jiya11 Posted 19 Nov 2012 , 12:59am
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Hello my dear teachers.. I have learnt so much from reading through these forums over the months, I cant even express my gratitude enough.. THANKS!!

 

I need some advise from the pros...

 

First, the background on this cake:

 

I am making a three tiered cake (my first ever tiered cake) for a friends' daughter's birthday. I am doing a 10, 8 and 6 inch cakes with bottom tier WASC with strawberry filling, middle, Red Velvet Remix (BeanCountingBaker) with cream cheese filling and a chocolate WASC with raspberry filling for the top. Its due Thursday afternoon and I am taking it assembled to the venue which is five minutes away.

I will be doing crusting butter cream (Indydebie's) on all layers and fondant decorations on all three. I will be stabilizing the bottom two tiers with wooden dowels and each cake on its cardboard and the bottom layer on a 14 inch cake drum. Also, will be using a center sharpened dowel which will be going through the top through all the way down to the cake drum.

 

I hope I have got all of this this right so far.

 

So far, I just got done baking the bottom two cake sizes as I type (2 pans for each size and flavor). I have wrapped them in cling wrap and put them in the freezer. Will be doing the top layer tonight too.

 

My questions:

1) The bottom WASC cake, baked in Magic Line pans without flower nail/baking strips. When I inverted them on the cooling grid, both had a bit (2 inch) chunk stuck to the pan, I carefully peeled it off the pan and placed it on the cake cavity while still hot and then wrapped in cling wrap and then freezed. My question is, would that work as that is the base cake and I don't want any blunders and I have still time to bake another if need be..should I?

2) Wooden dowels should work for each tier or should I get the Bubble tea straws? Dont have the time to buy online so will have to check at an oriental store.

3) I couldn't find a cardboard cake circle for the 10inch cake. I have the 8 and 6. I do have a cake drum that is 10 inches. Would that work as a base for the 10 inch cake? Or should I look for 10 inch cake circles?

4) I am using a 14 inch silver foiled 1/2 inch cake drum as a base. Do I need to put that on something else like a masonite board or a wooden board?

 

Any help advise would be greatly appreciated. I am just so worked up!

46 replies
jiya11 Posted 19 Nov 2012 , 1:07am
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700

 

Here is the rough sketch I made to plan it out. Sorry its a little messy but wanted to share so you get a visual idea.

jiya11 Posted 19 Nov 2012 , 2:50am
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AAny thoughts, anyone? One more question to add to my list, if I were to make an initial topper for the top tier, should I do all gumpaste, half fondant half gumpaste or fondant with tylose powder? It will be black.

denetteb Posted 19 Nov 2012 , 2:51am
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1-I wouldn't worry about the 2 inch chunks that you replaced.

2-The dowels will be fine.

3-the 10 inch cake is the one on the bottom, you really don't have to have a cardboard under that one.  You could use the 10 inch drum or an 8 inch cardboard circle to help with supporting the 10 inch cake when you move the cake around.  But it doesn't have to be on a board.  I would probably just use an 8 inch or the drum will raise the height of that tier.

4-I think the drum will be ok.  If you have masonite or a wood board that would be sturdier but I would think the drum would be fine. 

 

Relax, don't let yourself get worked up, it sounds like you have done your homework and are well prepared. 
 

denetteb Posted 19 Nov 2012 , 2:52am
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We were typing at the same time.  I can't help with the topper question, I don't work with fondant.
 

jiya11 Posted 19 Nov 2012 , 2:56am
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AThanks so much denetteb for answering everything in detail.. It's my biggest project so gae and I can't help it. But you definitely did boost my confidence. I will keep you guys posted how things are progressing... If I don't find a 10 inch cake circle, then I will follow your advise and use an 8 inch. Also, don't have a wooden or masonite board. I will keep my fingers crossed and use the cake drum.

Wish me luck!!

BakingIrene Posted 19 Nov 2012 , 3:55am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jiya11 


Also, don't have a wooden or masonite board. I will keep my fingers crossed and use the cake drum.

Uhh, NO.  If you don't have a rigid cake board, then keep the base cake on a sheet pan.

 

And I would be so much happier if you could transport the cakes NOT stacked for this first effort.  A stacked cake weighs a LOT when assembled.

jaja310 Posted 19 Nov 2012 , 3:58am
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I've used all gumpaste and half gumpaste/half fondant for toppers and they both work great. The half/half combo took a little longer to dry for me. I haven't used tylose powder, only gum trag and that worked well also.  The advantage to the gum trag was that I could use premade black fondant which gave a true black color. Adding gumpaste to black fondant can dilute the color, and it can be difficut to get a true black with just the gel colors.

 

I agree with denetteb on all the other points. The 14" cake drum should be fine. It can support the weight just fine. The only concern is if you are using a crusting buttercream and the drum flexes too much, then you can get some cracking of the icing. I just did the same size cake with the same board (non-crusting BC) and it did fine with a two hour drive. You are going to do great! Good luck!

Dani1081 Posted 19 Nov 2012 , 4:10am
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I agree with everything dinetteb said and it's wonderful how prepared you are!  You have a great plan, have covered all the bases and will make a wonderful cake I'm sure!  As far as the topper goes, I've made several and always use gumpaste.  I roll it out about 1/4" thick, cut it out with my exacto blade and dry it for several days.  I then "glue" one or two sucker sticks or bamboo skewers on the back of the dried piece with melted chocolate to poke it down into the cake. Best of luck with your cake!

jiya11 Posted 19 Nov 2012 , 12:37pm

AThanks Jaja310 and Dani1081: Jaja310. Do u recomment I should use a non crusting bc? Only reason I use the crushing is to to get a smooth finish with the viva method. I would love to hear your thoughts. Also, I gave black fondant. So was wondering too if adding gunpaste while ruin the black color?Rhanta why I wanted to go the tylose powder route.

Dani1081: Thanks for the encouragement. I have also done all gumpaste with other colors.. let me see if I can get a jet black easily. If not hen I will go with the fondant with tylose.powder. it doesn't hurt to make both. The skewer idea is awesome.

jiya11 Posted 19 Nov 2012 , 12:40pm

A

Original message sent by BakingIrene

Uhh, NO.  If you don't have a rigid cake board, then keep the base cake on a sheet pan.

And I would be so much happier if you could transport the cakes NOT stacked for this first effort.  A stacked cake weighs a LOT when assembled.

Thanks for the advise. I will definitely see if I can put the cake drum on a sheet pan or something. Better be safe than sorry.

I just won't be able to assemble it there that was a reason I researched into taking it assembled. With all he advise, I am hoping it works. Please wish me luck.

jiya11 Posted 19 Nov 2012 , 12:44pm

A

Original message sent by jiya11

Thanks Jaja310 and Dani1081: Jaja310. Do u recomment I should use a non crusting bc? Only reason I use the crushing is to to get a smooth finish with the viva method. I would love to hear your thoughts Also, I have black fondant. So was wondering too if adding gunpaste will ruin the black color? Thats why I wanted to go the tylose powder route. Dani1081: Thanks for the encouragement. I have also done all gumpaste with other colors.. let me see if I can get a jet black easily. If not then I will go with the fondant with tylose.powder. it doesn't hurt to make both. The skewer idea is awesome.

Sorry for all the typos. Using my phone and dont like the auto correct in these situations ..and my fingers seems to have swelled on me ;) Corrected the typos on the quote above.

sweetpea223 Posted 19 Nov 2012 , 12:53pm

Jiya11,

 

I did a 3 tier cake for my niece and because I don't have all the equipments to bring the cake delivered stacked and didn't want to mess up my first tiered cake,

I decided I'd stack the first 2 tiers and top the last one as I got to the venue (this was a longer trip anyway). But on my second try... I was more daring and brought it stacked with the dowels in the cake (shorter trip). I agree with BakingIrene, that it would be safer to have a solid pan or wood when you carry the cake in.

 

Good luck and keep up the good work. Planning ahead helps...

jiya11 Posted 19 Nov 2012 , 12:59pm

A

Original message sent by sweetpea223

Jiya11,

I did a 3 tier cake for my niece and because I don't have all the equipments to bring the cake delivered stacked and didn't want to mess up my first tiered cake, I decided I'd stack the first 2 tiers and top the last one as I got to the venue (this was a longer trip anyway). But on my second try... I was more daring and brought it stacked with the dowels in the cake (shorter trip). I agree with BakingIrene, that it would be safer to have a solid pan or wood when you carry the cake in.

Good luck and keep up the good work. Planning ahead helps...

Thanks so much. I will get a wooden board/ masonite now. I am not taking any risks.

leah_s Posted 19 Nov 2012 , 2:21pm

The cake drum will be fine on the bottom.  It is plenty of support for a cake this small.  I've delivered literally hundreds of them on a cake drum.  In fact that's really all I ever use on the bottom.

 

You can put the 10" cake directly on the cake drum, fill, weight it for settling, and then ice it right on the cake drum.  You may have to do a little clean up of the board at the end.

 

Dowels will work, unless you have a local cake store that sells SPS.  In that case I highly recommend it for your support system.

 

Don't forget to allow for settling.  http://cakecentral.com/t/633571/my-newest-trick

remnant3333 Posted 19 Nov 2012 , 2:35pm

Make sure all your cakes are level.  I am going to try to tier a cake in the end of Dec for a birthday cake. I am only doing 2 tiers. I am doing it for a 16 year girl. I know I must get my cake layers level. I have had problems in past just trying to get a cake level that is not tierd. I have read so much and learned from this site so I think I can do it.  I also have a leveler and cutter now so that should make it easier for me. 

 

I am sure that you are going to do fine with this cake!! Make sure you take a picture of your cake and post it!!! Can't wait to see it. I am sure it will be beautiful!!!!!
 

jiya11 Posted 19 Nov 2012 , 2:35pm

A[quote name="leah_s" url="/t/751237/my-first-three-tier-cake-whole-loads-of-questions-and-advise-please#post_7336315"]The cake drum will be fine on the bottom.  It is plenty of support for a cake this small.  I've delivered literally hundreds of them on a cake drum.  In fact that's really all I ever use on the bottom.

You can put the 10" cake directly on the cake drum, fill, weight it for settling, and then ice it right on the cake drum.  You may have to do a little clean up of the board at the end.

Dowels will work, unless you have a local cake store that sells SPS.  In that case I highly recommend it for your support system.

Don't forget to allow for settling.  [URL=http://cakecentral.com/t/633571/my-newest-trick]http://cakecentral.com/t/633571/my-newest-trick[/URL] [/quogte]

Thanks so much Leah. I had seen your thread about weighing it down and had made a mental note for my future cakes but it slipped off my mind this time. Thanks for the reminder. I have added it to my schedule. You are awesome!

www.****************** is a five minute drive from my place :) This cake is going to be a gift (one pricey gift), but doing it more for experience at the same time. I have been tempted with the SPS system but soon...hopefully soon...

jaja310 Posted 20 Nov 2012 , 1:57am

Whether you use crusting buttercream or not is personal preference. I like the way the

non crusting recipes perform and taste over the crusting kind.

 

Can't wait to see the cake!icon_smile.gif

jiya11 Posted 20 Nov 2012 , 2:20am
Quote:
Originally Posted by jaja310 

Whether you use crusting buttercream or not is personal preference. I like the way the

non crusting recipes perform and taste over the crusting kind.

 

Can't wait to see the cake!icon_smile.gif


I will stick with the crusting kind on this one as that's the only one I have worked with. For a future practice cake, I would love to try out one of the non-crusting ones...

 

I am getting anxious as the time is nearing. I made the roses for the top tier and the button flowers for the bottom tier. The S shaped topper seems to be a pain.. I made three different ones and one of them broke, the second has cracks all around the edges and the third is not presentable enough! I have pulled enough of my hair.. have been reading through the forums for the past two hours.. don't know what is it that I am doing wrong...following the same advice... I guess I will end up buying a topper from michaels..

leah_s Posted 20 Nov 2012 , 6:41pm

AIf www.****************** is that close to you, go buy the SPS. It's very inexpensive. It is so easy and so secure. But read through the tutorial first!

jiya11 Posted 21 Nov 2012 , 4:04am

Gasp! I know I added more filling than i should have :'( ! It kind of cracked and broke open from the side and everything oozing out while settling. I tried to squeeze whatever I could and kind of crumbcoat on the side but its missing chunks of cake now!! Cake due Thursday noon EST and this is the bottom tier. Two more tiers going on top, 8 inch and 6 inch. Pic attached. Can this be salvaged somehow? I was weighing it down with the same sized cake pan and 4lbs bag of powdered sugar..

 

Please advise asap!! Do I bake another cake?

 

700

 

The other end:

700

 

 

P.s. I do have a 6 inch cake in the freezer same flavor.. made it with leftover batter. Also have same flavored cake crumbs for cake pops..

denetteb Posted 21 Nov 2012 , 4:53am

AYegads, Jiya. Hmmmmm, yes, I am stalling! I hope Leah comes back on with some ideas for you. So is it 4 layers of cake and 3 filling? Is it the same filling for all? It looks like the top and bottom filling is buttercream and the middle has the strawberry? Can you take the strawberry section apart, try to remove the filling and just use buttercream? Spackle in the hole with your spare cake pieces? and then ice? This is a gift, not a paid cake, right? If it is a paid cake, rebake. If it is a gift you can be a little more "creative". I would try to separate them and see if the cake is salvagable or not, if it is wet and mushy from the filling then you need to rebake.

jiya11 Posted 21 Nov 2012 , 5:01am

A

Original message sent by denetteb

Yegads, Jiya. Hmmmmm, yes, I am stalling! I hope Leah comes back on with some ideas for you. So is it 4 layers of cake and 3 filling? Is it the same filling for all? It looks like the top and bottom filling is buttercream and the middle has the strawberry? Can you take the strawberry section apart, try to remove the filling and just use buttercream? Spackle in the hole with your spare cake pieces? and then ice? This is a gift, not a paid cake, right? If it is a paid cake, rebake. If it is a gift you can be a little more "creative". I would try to separate them and see if the cake is salvagable or not, if it is wet and mushy from the filling then you need to rebake.

You got it right about the layers.. all four are filled with canned strawberry pie filling. With a dam around it. I tried to take it apart but its stuck pretty *good* :) It's a bottom tier and there will be two more tiers on top.

Do u think I should make white chocolate ganache(never made one) and cover the cake it? I am loosing my sleep over it..

denetteb Posted 21 Nov 2012 , 5:15am

ANo sense losing sleep over it. I think you should just rebake so you don't have to spend the next 2 1/2 days worrying if it is going to collapse. Rebake and just use buttercream for a filling. You might even change to buttercream for all of the fillings, simplify it a bit since you will be losing time rebaking. I think you would be better to rebake than try a new recipe and technique with the ganache that may or may not solve the problem. But if you do rebake, don't throw this one out, it will taste fabulous, so take some whipped cream, like a couple of containers of cool whip and slather it on with nice soft swoops and bring it in to work, friends, neighbors or whoever. It will look nice and they will love you. The thing that has me concerned is that it is the bottom of 3 layers, if it was a stand alone cake it is a whole different thing.

jiya11 Posted 21 Nov 2012 , 5:34am

A

Original message sent by denetteb

No sense losing sleep over it. I think you should just rebake so you don't have to spend the next 2 1/2 days worrying if it is going to collapse. Rebake and just use buttercream for a filling. You might even change to buttercream for all of the fillings, simplify it a bit since you will be losing time rebaking. I think you would be better to rebake than try a new recipe and technique with the ganache that may or may not solve the problem. But if you do rebake, don't throw this one out, it will taste fabulous, so take some whipped cream, like a couple of containers of cool whip and slather it on with nice soft swoops and bring it in to work, friends, neighbors or whoever. It will look nice and they will love you. The thing that has me concerned is that it is the bottom of 3 layers, if it was a stand alone cake it is a whole different thing.

I guess you are right. Thanks for your support. I have teary eyes right now to see that you guys are spoon supportive and are here to console, re-energize and encourage..Thanks a bunch. Big hug!!. It's 12:30.. I guess I will just go ahead a bake another cake tomorrow after my class..fill it with bc and move on!

Should I still use wasc for the base tier?

Don't worry, this cake will be devoured by friends and family..and hubby's co workers. I will grab supplies tomorrow afternoon to bake another one. Thanks once again!!

Time to do the dishes.... my most dreaded job!

jiya11 Posted 21 Nov 2012 , 5:35am

AIn the meanwhile, I will be looking out here periodically if there are any more suggestions/advise..

leah_s Posted 21 Nov 2012 , 6:56am

ADefinitely too much filling, and very likely too much weight on the cake for the settling process. In my original thread I noted to use 1 ceramic tile ( not marble, too heavy) and talked about previously using an empty cake pan and a paperback book. That should give you an indication of the amount of weight, which really is not much. With a chunk of cake broken off and all that filling I think you need to rebake. Also, I'm sure that some people use pie filling successfully, but its awfully, loose/gooey and fairly unstable. There are cake fillings in a sleeve sold in cake supply stores that are developed for cake.

denetteb Posted 21 Nov 2012 , 3:37pm

Leah, I am glad you came back on this one.  I had thought that was a lot of weight to settle the cakes but wasn't certain enough to comment on it.  Glad you clarified that for her.  And me too.  Go ahead and use the wasc that you originally used.  It wasn't the cause of the problem so no need to try another recipe.  And when you rebake, cut a circle of parchment paper (or wax paper if you have no parchment) and put it in the bottom of the pan.  That way you are assured that the bottom won't stick and you will have an intact cake.  Jiya, I hope you got some good sleep, try not to stress too much about it, you still have time to get things straightened out.  How are the other two tiers coming along?
 

leah_s Posted 21 Nov 2012 , 5:28pm

AAlso, did you level those layers before you assembled them? Because frankly, the top does not look level. But it may just be the picture.

jiya11 Posted 21 Nov 2012 , 7:38pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by leah_s 

Also, did you level those layers before you assembled them? Because frankly, the top does not look level. But it may just be the picture.

I have a Wilton cake leveler and thats how I torted them.. they sure looked even but with all the goey filling mess.. everything fell apart. I patched it up and did two coats of icing.. will pipe a turkey on top and its going to hubby's work tomorrow! (He s working tomorrow)

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by leah_s 

Definitely too much filling, and very likely too much weight on the cake for the settling process. In my original thread I noted to use 1 ceramic tile ( not marble, too heavy) and talked about previously using an empty cake pan and a paperback book. That should give you an indication of the amount of weight, which really is not much.
With a chunk of cake broken off and all that filling I think you need to rebake. Also, I'm sure that some people use pie filling successfully, but its awfully, loose/gooey and fairly unstable. There are cake fillings in a sleeve sold in cake supply stores that are developed for cake.

 

Yes.. I dont know what I was thinking.. I was estimating the weight of the top two tiers and put weight accordingly but now it all makes sense.. that's why there are the dowels!!! Oh stupid me! Will use a book now..

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by denetteb 

Leah, I am glad you came back on this one.  I had thought that was a lot of weight to settle the cakes but wasn't certain enough to comment on it.  Glad you clarified that for her.  And me too.  Go ahead and use the wasc that you originally used.  It wasn't the cause of the problem so no need to try another recipe.  And when you rebake, cut a circle of parchment paper (or wax paper if you have no parchment) and put it in the bottom of the pan.  That way you are assured that the bottom won't stick and you will have an intact cake.  Jiya, I hope you got some good sleep, try not to stress too much about it, you still have time to get things straightened out.  How are the other two tiers coming along?
 

Thanks Denetteb, I just came back from my class and got the supplies to bake another. I am fresh and re-energized now! I have parchment.. The other tiers look pretty.. one thing i noticed is my top tier is about 1/2 an inch shorter that the other.. I hope that works..

 

Thanks,  did got some sleep as I still had to prepare for my class today... Man piping basket weave is a pain..!! but the cake turned out pretty cute!! I will see if I can post a pic of that for some constructive criticism from you guys!

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