Hello all - I can't believe I haven't been here before! I've been reading here for a day or so and am really needing some help...you guys are so great!

I've been doing cookies for about six or seven years now, and after a few unofficial orders for friends, many many gifts and a lot of donations for non-profits, ave finally found some kitchen space to rent, so am going to try my hand at doing it "for real"...I work in the wedding industry in a very busy wedding city, so I have tons of connections in that area already. Most of the bakers I know really focus on cakes so I'm not going to be stepping on their toes, but I really need some advice on how to go about certain things!

I'm scared by some of the pricing I've seen here - my cookies are pretty detailed and there's no way I can make it work with $3 a cookie once I figure in the time and kitchen rental...I'm *hoping* that brides won't balk too much at higher prices since there are a lot of high dollar weddings here, but ugh, I guess I won't know for a while...

There's an open house for a new venue that I'm going to this weekend and they've said I can bring cookies as well as being there for my regular business...the new business cards will be here tomorrow, cookies are underway but I just feel a bit overwhelmed by all the options and how the heck to figure out prices. I live in a state that requires a completely separate kitchen space but I know advertising bakers who do it out of their homes...if I'm doing cookies for open houses, or to show to the coordinators and other vendors, would you do them at the official kitchen or from home? How does the legality of that work? Funds are horribly tight right now, so if I can do my "demo" work at home that would help so very much. And how do you work it out if brides want to do tastings of cookies? I can't go in and have to spend $30 each time to make a few samples...ahhh!

Anyway, my head is spinning with the questions I want to ask but I just wanted to say hello before I totally jump in!

Thank you for ANY advice, words of wisdom, pointers, etc....I'm open to hearing things! I know how to deal with brides and the business side of things in my industry but am a total neophyte here...yikes...

Hi. I'm definately not one of the pros here but i can tell you that many of them recommended charging $1 per inch of cookie. If the cookies are very very detailed, more should be charged on a design basis. I'd definately charge an extra $1 at least, if they are being personalized or customized in any way and if so, take a deposit since you can't use them if the order is cancelled.

I'm not an expert on the laws regarding separate kitchens and stuff, but if you were just demo'ing your cookies, who would know where you baked it? No one is going to ask for the paperwork to see if your few samples were baked in a commercial kitchen. I would think your big orders would be questioned, not demos.

Now, i understand why brides would want to taste the cakes they order because that is the big 'ta da' at the wedding and they cost a lot so they should be happy with the taste. But would they really want to taste the cookies? Yes, it it's out there, they will taste but will they ask?

I'm not an expert at all, but we're kind of in the same boat. I've been doing cookies for about 5 years for family and friends but I renovated a garage space at my moms house and now am an officially licensed bakery. I won't open for a few months yet as I need to practice and I plan of giving a TON of cookies away with my brochure and business cards etc...to local businesses. Anyway......

As for having demo cookies at a gathering like that I think you would be fine as long as if anyone asks you, you do have a kitchen space lined up that their actual orders would come from. That's just my opinion though.

Also, I'm in a small city in WI and I plan on having a base price of $2.50 per cookie. Of course if they're smaller or larger or have more detail/colors the price will differ. Lucky you to be in a city where it sounds like you'll actually get paid what you should for your time and ingredients!

Finally, I had a friend of a friend order $400 worth of cookies for her wedding next summer and she wanted to do a tasting. Some people here thought it was silly, but IMO, she is paying a LOT of money for my cookies and if she wanted her and her fiance to come and design what they wanted and taste a few cookies while doing it, I'm all for it! I called it a "tasting" and again, some people didn't like that, so I think for cookies it would be more of a "design session" with cookie samples and drinks.

Good luck to you. The cookie board here at CC is amazing! Hope to see you around a lot in the future! Oh, and I would LOVE to see some of your cookies, do you know how to post pictures? It's pretty simple. We could help you if you need it.

I would think cookie tastings would be much the same as a cake tasting. I would only offer it for large orders. Then you would have to decide just like it were a cake if you will make a batch of undecorated cookies or if you will decorate each one, as if you were going to make a 6" cake and give a slice or make cupcakes. I guess it depends on how you want to do it. Some poeple charge for tastings, some dont.

I got a call today from an event planner, needing 300 cookies for favors. This particular design is a big cookie .... looked online for the cutter and they are all 4 to 6". I told her "The rule of thumb is $1 per inch, so she's looking at $5 to $6 each for bagged cookies." Planner said, "Oh that's fine. We knew they'd be expensive."

So I'm making some sample cookies this weekend to run over to the planner. For an $1800 cookie order, you bet your patootie I'm sampling her a few!

Yes, i totally agree. For large orders where the customer is going to pay a lot, it's definately worth some samples.

indydebi, that's amazing that the planner actually expected them to be pricey. Good luck to you and can't wait to see pics!!

I have seen on-line places offer, for tasting, an end-of-run cookie i.e. one that is surplus from another order. This seems a fairly good way to do it for smaller orders - you don't have to bake a whole batch for them to have a taste, and they don't have to pay. For whopping great orders, I also would be very happy to make samples for them!

Indy - that order will take a ton of dough. I'm sure you have a giant mixer - do you also have a sheeter? Makes my arms hurt thinking about all that rolling! Would love to see pics when they're done.

Tubbs, I have a 20 qt. I made 3000 drop cookies for a college graduation once. With my 2 helpers, it was a great lesson in assembly line baking! Dough was made WAY in advance, cookie dough balls were formed and stored in the freezer. On baking day, we filled the 18x26 baking sheets and I can get 10 baking sheets in the oven at one time. It actually didnt' take very much time at all, once all the prep work was done.

So if I can get 18-20 cookies on a baking sheet, it will only take about 15 baking sheets to bake all of these. I can actually have them all baked in under 30 minutes. I plan on covering them in fondant, so the fondant shapes will already be cut out and waiting. When they come out of the oven, slap the fondant on them. Add the detail decors and we're done.

yeah, but you sure wouldn't envy my monthly payment!

True!! It would take me a month to bake all those cookies, but at least the oven was free!!

I understand the pricing dilemma. I'm "newish" as well. I've baked for over a 10 year period for unofficial orders. Anything from grad party cookie/cakes to corporate Christmas party cake/favors. I am now unable to find an Accounting/Finance job (boo-hoo...(enter sarcasm)...hated the cubicle anyway) and am trying it "for real".

I expect to deal with the cost of samples/demo type stuff. But, there is a line. I agree with the big order & how it's appropriate to extend some samples. Once you get a buzz going about how delicious your cookies are, people will be less inclined to ask for a tasting.

One other thing...I've read about some other CCers struggles with price. It seemed that people were questioning paying even what seemed to be a minimum price. And of course, frustration was felt. But other CCers suggested to raise the price even more. That way, you get only the people who expect to pay for quality. Clever really.

I had a lady trying to take advantage of me. I am focusing on selling event favors locally to start. And, she thought I was "young & stupid". To drive business, I am offering a lower price until I get the word spread. She thought she could buy my favors and no doubt jack up the price to resell to her brides. The minute I explained to her I would retain control over the order, I haven't heard from her since. I even am offering a % commission for a finders fee. Haven't heard a peep.

So...PRICE....be honest and fair. If you put days of work into these things, state a price that reflects that. Shop the competition. Be willing to lose an order.

I live in a somewhat depressed area so I know I'm not going to fetch a "city" price. But, if you have a great personality and are professional...people will pay more for that as well. I know I would!

I understand the pricing dilemma. I'm "newish" as well. I've baked for over a 10 year period for unofficial orders. Anything from grad party cookie/cakes to corporate Christmas party cake/favors. I am now unable to find an Accounting/Finance job (boo-hoo...(enter sarcasm)...hated the cubicle anyway) and am trying it "for real".

I expect to deal with the cost of samples/demo type stuff. But, there is a line. I agree with the big order & how it's appropriate to extend some samples. Once you get a buzz going about how delicious your cookies are, people will be less inclined to ask for a tasting.

One other thing...I've read about some other CCers struggles with price. It seemed that people were questioning paying even what seemed to be a minimum price. And of course, frustration was felt. But other CCers suggested to raise the price even more. That way, you get only the people who expect to pay for quality. Clever really.

I had a lady trying to take advantage of me. I am focusing on selling event favors locally to start. And, she thought I was "young & stupid". To drive business, I am offering a lower price until I get the word spread. She thought she could buy my favors and no doubt jack up the price to resell to her brides. The minute I explained to her I would retain control over the order, I haven't heard from her since. I even am offering a % commission for a finders fee. Haven't heard a peep.

So...PRICE....be honest and fair. If you put days of work into these things, state a price that reflects that. Shop the competition. Be willing to lose an order.

I live in a somewhat depressed area so I know I'm not going to fetch a "city" price. But, if you have a great personality and are professional...people will pay more for that as well. I know I would!

That's really good advice. Thank you! I never thought that event planners would do something like that. Good idea to take a hold of the orders. The customers should come to you for the order and not go through her. Giving a finder's fee commission is the smart way to go too.

That's really good advice. Thank you! I never thought that event planners would do something like that. Good idea to take a hold of the orders. The customers should come to you for the order and not go through her. Giving a finder's fee commission is the smart way to go too.

That's really good advice. Thank you! I never thought that event planners would do something like that. Good idea to take a hold of the orders. The customers should come to you for the order and not go through her. Giving a finder's fee commission is the smart way to go too.

yessiree bob...you go Deb! I live in a small town and commute 1 hour and 10 minutes to the "big city" to work. It is still more cost effective for me to do this than work in my town or to move to the big city. I charge what I want to charge for my work and if people don't want to pay that price ...well then I don't do the cake just to do a cake.
I went to an ICES day of sharing this past Sunday. One woman during show and tell ( new products) showed that she did a cookie bouquet with 5 big cookies in a tin cup for fathers day. Her price was 10 bucks. Another one was a huge cookie..8 x8 with Dad in icing and boxed for 5.00. Now I don't know how she could have made ANY money on that because her time and ingredients would have eaten up any of the so called profit. She could have sold the tin for 20 and the dad cookie for 20 and made money. Me...I am not going to do it for free. I would rather not do it at all as to do it for free. When people can pay 5 or 6 bucks for cancer sticks or 20 bucks for booze and not think twice then if they want my products they pay what I charge...end of story.

yee gads...a multiple hiccup again!!!

double oops

oops

cakern, you go girl!!
I agree. While i have not sold cookies (only edible images cookies), i see how much work, time, and money goes into every cookie or bouquet i make for friends and family. I cannot imagine losing money over this just to charge a price that people would pay.
When i was selling photo cookies, there were complaints about my prices and i did not get many orders.
Other more established sites were charging at least double if not triple my charge and they were even charging a fee to crop and image the custome pictures, which i did not do. I didn't even have a large minimum that other businesses had. I sent customers to their sites to see what a steal they were getting ordering from me but i got all the requests to lower the prices (if i order over 50, can i get a discount? if i don't have a pic, just a message, can i get a discount? etc).
As many of you who have done edible images know, each one costs you money to make, not to mention all the sheets that get thrown away because the color was off or it didn't print exactly on the circles or shapes well, etc.

It's very frustrating to have to justify prices and you said it, cakeRN, if people are willing to pay so much for those things, then they can pay the prices for these special cookies.

Thank you all for the responses! So sorry I haven't been back sooner - we're in a bit of a tailspin schedulewise...

I'll definitely start on the conservative side with pricing since I'm still pretty new at it all. I had my first playtime with fondant - will post those photos shortly. I love it! I made the MMF but didn't have Crisco, so used butter...however, I think I messed up because over a stick of butter literally vanished into the batch. I live in central Texas and it's been VERY hot lately, so I don't know how much that would affect how the icing would be reacting? I let the cookies dry overnight but there was still a bit of lusterdust goo on the plastic baggies when I put them in, so I think the butter was preventing them from drying? At any rate, I'm definitely going to be experimenting more with that!

Wanted to say a quick word on the 10% "finder fee" thought...you may want to check around because it's something that's frowned upon in many areas. Industry standard in my area is for recommendations to be based on the coordinator knowing you're going to do a good job and not involve referral fees...like I said, things are done differently in different parts of the country but we have several strong professional organizations whose requirements are that commissions (or kick backs!) aren't allowed. There's a VERY upscale venue here and I was on their preferred vendor list for years. New management came along and started requiring 10% of the vendor's fee (they wanted it off my gross even though I pay other people out of it, so their fee was about half of my management take!). Even more, if a client booked a vendor outside of their list, they made the client pay them 15% of the vendor's fee. Horrible! Anyway, we made an arrangement that I would book directly with the client and didn't pay them the fee but eventually I requested that they take me off because everyone who knew about their business practices assumed I was part of it. So, they've ended up with a whole lot of inexperienced brand-new vendors on their "preferred vendor list". I've also come across places who will put you on their preferred vendor list if you pay them. UGH! I ended up putting an "ethics" tab on my website about it - that I never pay nor receive referral fees. I will often give a small discount to a client coming through a coordinator - it's a way the client can then justify hiring a coordinator. And a good coordinator makes my life - and that of the other vendors - a ton easier! Anyway, it's something I feel strongly about - I really want someone to refer me because they know I'm professional, do my job extremely well and am easy to work with - and it's nice to be able to reassure the clients about that too! Just something to consider from the other side!

Back to cookies now!

Thank you all for the responses! So sorry I haven't been back sooner - we're in a bit of a tailspin schedulewise...

I'll definitely start on the conservative side with pricing since I'm still pretty new at it all. I had my first playtime with fondant - will post those photos shortly. I love it! I made the MMF but didn't have Crisco, so used butter...however, I think I messed up because over a stick of butter literally vanished into the batch. I live in central Texas and it's been VERY hot lately, so I don't know how much that would affect how the icing would be reacting? I let the cookies dry overnight but there was still a bit of lusterdust goo on the plastic baggies when I put them in, so I think the butter was preventing them from drying? At any rate, I'm definitely going to be experimenting more with that!

Wanted to say a quick word on the 10% "finder fee" thought...you may want to check around because it's something that's frowned upon in many areas. Industry standard in my area is for recommendations to be based on the coordinator knowing you're going to do a good job and not involve referral fees...like I said, things are done differently in different parts of the country but we have several strong professional organizations whose requirements are that commissions (or kick backs!) aren't allowed. There's a VERY upscale venue here and I was on their preferred vendor list for years. New management came along and started requiring 10% of the vendor's fee (they wanted it off my gross even though I pay other people out of it, so their fee was about half of my management take!). Even more, if a client booked a vendor outside of their list, they made the client pay them 15% of the vendor's fee. Horrible! Anyway, we made an arrangement that I would book directly with the client and didn't pay them the fee but eventually I requested that they take me off because everyone who knew about their business practices assumed I was part of it. So, they've ended up with a whole lot of inexperienced brand-new vendors on their "preferred vendor list". I've also come across places who will put you on their preferred vendor list if you pay them. UGH! I ended up putting an "ethics" tab on my website about it - that I never pay nor receive referral fees. I will often give a small discount to a client coming through a coordinator - it's a way the client can then justify hiring a coordinator. And a good coordinator makes my life - and that of the other vendors - a ton easier! Anyway, it's something I feel strongly about - I really want someone to refer me because they know I'm professional, do my job extremely well and am easy to work with - and it's nice to be able to reassure the clients about that too! Just something to consider from the other side!

Back to cookies now!

OMG....Indydebi - - - that is NOT what I meant. No need to quote me and then unload....

I left a mid sized city to pursue an Accounting/Finance related opportunity out of state. It is a fact that the job market in my home town is very slim as compared to the bigger city I left home for. The major city I live 60 minutes out of has a poor job market as well. The city I left home for DOES in fact have many attractions...major league sports, several colleges, a lot of corporate headquarters relocating there, the music industry, great schools for your kids to grow up in, etc. So, that big city AND of course the suburbs and even trinkling into the backwoods country may be made up of people who have higher incomes and may be more free with the spending of their dollars.... And, vice versa. In an area...like my hometown, which I have since moved back to, people are more strict with their pocketbook. The area I am from once thrived on steel mills, lighting factories and the auto industry. All of which have declined big time. I used to work at a local credit union and have seen first hand the rise in bankruptcy on the financial statements. My father was president of his union for the steelworkers just recently and fought long and hard to retain the wages/benefits and JOBS.

I'm not stupid. I realize that people buy designer items and drive expensive vehicles even when their income may or may not be in line with the purchase. And that has nothing to do with if they live in a big city or in the country. I'm not pretending I can predict what people will spend and on what - it's none of my business. NOR AM I SAYING TO UNDER PRICE YOURSELF. I'm just saying...price is relative to location SOMEWHAT. I never suggested wacking your price in half just because you live in a smaller town.

It is true that when you look online for a vehicle value, they ask for zip code. WHY? Because the same car may be worth more in part of the country versus another. I'm saying that nobody can spell out a price for you. As a former BUSINESS MAJOR I'd like to think that it makes sense to say you need to consider all market factors as well as your hard work and other costs. I did also say that there were CC'ers who suggested upping the price to weed out the whiners - the ones who aren't willing to pay what you determine is fair. I believe I supported that thought but then went back to say....you know your business, work, and area best.

I don't have a booming business yet. I am smart enough to get there. I WILL get there. I came on cake central to learn what has always been with me....baking. Since I was 10 I helped my mom keep inventory and sell to her seasonal customers. I went to school for Accounting...worked as an Analyst for many years. But always woke up with flavor combinations and packaging ideas on my mind...not excel modeling. I came on cake central to be part of a community who appeared to support, constructively criticize, and expand my creative side that had been stifled by the stuffy corporate environment.

Imagine my surprise when I log on to see I've been "ripped on" for suggesting a basic idea in business. See if you catch me post another thing.................

EvMarie, please don't think that Indydebi was unloading on you. Indydebi is a very straightforward, tell it like it is, "Mom" of CC. This is one of those topics that comes up frequently on CC (along with pricing in general) and there is usually a bit of 'discussion'. While I have never had the privilege of being on the receiving end of Indydebi's advice, I assure you that she wasn't "ripping on" you, just giving her take on a hot topic.

We are always glad to have new members give a fresh perspective on things! Welcome!