Wedding Cake/grooms Cake Pricing

Business By Cakeprob Updated 8 Oct 2013 , 11:35pm by SystemMod1

jason_kraft Posted 8 Oct 2013 , 9:01pm
post #31 of 52

AOP probably would have been better served by leaving it at her earlier "last" post.

Cakeprob Posted 8 Oct 2013 , 9:04pm
post #32 of 52

Quote:

Originally Posted by howsweet 
 

You must be right. I found her first several sentences to be very inflammatory.

 

To the OP, you must be a regular person looking for info and I'm sorry that you walked into a situation where people are sure you must be a troll. I hope you will try to understand our reactions to some of the things you said and instead of registering only our outrage and deciding we're crazy, perhaps think twice about your point of view and consider that we may know what we're talking about. People didn't think you were a troll for no reason at all.

 

I get that you are happy to be getting business that might otherwise go elsewhere, that's natural. That's what competition is all about. But there is such a thing as unfair competition and when you don't charge in line what a brick and mortar bakery would charge, that's unfair to the bakery and to you. If this continues the walk in bakery will exist no more and it will be harder to get professionally done cakes as not everyone is willing to convert his/her home kitchen into a bakery. And if undercharging is low enough professionals will have to get out of the business to support themselves and all cake will be done by hobby bakers.

 

Anyway there's good information on this forum if you're willing to hear it.

 

Thanks for posting!  I completely understand what you are saying!  But how is it my problem when I have people knocking on my door for this stuff!!!!  I’m not competing with ANYONE!  I don’t care what others are doing for cakes.  I am not trying to take anyone’s business!!!!  I simply do it b/c I love to do it.  Why is this my fault?  b/c I have friends at my kids’ school who say, hey can you make my child’s cake next week?  Maybe b/c it’s too late for a bakery to make it to their standard.  It gives me a challenge.  I may not be up to par on pricing.  So shoot me.  It’s not that I’m trying to insult anyone!!!  All I know is that I can’t possibly charge someone I know, that I’m super close with, an expensive price.  It’s just not in me.  That’s my ‘full of heart’ coming out.  I have never sold a cake to a stranger.  I have never once advertised.  So how is this wrong?  I’m not taking business from anyone?

Cakeprob Posted 8 Oct 2013 , 9:05pm
post #33 of 52

Quote:

Originally Posted by jason_kraft 

OP probably would have been better served by leaving it at her earlier "last" post.

 

Why is that?

AZCouture Posted 8 Oct 2013 , 9:07pm
post #34 of 52

AAnd yet another example of why this business is going down the toilet. Happy dress up cake maker make you cakes with love, and for pennies. Dang those pesky business owners that actually price accordingly to be profitable. And no, I won't apologize for being inflammatory.

kikiandkyle Posted 8 Oct 2013 , 9:09pm
post #35 of 52
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cakeprob 
 

Wasn’t going to post again b/c this post has clearly lost its original subject.  I am, in no way, trying to devalue or accuse anyone of overcharging for a cake.  I never once ‘bragged’ that I undercut a bakery.  I don’t charge what a bakery charges b/c I AM NOT A BAKERY.  I never posted anything to upset anyone.  I never gave inflammatory remarks (where did THAT come from?)  Point is, I got into this hobby so I wouldn’t have to pay those prices for a cake.  I’m broke just like everyone else!!!  I completely understand WHY they cost the way that they do.  I am very selective in what cakes I make.  I have SIX cakes for the month of October that are completely FREE.  Which consist of two teacher birthday gifts, my sister’s birthday, my own brother’s birthday, my Aunt’s birthday, my OWN child’s birthday cake.  The teacher cakes are single layers with fondant broach flowers, pearls, fondant trim, fondant letters, fondant teddy bears with little tiny bows.  My siblings cakes will be single layers cakes covered in fondant makeup (my sister) and chef cake board with vegetables (my brother, he’s a chef).  My OWN child will have a massive 3 tiered cake that is Halloween themed complete with handmade pumpkins, tombstones, vines with tiny veined leaves, multicolored ruffled fondant rounds, a little witch girl cake topper, cake wires with little bats and ghosts, handmade fondant candy.  I have taken the Wilton cake courses.  THIS IS MY HOBBY.  I have several sets of cupcakes to make with little fondant cake toppers (turkeys, ice cream cones,  Halloween ghosts and pumpkins) for my 3 kids’ classes this month. And its all for free.  Yet I’m running a business illegally?

 

I completely understand the need to charge.  I charge people the supplies, the tools and maybe a delivery fee (on the few I do charge for).  I do a few cakes a month.  I ‘seem’ busy b/c I take an extremely long time for perfection.  So don’t tell me that I don’t understand what it takes to be an artist in this industry.  I’ll never understand why I was quoted FOUR hundred dollars for a white fondant, two tiered cake with a regular filling and candy lollipops sticking out of the top.  This candy was NOT hand made.  I was quoted $400.  I can make the cake for less than $100.  True fact.  Which is why I chose to get into this HOBBY.  And the bakery has been around for ages, they do extremely well and so they can charge that b/c they don’t need my business.  So what if I turn them down?  No skin off their back.  THAT’S why they charge what they charge.  I know that not everyone charges that way.  But it is how businesses are ran, not just bakeries!

 

And, How it is anyone’s business of theirs what I do with my cake mixes, my icing and my fondant.  Who cares if I charge $1 or $1000?  You run a business, you do well.  I don’t, b/c I don’t want one!  I do this as a hobby, on the side, and that’s exactly what it is.  I posted the OP b/c I was trying to help someone in a rut, and had no idea how to price a job like that since I’ve never done one before.  Simple as that.  Thank you for those who gave kind advice, even those with kind words to nicely get their point across.  To those who got hostile, maybe there is some underlying reason you are so hostile from a previous experience.  Yes, I’ve been member here for a long time b/c my love for cake decorating goes back for quite some time.  I love to read on here and get all kinds of ideas and advice.  Yet, I post and obviously was sent walking out the door.

 

You contradict yourself at every turn. This is your thread, that you started asking about how to price cakes that you are selling. Either you want to know or you don't. 

 

You can't say you understand what it takes to be an artist then question why the person making your $400 cake doesn't deserve to be paid for the time it took over and above the $100 in supplies that it cost you to make. 

 

And someone who makes and sells cakes for money is running a bakery, even if it isn't done in a building with the word bakery above the door. 

jason_kraft Posted 8 Oct 2013 , 9:12pm
post #36 of 52

A

Original message sent by Cakeprob

But how is it my problem when I have people knocking on my door for this stuff!!!!  I’m not competing with ANYONE!  ... All I know is that I can’t possibly charge someone I know, that I’m super close with, an expensive price.  It’s just not in me.  That’s my ‘full of heart’ coming out.  I have never sold a cake to a stranger.  I have never once advertised. 

I don't think there's anything wrong with making a few cakes a month for free for friends and family members, but you seem to go back and forth about insisting that you are not a business, then talking about pricing and being excited that you may be operating as a legal business due to the cottage food law.

There's a slippery slope between making cakes for friends and having word of mouth spread to friends of friends, acquaintances, strangers, etc. Just be careful about keeping things small.

As for charging someone an "expensive" price...real businesses charge a price that covers ingredients, labor, overhead, and a small amount of profit. If the price seems "expensive" to you it's because you are not in that business's target market. Your statement about being able to make the same cake for 25% of the price demonstrates a profound (but not unusual) knowledge gap in how costs are accounted for and how pricing structures are created.

howsweet Posted 8 Oct 2013 , 9:13pm
post #37 of 52

Well put, Jason.

 

Originally Posted by Cakeprob 
 

 

Thanks for posting!  I completely understand what you are saying!  But how is it my problem when I have people knocking on my door for this stuff!!!!  I’m not competing with ANYONE!  I don’t care what others are doing for cakes.  I am not trying to take anyone’s business!!!!  I simply do it b/c I love to do it.  Why is this my fault?  b/c I have friends at my kids’ school who say, hey can you make my child’s cake next week?  Maybe b/c it’s too late for a bakery to make it to their standard.  It gives me a challenge.  I may not be up to par on pricing.  So shoot me.  It’s not that I’m trying to insult anyone!!!  All I know is that I can’t possibly charge someone I know, that I’m super close with, an expensive price.  It’s just not in me.  That’s my ‘full of heart’ coming out.  I have never sold a cake to a stranger.  I have never once advertised.  So how is this wrong?  I’m not taking business from anyone?

If I'm super close to some one, they get free cake. That would not be likely to include parents of my child's classmates. You might want to give some thought as to whether you're being used for cheap cake.

AZCouture Posted 8 Oct 2013 , 9:15pm
post #38 of 52

ANicely said Kiki. And OP, you're in the business section of this forum. The puppies and lollipops get left on the mat before you step in here.

howsweet Posted 8 Oct 2013 , 9:16pm
post #39 of 52

Quote:

Originally Posted by kikiandkyle 
 

 

You contradict yourself at every turn. This is your thread, that you started asking about how to price cakes that you are selling. Either you want to know or you don't. 

 

You can't say you understand what it takes to be an artist then question why the person making your $400 cake doesn't deserve to be paid for the time it took over and above the $100 in supplies that it cost you to make. 

 

And someone who makes and sells cakes for money is running a bakery, even if it isn't done in a building with the word bakery above the door. 

Good points! :grin:

Cakeprob Posted 8 Oct 2013 , 9:18pm
post #40 of 52

Quote:

Originally Posted by AZCouture 

And yet another example of why this business is going down the toilet. Happy dress up cake maker make you cakes with love, and for pennies. Dang those pesky business owners that actually price accordingly to be profitable. And no, I won't apologize for being inflammatory.

 

And that’s ok b/c you are free to speak and say anything you please.  I do respect that.  However, I only came on here to ask a question.  Never did I think it would turn out this way.  I never meant to belittle anyone, never meant to undervalue anyone.  Does this go the same for my grandmother who wants to make dresses for my two girls?  Is she hurting the local kids dress store?   I do apologize for any hurt feelings.  Apparently there have been past experiences that have caused people to be on their toes.  I am certainly not  reason for that, but I do understand the reason you feel that way.  I don’t understand why this can’t be a hobby for someone.  I didn’t realize the dislike b/t bakeries and those who do this as a hobby.  I realize some of the information I offered wasn’t needed, but I only explained why I  needed the price on the cake since I’ve never had to do it before.  I surely won’t ask for that again.

Cakeprob Posted 8 Oct 2013 , 9:20pm
post #41 of 52

A

Quote:

Originally Posted by howsweet 
 

If I'm super close to some one, they get free cake. That would not be likely to include parents of my child's classmates. You might want to give some thought as to whether you're being used for cheap cake.

Several of my children’s classmates have parents that are my best friends.  Yes, this is a true fact.  Each grade has TWO classes.  We live in a very small community.  My best friend of 8 years has a daughter in my daughters class.  Why am I have to explain this?

Cakeprob Posted 8 Oct 2013 , 9:21pm
post #42 of 52

ANice debate, yall. It's been fun, I'm out (tried to put a smiley b/c I really am a nice perso, but even the forum doesn't like me to put one lol)

AZCouture Posted 8 Oct 2013 , 9:23pm
post #43 of 52

AYep.

howsweet Posted 8 Oct 2013 , 9:28pm
post #44 of 52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cakeprob 
 
Quote:
 
Originally Posted by howsweet 

 

If I'm super close to some one, they get free cake. That would not be likely to include parents of my child's classmates. You might want to give some thought as to whether you're being used for cheap cake.

 

Several of my children’s classmates have parents that are my best friends.  Yes, this is a true fact.  Each grade has TWO classes.  We live in a very small community.  My best friend of 8 years has a daughter in my daughters class.  Why am I have to explain this?

Because you sound like you're contradicting yourself - why say they're parents at your kids school and each grade has two classes if they're your best friends? Most wouldn't characterize her best friend as a parent of a kid in their kid's class. It makes it sound like you're making it up as you go.

kikiandkyle Posted 8 Oct 2013 , 9:29pm
post #45 of 52

AOnce you start accepting money, no matter how little, your hobby becomes a business. Your hobby is not making cakes, it's running a cake business. People just want to help you do that properly.

-K8memphis Posted 8 Oct 2013 , 9:39pm
post #46 of 52

Quote:

Originally Posted by kikiandkyle 

Once you start accepting money, no matter how little, your hobby becomes a business. Your hobby is not making cakes, it's running a cake business. People just want to help you do that properly.

 

hobbies can accept money and be a hobby

Cakepro Posted 8 Oct 2013 , 10:14pm
post #47 of 52

Then perhaps you should rename yourself Hobbyprob. 

DeliciousDesserts Posted 8 Oct 2013 , 10:26pm
post #48 of 52

Perhaps I took this:

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cakeprob 
 

  It's not my fauilt that I don't have the heart to charge someone $200 for a cake.  

 

 

 

as an implication that anyone who did charge $200 was a big ole meany.  

 

I'm open to hearing the correct interpretation of what exactly you meant.

DeliciousDesserts Posted 8 Oct 2013 , 10:35pm
post #49 of 52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cakeprob 
 

 

 I’ll never understand why I was quoted FOUR hundred dollars for a white fondant, two tiered cake with a regular filling and candy lollipops sticking out of the top.  This candy was NOT hand made.  I was quoted $400.  I can make the cake for less than $100.  

Please understand I do not mean to be rude when I say this....I DOUBT it!  It may seem like you could make that cake for $100.  I assure you that once you add all the true costs, it would be far more expensive than you imagine.  Even without paying liability insurance, taxes, license fees etc., there are many hidden costs most hobbyist don't consider.

 

Even as a "non-pro", there is a fee for the gas you use, the electricity, the water, the waste fee, not to mention supplies generally overlooked such as cake boards, plates & columns, parchment paper, saran wrap, etc.  Oh the list goes on and on.  That's even before "paying' yourself for your time.

 

I can't provide an accurate quote since I have no idea how many lollipops were involved.  I can tell you that the smallest 2 tier I offer serves 35.  Basic flavors & buttercream filling would run you $207.50 before I put any lollipops on it.  Now, most bakeries consider a 2 tier to serve 50.  That would be $275.  Neither of those quotes include tax or delivery.  

 

MOST hobbyists (and some in business) have no idea how much it truly costs.  They don't take the time to do the research and cost out all of the expenses.  That is why there are people in my area selling a 3 tier serving 100 for $100 on Craigslist.  CANT BE DONE!!!  Will could be done...at a LOSS.

DeliciousDesserts Posted 8 Oct 2013 , 10:39pm
post #50 of 52

Honestly?

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cakeprob 
 

 

Does this go the same for my grandmother who wants to make dresses for my two girls?  Is she hurting the local kids dress store?  

 

Do you think that this is a fair analogy?  

 

Only if your kids then expect to get free (or at cost) dresses at the local kids dress store.

kikiandkyle Posted 8 Oct 2013 , 10:58pm
post #51 of 52

ASo long as Grandma isn't making A LOT of highly detailed dresses, for little or no cost, and all of her closest best friends no longer shop anywhere for clothes because they think stores that charge more than grandma don't have any heart.

SystemMod1 Posted 8 Oct 2013 , 11:35pm
post #52 of 52

This thread has run its course and is being locked.

 

Pouncing on a new poster like this is under review by us Mods because it's happening way too frequently and it's completely unacceptable.  

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