Refunding Deposit, Help!!

Business By KalisCakes Updated 16 Jun 2011 , 6:50pm by bakingatthebeach

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KalisCakes Posted 9 Jun 2011 , 5:22pm
post #271 of 413

hmmm... I don't think you can use that word on here; i think it has to be in the "naught cakes" threads lol
I'm not avoiding direct questions, and I've encouraged they be asked.
Have a wonderful trip WykdGud!

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snowboarder Posted 9 Jun 2011 , 5:27pm
post #272 of 413
Quote:
Originally Posted by WykdGud

As I've said, I have no desire to attack anyone.




So you've said. Repeatedly. In multiple threads, where you've stirred the pot while providing the CC community with a synopsis of your long career in the legal field. You're the current pot stirrer. Congratulations.

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WykdGud Posted 9 Jun 2011 , 5:29pm
post #273 of 413

Ok then, since you are encouraging that they be asked, before I sign off, I will throw out a few:

1. If you really were not aware they were trying to contact you, why were the emails already printed out when the reporter showed up at your door?

2. Were you really not listening to your voicemails or looking at emails for an entire month?

3. If you weren't responding to current customers, why did you feel it was important to respond to prospective ones? Wouldn't those who have already entrusted you with the task of making their cake take priority?

4. How can you be receiving correspondence from the internet about new customers but not emails from current ones?

5. If you really have a web designer, why did it only take minutes to get the stolen photos removed? You say you don't know how to do that, and that you had a very tense conversation with your web designer (who has taken all the blame for the stolen pics) - but they were down within MINUTES. How did you have time to call her up, yell at her, and she goes to the computer, logs into your account and makes the changes so quickly? I wish my web designer had that kind of lightening speed!

Ok, now really ... I'm done. Happy baking.

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WykdGud Posted 9 Jun 2011 , 5:31pm
post #274 of 413
Quote:
Originally Posted by snowboarder

Quote:
Originally Posted by WykdGud

As I've said, I have no desire to attack anyone.



So you've said. Repeatedly. In multiple threads, where you've stirred the pot while providing the CC community with a synopsis of your long career in the legal field. You're the current pot stirrer. Congratulations.




I prefer "Caked Crusader". Truth, justice and buttercream for all!

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cakesmith_duane Posted 9 Jun 2011 , 5:39pm
post #275 of 413

There are two VERY important things in any business - Reputation & Communication. If your reputation is shot then it will be a hard hard road - it's like having bad credit, nobody will deal with you. All these negative news stories - they are KILLING your reputation. Sorry.

In ref to communication - well that's a no brainer, if you don't or won't communicate with anyone, especially customers - it won't be long before you have no work. It doesn't really matter if it's by phone, email, fax, etc. you have to get in touch with customers. If you take a vacation - don't take orders and post it all over your website that you will be on vacation from June 00 to July 00. Then, have your emails autoresponse saying "Hey thank you for getting in contact with us, we would love to have your business. We want to let you know that the bakery will be closed from blah to blah - we will be on vacation. Thanks again and we will get in touch as soon as we return." Or, something like that!

I'm terrible at communicating on the phone, as well. But, I do try to answer any and all communications within 24 hours. You should make this a rule and possibly place it on your website. "If we don't answer the phone, it just means we are busy creating another cake masterpiece - we will return your call in less then 24 hours - thank you and leave a message."

Sorry, I am rambling - I hope things work out. Focus on damage control - get your rep and communication straightened out. Also, I would contact all those happy people that love your stuff and get some testimonials together. Maybe purchase some ad space or a commercial and plaster your name and the testimonials all over everything - just ideas. Take care.

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jason_kraft Posted 9 Jun 2011 , 5:41pm
post #276 of 413
Quote:
Originally Posted by WykdGud

Ok then, since you are encouraging that they be asked, before I sign off, I will throw out a few:

1. If you really were not aware they were trying to contact you, why were the emails already printed out when the reporter showed up at your door?

2. Were you really not listening to your voicemails or looking at emails for an entire month?

3. If you weren't responding to current customers, why did you feel it was important to respond to prospective ones? Wouldn't those who have already entrusted you with the task of making their cake take priority?

4. How can you be receiving correspondence from the internet about new customers but not emails from current ones?

5. If you really have a web designer, why did it only take minutes to get the stolen photos removed? You say you don't know how to do that, and that you had a very tense conversation with your web designer (who has taken all the blame for the stolen pics) - but they were down within MINUTES. How did you have time to call her up, yell at her, and she goes to the computer, logs into your account and makes the changes so quickly? I wish my web designer had that kind of lightening speed!

Ok, now really ... I'm done. Happy baking.



Congrats, that quoted post is how you should be addressing points in threads. Stick to this format in the future and you will be better received by the community.

I can speak to the last point...I am a web designer and it really does only take a few minutes to remove a picture. If one of my clients called me saying they needed an urgent change like this, it would be done within 2 minutes.

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KalisCakes Posted 9 Jun 2011 , 5:46pm
post #277 of 413

1. If you really were not aware they were trying to contact you, why were the emails already printed out when the reporter showed up at your door?

The reporter came to my door. I was in my laundry clothes (very trailer park moment lol). I told her I'd be happy to speak with her, and asked if I could take a moment to change clothes, because obviously, what I was wearing wasn't appropriate for an on tape interview. She naturally agreed; I asked her what files I needed to pull and have ready for the interview. She informed me. I had, about thirty minutes prior, responded to the emails, so after I changed clothes I pulled the files in question and printed out emails.

2. Were you really not listening to your voice mails or looking at emails for an entire month?

I really did not check voicemails. I would glance over email subjects from my cell phone every now and then, but I did not see hers because they were not in the actual inbox. It wasn't until late Sunday evening when I found out she came to my home that that I was made aware she was frantic to get in contact with me.

3. If you weren't responding to current customers, why did you feel it was important to respond to prospective ones? Wouldn't those who have already entrusted you with the task of making their cake take priority?

It isn't that I wasn't responding to customers, past, current, or new. It's that I wasn't checking my email or my voicemails. I made the mistake of assuming that because current clients have used my online booking system before, they would know to do so now, especially if there was an emergency. I was relying on the online booking to be my communication between myself and my clients. The online booking notifies my on my personal cell phone when someone has requested an appt.

4. How can you be receiving correspondence from the internet about new customers but not emails from current ones?

The online booking notifies my on my personal cell phone when someone has requested an appt.

5. If you really have a web designer, why did it only take minutes to get the stolen photos removed? You say you don't know how to do that, and that you had a very tense conversation with your web designer (who has taken all the blame for the stolen pics) - but they were down within MINUTES. How did you have time to call her up, yell at her, and she goes to the computer, logs into your account and makes the changes so quickly? I wish my web designer had that kind of lightening speed!

The girl who did my page is a friend of a friend. She does pages for extra income. Her "real" job requires her to be in front of a computer all day. She responded so quickly most likely because we have been in close contact since this all started adjusting the page to add the contract and the FAQ section. On this I am assuming however. I'd be happy to call her if you'd like and ask her why she was so quick to do as I asked.

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KalisCakes Posted 9 Jun 2011 , 5:51pm
post #278 of 413

Thank you for the advice Duane! I completely understand what you're saying, and agree with all of it.
I really like your wording for the website. Would you mind if I used it?

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crisseyann Posted 9 Jun 2011 , 5:59pm
post #279 of 413

I'm not sure how to do the quote thing with previous posts so bear with me on this. LOL

Posted: Mon Jun 06, 2011 3:16 pm







--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I just had one of the local news station come by my home requesting an interview. They're got a friend at one of the stations. Thankfully, I have all paper trails, etc. so I've printed everything out, contracts included, photos, etc. We'll see how this goes.
Any advice on what to say/not to say??

The above post by the OP puzzles me. She says the reporter stops by, requests an interview, allows her time to change, clean up, get her papers in order and yet she comes on CC to ask for advice?

hmmmmm, not sure, but I doubt I would or could be bothered with going online, while the reporter is waiting, just to ask strangers for advice.

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cakesmith_duane Posted 9 Jun 2011 , 6:08pm
post #280 of 413

KalisCakes - sure you can use the info I mentioned. Also, check out Jason's website he has done a very nice job with his reviews page (hope you don't mind Jason) -

http://www.allergyfriendlypastries.com/reviews.html

Take care
Cakesmith

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gatorcake Posted 9 Jun 2011 , 6:08pm
post #281 of 413
Quote:
Originally Posted by WykdGud

Ok then, since you are encouraging that they be asked, before I sign off, I will throw out a few:

1. If you really were not aware they were trying to contact you, why were the emails already printed out when the reporter showed up at your door?

2. Were you really not listening to your voicemails or looking at emails for an entire month?

3. If you weren't responding to current customers, why did you feel it was important to respond to prospective ones? Wouldn't those who have already entrusted you with the task of making their cake take priority?

4. How can you be receiving correspondence from the internet about new customers but not emails from current ones?

5. If you really have a web designer, why did it only take minutes to get the stolen photos removed? You say you don't know how to do that, and that you had a very tense conversation with your web designer (who has taken all the blame for the stolen pics) - but they were down within MINUTES. How did you have time to call her up, yell at her, and she goes to the computer, logs into your account and makes the changes so quickly? I wish my web designer had that kind of lightening speed!

Ok, now really ... I'm done. Happy baking.




Wow really? These questions are supposed to support your claim she is not being truthful? These reflect nothing more than terrible investigating skills (not a personal attack by your standard as I did not call you a terrible investigator).

All of these have been addressed and your refusal to believe the answers owes nothing to finding holes in the story but your belief no one would run their business this way.

Your questions have either already been answered (question 4 was addressed on page 14), or the OP has already accepted responsibility for admitting that she needs to address this segment of her business. Believe her or don't but your refusal to believe her based on your assumptions about how people should/would run their business is not proof she is lying, being dishonest, or trying to deceive members of the forum.

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KalisCakes Posted 9 Jun 2011 , 6:21pm
post #282 of 413
Quote:
Originally Posted by crisseyann

I'm not sure how to do the quote thing with previous posts so bear with me on this. LOL

Posted: Mon Jun 06, 2011 3:16 pm







--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I just had one of the local news station come by my home requesting an interview. They're got a friend at one of the stations. Thankfully, I have all paper trails, etc. so I've printed everything out, contracts included, photos, etc. We'll see how this goes.
Any advice on what to say/not to say??

The above post by the OP puzzles me. She says the reporter stops by, requests an interview, allows her time to change, clean up, get her papers in order and yet she comes on CC to ask for advice?

hmmmmm, not sure, but I doubt I would or could be bothered with going online, while the reporter is waiting, just to ask strangers for advice.




They came to my door. I asked her to come back. She agreed. I changed clothes, got the files, and as I was printing out email, posted on here. Public speaking has always made me nervous, and since there was no one home for me to run to, I posted on here. For advice, for support, to know I'm not alone.... take your pick. Just because I don't personally know people in this forum doesn't mean I don't value advice given. This forum is for people in this industry, who have a wealth of collective knowledge to draw from. If I have access to this knowledge, it seems to me that this would be the first place I'd come to for advice rather than the last.

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Kaybaby Posted 9 Jun 2011 , 6:24pm
post #283 of 413

My last post on this subject. I live in this town and I can assure you that anyone that saw that report will not use this bakery. They will tell their friends etc. Regardless of the factuality or accuracy of the report, the damage is done. And in this town, it means forever.

Vonda

ETA to add that not long ago there was a party planner that advertised Princess birthday parties. For a fee, you could chose the princesses that would come to your party. She was also on TV claiming her innocence. She was then arrested for fraud.

In this case, the party planner was guilty. It is still fresh on viewers minds. Most folks aren't going to take the time to find out if the bakery is wrong or right, they will just not use them. Sad, but true.

Vonda

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crisseyann Posted 9 Jun 2011 , 6:29pm
post #284 of 413

Thank you for clarifying that for me. I (wrongfully) assumed they were waiting there, ready to go with the interview. I apologize. Best of luck to you through all of this. icon_smile.gif

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hellie0h Posted 9 Jun 2011 , 6:33pm
post #285 of 413

Hmm, there are so many holes in this story you might want to call it swiss cheese.

If you have ever been in law enforcement or an investigator, you are trained in techniques such as Wykd mentioned. You become callous in all aspects of your life, even family and friends are not safe from your analysis. You will look for discrepancy in statements, such as persons changing bits of their story, body language too. With that said, whether or not Chasing Butteflies is telling the truth or not is not the point really.

I won't elaborate on what has already been stated, but you have done yourself some pretty severe damage by just granting an interview...why would you do this? If some reporter called me or came to my door, I would tell them to hit the road. You need to give the refund to this woman, for whatever reason if not just for trying to salvage your business. I looked at your contract, if I were a perspective customer I would be looking elsewhere mainly because of the portion, stating if YOU meaning Chasing Butterflies, break the contract for whatever reason, they meaning the client will get refunded but not until 90 days....what's up with that?

If you don't have working capitol maybe you should not spend the deposit before the cake is to be finished and paid in full. CYA is all I have to add.

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KalisCakes Posted 9 Jun 2011 , 6:38pm
post #286 of 413

Thank you for pointing that out Helen. I hadn't really thought anything of it. No, working capital is not an issue. Any thoughts on what the refund time frame should be?

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hellie0h Posted 9 Jun 2011 , 6:45pm
post #287 of 413
Quote:
Originally Posted by KalisCakes

Thank you for pointing that out Helen. I hadn't really thought anything of it. No, working capital is not an issue. Any thoughts on what the refund time frame should be?





Kiddo, I always try to follow the golden rule, do onto to others as you have them do onto you. Put yourself in a clients shoes, if you will, or your own shoes lol if you have had any problems taking something back to a store, you want what is rightfully yours within a reasonable time. I would not advise anything beyond 5 business days as a refund time line. Just be reasonable, your clients are not your enemies, they are your bread and butter.

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GatuPR Posted 9 Jun 2011 , 6:58pm
post #288 of 413

When I posted, I thought those were your photos icon_confused.gif . Personally, I don't think I would have allowed a news reporter in my home. I would have said a simple no comment and talk to a lawyer for advise. Your very brave.

I stopped watching the video half way thru because I couldn't believe the questions the reporter was asking the OP. I felt so bad, sorry you had to go thru all that.

I think is extreme to say that noone would use the OPs bakery ever again. This was just a miscommunication problem between the OP and a few clients. She has since apologized and is making changes so that it won't happen again.

Cakesmith_duane, I agree with your statement.

JMHO

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Dayti Posted 9 Jun 2011 , 7:32pm
post #289 of 413

If I were in Kalis' shoes, and knew I was innocent and had valid points to make to back up my situation, I would definitely want the chance to get the interview. I think telling the reporter that you didn't want to talk would end up being reported as "baker was unavailable to comment/didn't want to comment/is clearly to busy to be bothered/is still on "vacation"/whatever other bad excuse they want to make up", just so that her side of the situation is not covered, making the clients points stronger.

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GatuPR Posted 9 Jun 2011 , 7:41pm
post #290 of 413

But what happened is that they didn't report/show the whole story. I don't live in that area and I don't get their news, but from what I get they only show a little of the interview on tv, not the whole thing. So unless you go online and see the whole story, your left believing an incomplete story. Not fair to the OP.

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enchantedcreations Posted 9 Jun 2011 , 7:55pm
post #291 of 413

Hi, I've been reading this since the beginning and just want to add my 2 cents for what it's worth.....

KalisCakes, sorry this has happened to you for what ever reason or reasons. No one wants unhappy clients.

With that being said, you have to do call backs. Whether you want to or not. Everyone wants to hear nice, warm, fuzzy voices on the other end of that phone. It's part of the business world. Set an hour each day to make return calls as well as email follow-ups. Even if its just to say hello and to touch base. You're letting that person know their business is important to you and you've not forgotten about them. That's all anyone wants.

Perhaps you over-extended yourself? Just a thought....

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KSMill Posted 9 Jun 2011 , 8:16pm
post #292 of 413

KalisCakes, I'm so sorry this happened to you and hope that your attorney has been helpful. I just read an update posted by the reporter yesterday and it seems she still doesn't understand the deposit and that at least one cake wasn't even due yet. You didn't leave your customers hanging high and dry without a cake at their event. I do understand you had one "no-pay" that you didn't make the cake for, but what is with people expecting products or services without paying for them.
Pre-pay is standard in the wedding industry as it is in most custom businesses.

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Evoir Posted 10 Jun 2011 , 1:12am
post #293 of 413

Oh boy.

We have a word for this kind of thing down under and it rhymes with blusterduck.

If your accusers are lying about you and making sh*t up about your business practices, you say to the reporters at your doorstep "I suggest you check your facts very carefully before publishing anything, less you be liable for slander".

This is usually enough to kill a story dead, as most 'reporters' will not publish hearsay, or do the hard yards researching a story (even Kalis' reporter only put topgether a back story AFTER the fact, which was after 10 pages of comments on the Fox "News" website).

Instead you have now a three-ring circus, and unfortunately irreparable damage to your business.

I wish you all the best, Kalis. Please learn from the lessons taught...PR and communication are vital. Plus - you are a small business owner, and like it or not, the concept of "9 to 5" is not feasible. Your business is your responsibility 24/7...and THAT means ensuring you have electronic methods in place to "handhold and soothe" as others have said, when you are not available to answer a phone live. HOWEVER, you MUST set in place a system for getting back to those people in a timely manner.

I'm really glad you decided to pull the phony photos off your website too. That, too, is a step in the right direction as far as clear communication with your clients goes!

Good luck icon_smile.gif

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Baker_Rose Posted 10 Jun 2011 , 4:50pm
post #294 of 413

"Vacation" Going away from home and thinking the whole time about how much sh*t you have to do when you get back.

"Stay-cation" Staying home and getting all your sh*t done!!


Tami icon_smile.gif

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kdthatsme Posted 12 Jun 2011 , 6:59pm
post #295 of 413
Quote:
Originally Posted by jenmat

what exactly happened with the damaged cake? Was it a disaster, or just slightly damaged? How did you handle the situation?
If you handled it according to your contract, and if the damage wasn't too bad, I guess I may not refund it. If the damage was extensive and if you had a hard time dealing with the bride after the fact, then I would refund the money right away.
You are already going to have bad pr from both this couple and the first couple. If you stick to your guns too hard, you may have even more issues with other couples that have booked with you. (they all seem to know each other around here!)
Definitely, whatever you do, acknowledge their feelings and your embarrassment over the disaster. I can completely feel for them, even though accidents do happen, I would expect to be getting refund requests if other couples were at the wedding.
No fun.




How you handled the other persons wedding cake does not matter at all towards this customer. I am sure you handled it appropriately, but even if you screwed it up completely it does not change the fact that 1) They signed a contract with you and 2) That contract was explained to them before this wedding.

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Eltorro Posted 14 Jun 2011 , 4:47am
post #296 of 413

I have been following this and Just thought everyone should know there are more complaints about this business. http://www.kfoxtv.com/video/28227643/index.html The woman crying is so sad, the uncut interview is worth watching as well. I don't know what to believe all I know is I got interested because I am going to need a cake soon icon_smile.gif

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jason_kraft Posted 14 Jun 2011 , 5:08am
post #297 of 413
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eltorro

I have been following this and Just thought everyone should know there are more complaints about this business. http://www.kfoxtv.com/video/28227643/index.html The woman crying is so sad, the uncut interview is worth watching as well. I don't know what to believe all I know is I got interested because I am going to need a cake soon icon_smile.gif



It looks like this issue has already been addressed...based on an email from the OP a personal emergency prevented the cake from being delivered, and OP has agreed to give the customer a full refund, she is waiting to receive a mailing address to send the refund check.

http://www.kfoxtv.com/news/28225466/detail.html

Another story blown out of proportion, but it still looks bad that all of this stuff is happening to the OP in a short amount of time.

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Brevity Posted 14 Jun 2011 , 5:40am
post #298 of 413

Having not read every single post, I may have just missed it, but do we know what the 'extreme personal emergency' was? If I was under such a public attack, I'd play every sympathy card I could, and start spilling.

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vaniti716 Posted 14 Jun 2011 , 7:44am
post #299 of 413

I have been on the side of the OP since the beginning and have read every single post and like others here have felt really bad for her...but after seeing the other couple that paid their entire balance but never got their cake or their money I am a little confused....i know things beyond our control can happen and when things happen to our children there is no in between as to where your priorities would be...but why have you not contacted the bride yourself and explained what happened to her???? i feel soooo bad for her....I am not putting any blame on you so pls dont think that i am attacking you because I am honeslty on your side but I am just confused about that brides cake....her not getting it, or her money or a chance to spk to you....you are a wonderful artist and i do hope this blows over for you but this bride is really hurt.....has this been resolved already????

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Foxicakes Posted 14 Jun 2011 , 8:00am
post #300 of 413
Quote:
Originally Posted by snowboarder

Quote:
Originally Posted by WykdGud

As I've said, I have no desire to attack anyone.



So you've said. Repeatedly. In multiple threads, where you've stirred the pot while providing the CC community with a synopsis of your long career in the legal field. You're the current pot stirrer. Congratulations.





Couldn't have said it better myself!!

Further, I thought that the purpose of these forums were to be encouraging to each other. It really disturbs me to see that these threads get SO out of hand and no mod seems to do anything about them. There are definitely people on here that never have a good thing to say about or to anyone. They never believe what any of the OP's have to say and their collective "MO's" seem to be to go on the attack, all the while prefacing themselves with "I don't want to attack anyone" or something similar.
Personally, I have taken my own amount of abuse when voicing my opinions on these forums. For whatever reason people don't feel as though they are speaking to real live human beings when they sit at their computer and spew their venom. However, the point should be made that we ARE humans--with feelings and if you have a differing opinion, that's fine. But to flat out call someone a liar and a thief totally crosses the line and is completely inappropriate.
I am sick to death of the "Pot Stirrers"! I come to this site and read these forums for support and help when I have an issue with caking. I do NOT come here for the negativity and to read posts where people feel the need to be ugly and call each other names!!! If you feel the need to say those things to someone, then at least have the common courtesy to take it off of the public forum and PM that person. If they don't answer you back, then obviously THEY don't want to listen to your crap either.
It still astounds me how completely Middle School some people still are well into their adult years! I actually had one of these "chronic pot stirrers" PM me recently when I had mentioned a member having great business advice. This person started the email off by saying that the member had "great advice" but that I "probably shouldn't follow it because her business went under and she had to declare bankruptcy!! She followed that by saying that she "really likes" this person. Wow. REALLY? What would you say if you DIDN'T like her??

We just don't need that type of people on here!! I'm not naive enough to think that everyone is always going to get along and agree on every point. However, I also don't think that I am out of line in believing that we should all be able to voice our opinions or discuss things that are going on without the fear of being ganged up on and called a liar.
As for the OP, I think that SCP said it best when she pointed out that this OP has admitted fault where there was fault. And, yes, there are several of us that would have handled this differently...we hope. Truth is, that you never know HOW you will handle a situation until you are knee-deep in the middle of it! And, to say you do, is only fooling yourself. But, again, as SCP stated earlier in the thread, this OP has stuck around and answered all of our questions and even addressed the accusations. So, it would seem to me, that if she were lying or had something to hide, she would have stopped answering and addressing comments a while ago...
In my opinion she has handled all of this with grace, dignity, but most of all, humility. . . I wish you luck LeeAnn.

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