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I started it, let's talk about it... - Page 2

post #16 of 183
I am also in Florida, Jacksonville, huge city NO commercial rental space available (the only one recently closed). And I know you Cannot bake from home and be legal. That means you cannot obtain a license from the city and therefore cannot get insurance (a required proof to get professional insurnace in Florida). I also know for tax purposes you can make upto $600 (might be more now, check) a year without having to file taxes (in Florida we have no income tax). I would suggest you continue to bake, do not advertise, and "charge" for your ingredients. You wont make money but you will gain experience and not be in the poor house.

PS- you can aslo use your other company to order ingredients wholesale. Just be sure to add the expense into your other business as "orders".

I wish you luck!
post #17 of 183
Niki, I feel your pain. It's not allowed in my state either, unless I build a separate building on my property etc etc. So, I continue to bake/decorate cakes for free for friends/family as gifts. Thankfully, my husband is very understanding and doesn't complain about how much $$$ I'm giving away lol.

It's a tough situation, especially for those of us who have NO DESIRE to own a biz. My husband has been a small-biz owner for many years, and there's no way I'm getting myself into that! The accounting, paperwork, legalities, etc...no thanks. All I wanna do is bake/decorate. I've even been in contact with every bakery in my area, just trying to see if I can work part-time becuase I love doing this...no one is hiring. So, I'll keep giving my stuff away. Yeah, it sucks bit it is what it is.
post #18 of 183
Living where we CAN have a licensed home kitchen, I can only partially feel for you.

Doing things under the radar is something that a lot of people do, I did it for about 3 weddings before licensing the kitchen, they were for family members, and yes, I felt so weird and scared doing them.

From a purely practical standpoint, I think another problem that you will run into (besides what's already been mentioned- ie arrest etc) is that I don't think very many venues would let you into their facility as an unlicensed baker. I know most of them up here don't. So you're going to have a hard time cracking into that business anyway, which is where the money is that you're seeking for startup.

"there HAS to be a way." There is a way- do your research and take a leap with a licensed kitchen or a storefront....or move.
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post #19 of 183
Quote:
Originally Posted by TattooMom25

I am also in Florida, Jacksonville, huge city NO commercial rental space available (the only one recently closed).


You may want to contact Blue Oven Kitchens, they are working on an incubator kitchen in Gainesville and may be open to a Jacksonville location if it is indeed underserved.

http://www.blueovenkitchens.org/facilities/

Quote:
Quote:

I also know for tax purposes you can make upto $600 (might be more now, check) a year without having to file taxes (in Florida we have no income tax).


The $600 rule applies to employers, if they pay out less than $600 they do not need to file a 1099. All your income must be declared, even income from illegal activities.

Of course, since many businesses start out in the red, declaring negative net income would be to your advantage. In our first year of operations we got a few thousand dollars off our personal income tax bill because of our business loss. This is only true when operating a business though, hobby losses are not deductible.
post #20 of 183
From the IRS 1040 manual:
"Chart COther Situations When You Must File
You must file a return if any of the four conditions below apply for 2009.
3. You had net earnings from self-employment of at least $400.*

* my mistake you would be considered "self employeed" so the cap is $400 assuimg you are married filing jointly
post #21 of 183
Quote:
Originally Posted by -K8memphis

The problem with operating this way is you have no leverage. You have to operate at the whim and mercy of each client. That's how you have to do it. You can't push back and you know in many threads there's tons of push back necessary to be fully functional.

So as far as how to do it, it only makes sense to do it for real and legit otherwise it's just not good for you. It's not right to do wrong in order to have a business.

I understand the kids and the time and everything, btdt.

Go get a job, part time if necessary. If you have muchkins still at home then you have to cut expenses and be poor some more and wait it out. When a friend or family member needs a cake --go for it. Otherwise no. But if you're not even pricing right why freaking bother.

Every Tom Dick and Harry can bake and decorate a cake. Ever hear of Wilton or ? Huge market. Huge. Matha's in on it now? Oh yeah cake making is so exclusive--NOT!!

Then everybody who eats it says, <in sing song voice> "You need to open a bus-i-ness".

It's too hard to make money doing this unless you open it up right or move to Virginia or Kentucky or Ohio or someplace where it's ok from the home. Just say no. Not worth it. Go get a real job.



I just want to point out that you CANNOT do it from the home in KY. Otherwise I completely agree. You can in Michigan and sort of in IN., but NOT KY. I know, I live here!
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post #22 of 183
I haven't read anything but the orignal posting, but I wanted to point out that illegal kitchens are going to have more and more problems running a "wedding business". In our area, most reputiable venues are now requiring proof of libility insurance before they will allow your cake. One Venue is even only allowing cakes from their preferred vendor list. No other cakes. I have had a couple of brides call me with a change for thier caterer because they weren't legal. I am glad to see this trend, as it helps save those of us who have taken the time, and money, and pride, to be legal, whatever is called legal in your state. (home, rented kitchen, etc) Many national hotels (like Marriot) are requiring proof of insurance, even for the DJ!! Weddings are getting so expensive, and so many brides/grooms/families/people in general are sue happy, that these venues need to protect themselves.

I hope this becomes a national trend.
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post #23 of 183
Quote:
Originally Posted by Annabakescakes

Quote:
Originally Posted by -K8memphis

The problem with operating this way is you have no leverage. You have to operate at the whim and mercy of each client. That's how you have to do it. You can't push back and you know in many threads there's tons of push back necessary to be fully functional.

So as far as how to do it, it only makes sense to do it for real and legit otherwise it's just not good for you. It's not right to do wrong in order to have a business.

I understand the kids and the time and everything, btdt.

Go get a job, part time if necessary. If you have muchkins still at home then you have to cut expenses and be poor some more and wait it out. When a friend or family member needs a cake --go for it. Otherwise no. But if you're not even pricing right why freaking bother.

Every Tom Dick and Harry can bake and decorate a cake. Ever hear of Wilton or ? Huge market. Huge. Matha's in on it now? Oh yeah cake making is so exclusive--NOT!!

Then everybody who eats it says, <in sing song voice> "You need to open a bus-i-ness".

It's too hard to make money doing this unless you open it up right or move to Virginia or Kentucky or Ohio or someplace where it's ok from the home. Just say no. Not worth it. Go get a real job.



I just want to point out that you CANNOT do it from the home in KY. Otherwise I completely agree. You can in Michigan and sort of in IN., but NOT KY. I know, I live here!



My girlfriend ran a very successful business out of her basement all legal and approved in Kentucky. Down the road from me in Tennessee people can do cakes from home but not in my county. It's controlled by each county.
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post #24 of 183
Quote:
Originally Posted by -K8memphis

Quote:
Originally Posted by Annabakescakes



I just want to point out that you CANNOT do it from the home in KY. Otherwise I completely agree. You can in Michigan and sort of in IN., but NOT KY. I know, I live here!



My girlfriend ran a very successful business out of her basement all legal and approved in Kentucky. Down the road from me in Tennessee people can do cakes from home but not in my county. It's controlled by each county.



Yeah, from her commercial kitchen, separate from her home kitchen, separate from the living quarters. With a 3 bowl sink, a hand sink, a mop sink, outside access. NOT her home kitchen. NOT LEGAL in KENTUCKY.

Ted Talley, health inspector, state of KY, county of Boone. 859-363-2027
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post #25 of 183
Yes you can do it from your home in Kentucky.

I'm really not sure what's your problem. There's a coupla details a coupla hoops to jump through. It is possible. You can do it in some part of Ky anyhow maybe not in downtown Louisville. I'm not sure about that.

You CAN do it from a Kitchen In Your Home in the Blue Grass State.

In my county it is not possible to do this and I wish it was.

That is a huge opportunity--it's a wide open door.

You want somebody to come run the mixer for yah too.
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post #26 of 183
In other words, Anna, some of us have to have separate property that is zoned commercial with all separate utilities and rent and/or mortgatge payment, separate buildings etc.

That is very different than in some parts of KENTUCKY and TENNESSEE where you can use your own residential property to have a cake business legal. Yes we all are very aware of the plumbing and electrical and ceiling tile and floor requirements etc.
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post #27 of 183
Quote:
Originally Posted by -K8memphis

Yes you can do it from your home in Kentucky.

I'm really not sure what's your problem. There's a coupla details a coupla hoops to jump through. It is possible. You can do it in some part of Ky anyhow maybe not in downtown Louisville. I'm not sure about that.

You CAN do it from a Kitchen In Your Home in the Blue Grass State.

In my county it is not possible to do this and I wish it was.

That is a huge opportunity--it's a wide open door.

You want somebody to come run the mixer for yah too.



What "my problem is" that it looked to me like you were saying that someone in the Bluegrass State could have a home kitchen, like in Ohio, since that was what I has first quoted you saying. Ky and Oh have very different rules. In Oh, you can use the very same kitchen that you prepare your meals in. In Ky, you must have EVERYTHING separate.

Yes, it is possible to have a kitchen in your home, but it is not a home kitchen. I think there is a great distinction between the two, as the "home kitchen" like in OH requires inspection of your regular everyday home kitchen, and all that entails. IDK, it is not an option in KY.

The commercial kitchen in your home requires building permits, electrical permits, plumbing permits, and thousands of dollars of equipment. I just don't think the two different states can reasonably be lumped together as "allowing home kitchens", when they are so different.

I certainly don't mean to start a fight, but I see that as very different. So does the Health department. And as far as Louisville goes, I don't live there, but I know that leah_s has commented before that you cannot have a home kitchen to cake in there either. I think you can have the commercial kitchen in your home though, I am not sure. That is Jefferson County.
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post #28 of 183
So - in states where you can bake on your property only if you have a separate commercial kitchen, I have a question. How in the name of all that's holy can you justify spending the money it takes to build a commercial kitchen on your property? I'm guessing this would cost $20,000 - 30,000. How many $100 cakes would you have to sell (minus costs) to pay for that?

Some hobbies just aren't supposed to turn into businesses.
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post #29 of 183
So if Aunt Bea is making the wedding cake for little Lucy, you mean to tell me the place of reception wont let it in the door?

well on this subject.....in a bad economy starting a new business is difficult.........I would not do it illegally, you are just asking for trouble. They love to go after easy targets you know..
post #30 of 183
Quote:
Originally Posted by mombabytiger

So - in states where you can bake on your property only if you have a separate commercial kitchen, I have a question. How in the name of all that's holy can you justify spending the money it takes to build a commercial kitchen on your property? I'm guessing this would cost $20,000 - 30,000. How many $100 cakes would you have to sell (minus costs) to pay for that?

Some hobbies just aren't supposed to turn into businesses.



I do plan to turn this hobby into a business. It is my passion and I need the money!

I can see it costing every bit of $20k-$30k, and more, even depending on how you do it. The way I plan to do it is Craigslist! I found my house with 2 car garage on Craigslist, as I did, my insulation, 3 bowl sink, 2 commercial convection ovens, door, lumber, electrical lines, various plumbing, fridges, freezers, shelving, cooling racks, cake pans. some things have been cheap, others free, and others a good deal, but not "cheap".

Also, I network at my church. I know licensed electricians, and plumbers from church, and my mom's boyfriend is a licensed contractor. We have gotten a lot of materials used and discounted, and they are giving us discounted labor. I did my electrician's wedding and groom's cake too. (Everything has to be done according to "code" as well, by licensed master workmen, or DH would have had it all done by now!)

It is still going to cost us A LOT!!! And I have had to be very patient. When I do a large wedding cake, I search for something to buy for the business. I have been buying for 3 years now. A little at a time. I refuse to go into debt, I have enough to worry about!

There are restrictions, as well. I cannot have more traffic than "normal" in my neighborhood, I cannot have people eat purchased food here, but tastings are okay, but I have to use disposable serving plates and plastic cutlery, and bottled water. There is a lot more, but it escapes me right now! I still have a long way to go, I'll clarify everything again when I am closer!
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