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I started it, let's talk about it... - Page 8

post #106 of 183
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kitagrl

So basically if you do not have a business name or business advertising, you are allowed to receive compensation for your hobby?


According to the IRS, yes. According to the dept of health in most states, no. (The IRS is not really the roadblock here, if they had their way all home kitchens would be legal so they could increase revenues.)
post #107 of 183
Kinda off subject, but what irks me is this. I have people tell me often, You should sell cakes, but when I tell them that I CAN'T legally and even explain to them why I can't. They get pushy about. Like I haven't spent almost TWO years looking into doing it legally. What do you tell people when they start getting pushy. BTW I only do cakes for very close family. I think they get upset when I tell them No I can't do a cake for you go to our local bakery. I just cannot afford to be giving cakes away for free.
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post #108 of 183
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aurora_333

Kinda off subject, but what irks me is this. I have people tell me often, You should sell cakes, but when I tell them that I CAN'T legally and even explain to them why I can't. They get pushy about. Like I haven't spent almost TWO years looking into doing it legally. What do you tell people when they start getting pushy. BTW I only do cakes for very close family. I think they get upset when I tell them No I can't do a cake for you go to our local bakery. I just cannot afford to be giving cakes away for free.



This is maddening. I've already gone a little insane with this whole thing (can't do it from home). TorysGirl said she is happy with her situation--I'm not happy.
icon_biggrin.gif I'm grinning through my teeth.
icon_lol.gif I'm laughing with that scary hysterical almost out of control edge to it.

But yes people are freaking -- demanding -- what the frick --yes good question, Aurora -- what do say to pushy people who decide for you that you are such an undiscovered talent you need to open a place for the good of humanity. Something demure like stfu. icon_biggrin.gif
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one baker's 'never ever do' is the next baker's 'i swear by this'
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post #109 of 183
Quote:
Originally Posted by jasonkraft

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kitagrl

So basically if you do not have a business name or business advertising, you are allowed to receive compensation for your hobby?


According to the IRS, yes. According to the dept of health in most states, no. (The IRS is not really the roadblock here, if they had their way all home kitchens would be legal so they could increase revenues.)



Trust, your state and county uses your 1040 for their tax purposes too.

According to my state (GA) and county (DeKalb) this is totally allowable. The Department of Health does not regulate bakeries here. It is the Department of Agriculture and I have had many a meeting with all necessary officials at every level.

Also, please understand that I cover my bases. It is clear that I am making a cake for you as a hobby only, not under a business guise, no ingredients listing, you are accepting responsibility for this cake, etc. Most people that I make cakes for are people I know. But it is sufficient to feed my passion. And the pocket change is cool.

I'm editing this post to say that if you read what I wrote carefully, I said federally hobby income is allowed, and also what my state and county allows regarding cakes from home allows me to do what I'm doing. I'm so sure the specifics are different everywhere.
Yesterday is history, tomorrow is a mystery, but today is a gift. That is why it is called the present.
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Yesterday is history, tomorrow is a mystery, but today is a gift. That is why it is called the present.
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post #110 of 183
TorysGirl, I am very happy for you. And I'm glad this is such a well behaved thread. I've said stuff like this and oh my gawd--the cake fundamentalists about made meatloaf out me.

More power to yah!
one baker's 'never ever do' is the next baker's 'i swear by this'
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one baker's 'never ever do' is the next baker's 'i swear by this'
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post #111 of 183
Quote:
Originally Posted by torysgirl87

Also, please understand that I cover my bases. It is clear that I am making a cake for you as a hobby only, not under a business guise, no ingredients listing, you are accepting responsibility for this cake, etc. Most people that I make cakes for are people I know. But it is sufficient to feed my passion. And the pocket change is cool.


I don't see a big problem with this, the issue is when unlicensed bakeries start expanding outside their circle of friends/family and advertising to the general public. The hobby/business distinction doesn't really matter though, the DoH/DoA in your state still won't approve. The only big difference is that you can't deduct net hobby losses against other income like you can with net business losses. If I were in your position, I would rather have an official business that gave product away for free (until a licensed kitchen could be secured) so I could deduct those losses and at least get something back.

Have you looked into renting a licensed commercial kitchen outside your home? I know of at least one option in the Decatur area.
post #112 of 183
[quote="Kitagrl"]There's law...but frankly...its no business of a CC member in Louisiana (just pulled that out of a hat, no reference to anyone here) to tell a CC member in, say, Idaho, that they should not ask questions on CC about selling cake until they are licensed.

Let the person mind their own business. Let them decide if they are going to follow the law or not. Let them face the results of whatever they choose.

Just answer their stupid cake question and go back to your legal caking...ya know? Really....

My main issue is not that its okay to be illegal but that I get tired of the busybodies who like to start debates in threads about whether the OP is being a bad little girl or a good little girl.

[quote]

Okay so why is your policing of the forum any different than their policing of illegal businesses? If you do not like the threads/posts do not read them. But to tell people it is not their business is no different than someone else tell another their business is illegal. Mind your own business works both ways.

The fact is that a number of businesses require liscensed legal operators to police their profession. There are not the resources or staff for the state do it alone. You may dislike it, but that is the way it is. If somone has an interest in protecting their profession that is their perrogative. There is no moral high ground for those that "mind their own business." You are not a better person because you mind your own business. To each their own, then to each their own. If you do not want to police fine, but you should not be policing those who are trying to protect their profession.

You say make it better so no one will buy from others. That is naive to say the least. Folks will buy from people who offer cheaper deals (sorry I agree with a prior post, illegal does not mean they are worse than what you can do).

I struggle with this right now. I know people will buy from me if I start selling out of my kitchen which could never pass inspection due to a four legged friend that lives in my house. Does not matter that he never goes into the kitchen--pet = no liscence. They will buy because they have tasted the cakes I make and love the flavors and textures even if my skills are not as good others.

So if we were in the same town as you and I went to my colleagues and said heck I will sell and undercut you (and buy the way these people have resources to afford specialty cakes) they would buy from me. Heck I already "took business away" from a place in another town because I was asked as a favor to make a cake for a birthday (I was not financially compensated for it).
post #113 of 183
Quote:
Originally Posted by jasonkraft

Quote:
Originally Posted by torysgirl87

Also, please understand that I cover my bases. It is clear that I am making a cake for you as a hobby only, not under a business guise, no ingredients listing, you are accepting responsibility for this cake, etc. Most people that I make cakes for are people I know. But it is sufficient to feed my passion. And the pocket change is cool.


I don't see a big problem with this, the issue is when unlicensed bakeries start expanding outside their circle of friends/family and advertising to the general public. The hobby/business distinction doesn't really matter though, the DoH/DoA in your state still won't approve. The only big difference is that you can't deduct net hobby losses against other income like you can with net business losses. If I were in your position, I would rather have an official business that gave product away for free (until a licensed kitchen could be secured) so I could deduct those losses and at least get something back.

Have you looked into renting a licensed commercial kitchen outside your home? I know of at least one option in the Decatur area.



It is so obnoxious for a person to tell me what they think they know, but really do not know. DoA has been in my home and yes, approves. I'm no longer interested in a business and yes you can deduct hobby expenses up to the amount of hobby income you make. The internet might possibly be one of the greatest tools of all time. www.irs.gov. Check the laws out.
Yesterday is history, tomorrow is a mystery, but today is a gift. That is why it is called the present.
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Yesterday is history, tomorrow is a mystery, but today is a gift. That is why it is called the present.
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post #114 of 183
Quote:
Originally Posted by jasonkraft

Quote:
Originally Posted by torysgirl87

Also, please understand that I cover my bases. It is clear that I am making a cake for you as a hobby only, not under a business guise, no ingredients listing, you are accepting responsibility for this cake, etc. Most people that I make cakes for are people I know. But it is sufficient to feed my passion. And the pocket change is cool.


I don't see a big problem with this, the issue is when unlicensed bakeries start expanding outside their circle of friends/family and advertising to the general public. The hobby/business distinction doesn't really matter though, the DoH/DoA in your state still won't approve. The only big difference is that you can't deduct net hobby losses against other income like you can with net business losses. If I were in your position, I would rather have an official business that gave product away for free (until a licensed kitchen could be secured) so I could deduct those losses and at least get something back.

Have you looked into renting a licensed commercial kitchen outside your home? I know of at least one option in the Decatur area.



I don't understand what part of "I got permission from my local government" you don't understand in her story? She's not breaking any laws!!!! She got permission from her DoA!!!!
post #115 of 183
In her earlier post she said the county did not approve (sorry, I should have said county instead of state).
post #116 of 183
Quote:
Originally Posted by torysgirl87

yes you can deduct hobby expenses up to the amount of hobby income you make.


Correct, but you cannot deduct net losses (when expenses are greater than income).
post #117 of 183
[quote="gatorcake"][quote="Kitagrl"]There's law...but frankly...its no business of a CC member in Louisiana (just pulled that out of a hat, no reference to anyone here) to tell a CC member in, say, Idaho, that they should not ask questions on CC about selling cake until they are licensed.

Let the person mind their own business. Let them decide if they are going to follow the law or not. Let them face the results of whatever they choose.

Just answer their stupid cake question and go back to your legal caking...ya know? Really....

My main issue is not that its okay to be illegal but that I get tired of the busybodies who like to start debates in threads about whether the OP is being a bad little girl or a good little girl.

Quote:
Quote:



Okay so why is your policing of the forum any different than their policing of illegal businesses? If you do not like the threads/posts do not read them. But to tell people it is not their business is no different than someone else tell another their business is illegal. Mind your own business works both ways.

The fact is that a number of businesses require liscensed legal operators to police their profession. There are not the resources or staff for the state do it alone. You may dislike it, but that is the way it is. If somone has an interest in protecting their profession that is their perrogative. There is no moral high ground for those that "mind their own business." You are not a better person because you mind your own business. To each their own, then to each their own. If you do not want to police fine, but you should not be policing those who are trying to protect their profession.

You say make it better so no one will buy from others. That is naive to say the least. Folks will buy from people who offer cheaper deals (sorry I agree with a prior post, illegal does not mean they are worse than what you can do).

I struggle with this right now. I know people will buy from me if I start selling out of my kitchen which could never pass inspection due to a four legged friend that lives in my house. Does not matter that he never goes into the kitchen--pet = no liscence. They will buy because they have tasted the cakes I make and love the flavors and textures even if my skills are not as good others.

So if we were in the same town as you and I went to my colleagues and said heck I will sell and undercut you (and buy the way these people have resources to afford specialty cakes) they would buy from me. Heck I already "took business away" from a place in another town because I was asked as a favor to make a cake for a birthday (I was not financially compensated for it).



I honestly do not fear competition but I guess its because I do not need, nor want, high volume business. I really do the same amount of work as the hobby baker above (LEGAL hobby baker) but I have licensing and insurance for it.
post #118 of 183
Her county does not approve her having a business the way she had first been told. They are ok with a few hobby cakes.

It's really hard for some people to understand that a few cakes for friends and family that you get paid for is not going to blow up the phones at the Pentagon or something. Swat teams are not surrounding the houses of those who bake thusly.

It is ok. It is ok with the officials. We can get paid for baking like this, a little baking. Not a business. One cake two cake three cakes is not a business.

Taking money for a cake does not institute a business in many locales.
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one baker's 'never ever do' is the next baker's 'i swear by this'
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post #119 of 183
Quote:
Originally Posted by -K8memphis

Her county does not approve her having a business the way she had first been told. They are ok with a few hobby cakes.

It's really hard for some people to understand that a few cakes for friends and family that you get paid for is not going to blow up the phones at the Pentagon or something. Swat teams are not surrounding the houses of those who bake thusly.

It is ok. It is ok with the officials. We can get paid for baking like this, a little baking. Not a business. One cake two cake three cakes is not a business.

Taking money for a cake does not institute a business in many locales.



I totally "get" your frustration here! Thanks for wording it better than I could have! I just have to say "DITTO, for the love of all things HOLY, FREAKING DITTO!!"
Beginners, be sure to parrot advice and get your post count up as fast as you can. After all, it's not what you know, it's what people THINK you know.
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Beginners, be sure to parrot advice and get your post count up as fast as you can. After all, it's not what you know, it's what people THINK you know.
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post #120 of 183
Quote:
Originally Posted by jasonkraft

In her earlier post she said the county did not approve (sorry, I should have said county instead of state).



Nope, the county doesn't, though the state does, of a commercial kitchen in the home that operates as a business. But a cakehobbery from your family kitchen is cool and you slight not even Uncle Sam if you report your hobby income and don't try to live off it. icon_wink.gif
Yesterday is history, tomorrow is a mystery, but today is a gift. That is why it is called the present.
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Yesterday is history, tomorrow is a mystery, but today is a gift. That is why it is called the present.
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