream cheese recipe is the one I always use with lots of butter and as little powdered sugar as I can get away with, plus vanilla bean paste. For the pineapple, it would be equal to an 8 oz can of crushed, and juice from memory of how much may be in a can of crushed pineapple. The fresh pineapple may not have enough. It is still traditional if you want to add a hint of pineapple juice to your frosting
People think that "moist" is the same thing as "spongy" which is the texture that you get from the chemicals in boxed mixes.
Some scratch cakes are spongy. My version of the Hershey's chocolate cake (sour cream and coffee instead of milk and water) is what I would consider spongy....maybe "fluffy" is a more positive way to describe the texture. Perhaps oil cakes, as opposed to butter cakes, tend to have the fluffy texture that some people enjoy.
Quote by @%username% on %date%
%body%