The Great Debate Put To The Test ~ Scratch Vs. Boxed
Decorating By yummy_in_my_tummy Updated 17 May 2011 , 7:03pm by jules5000
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This is a classic example of how scratch baking is different. Edencakes is a dump recipe - dump every thing in a bowl and mix for 2 minutes and then add the eggs. This method does produce a dry cake, dense cake. the egg whites aren't even beaten to incorporate some lightness into the cake.
There are other methods for mixing a scratch cake that produces a lighter, moister crumb.
Of course box won, it had all those chemicals that gives a moister and more tender mouth feel that equates to a moister cake. So box didn't win - chemicals won.[/quote]
Like I said...I'm sure other scratch recipes would be better. I was just posting the results I came up with when testing the different WASC.
After following this post for a while I decided to conduct my own test. I baked one 9x13" pan each of 1) a doctored boxed mix, 2) a straight up boxed Betty Crocker Super Moist Yellow cake mix and 3) my standard yellow cake recipe. I cut up each cake into 120 small pieces. Took 'em to my sons' High School this morning. During first break I had 120 students and teachers sample each slice, taking a sip of water in between slices. They did not know beforehand the differences in the cakes' origin (i.e. scratch, mix, doctored). I asked them to choose their favorite in terms of visual appeal, flavor and texture.
The results:
119 out of 120 people picked my scratch yellow Cake as their favorite (note: Prior to today, I had never served this cake to my respondents.)
1 out of 120 picked the Betty Crocker straight up because it tasted exactly like his mom's cake
0 picked the doctored cake mix recipe
111 people or 92.5% correctly identified the cake made from scratch
8 people or 6 % thought the Betty Crocker was scratch
1 person less than 1% or thought the doctored was scratch
64 people (53%) correctly identified the box mix cake
47 (39%) thought doctored cake was the Betty Crocker box mix cake
9 (7.5%) people thought the scratch cake was made from a box
Note: I did not ask them to distinguish between boxed and doctored
Some stand out comments
This cake (referring to scratch) melts in your mouth while the others taste cottony.
This cake is hard to swallow (referring to Betty Crocker)
Everything about this cake tastes fake, especially the smell (referring to BC)
My least favorite (referring to doctored)
Too starchy (referring to doctored)
At first it kinda tastes bland compared to [the box] but then all the good stuff comes out from somewhere. It doesn't hit you on the head but when you start tasting it, it's like butter and vanilla and sugar, and it makes you want more and more (referring to scratch - from a rather poetic sophomore)
Can I buy the rest of the box? (referring to scratch)
The best cake ever (referring to scratch; said by a lot!)
**edited twice for clarity and to correct my horrible spelling**
Thanks for the details of your tasting, KK!
Would you share your yellow recipe with us? I have better luck with scratch recipes if they have some kind of shortening or oil in them. The butter recipes can be finicky.
Please share the scratch recipe for us. I have yet to come up with one that isn't dry. Thanks!
Please share the scratch recipe for us. I have yet to come up with one that isn't dry. Thanks!
Sylvia Weinstock's yellow cake from her earlier book. My favorite layer cake. 
That's my go to vanilla butter cake too... so good!
... and that was a great test too. Glad to know the results from someone who bakes from scratch regularly as that is the ultimate test right there.
Thank you Cupcake Cutie. I will try these out soon
some of us do not have that book and do not have the money to currently buy it. Is it here on Cake Central? And how exactly is it titled? Thanks.
Here you go, Jules. I think there are recipes in one of these links.
http://thebakemore.blogspot.com/2011/01/white-cake-taste-test.html
http://thebakemore.blogspot.com/2009/06/great-scratch-off-june-2009-yellow-cake.html
http://cakecentral.com/cake-decorating-ftopic-702778-0.html
Thank you very much. I have a question for all of you. I just recently made a white sourcream cake and tried a new recipe that sounded yummy. I just talked to my pastor's wife who ordered the cake and she said it was good, but a little dry and a lot crumbly. I put the timer on for what the cake said and I kept checking it ever few min. or so and tested it at least 3 times with a bamboo skewer and the last time it checked out ok so I took it out. Then I realized after I talked to her that I did not use a heating core and probably should have would that have helped it not be dry? Or does that just help cook it better from the inside out as well as outside in? It was an 11x15. So I bet that was my mistake, but if any of you have any other ideas I would love to hear them. I usually don't have problems with my cakes. Thanks in advance for any helpful tips that you might have.
Typical that when someone's results come up that a box cake won, of course it won simply because of the chemicals.
This is why these discussions get ugly.
Maybe the people who taste tested just simply liked the mix better? Why can't some people understand that some people like mixes better? Regardless of how great the scratch cake is? We all have different tastes and some people just like all the chemicals.
Yum.
Typical that when someone's results come up that a box cake won, of course it won simply because of the chemicals.
This is why these discussions get ugly.
Maybe the people who taste tested just simply liked the mix better? Why can't some people understand that some people like mixes better? Regardless of how great the scratch cake is? We all have different tastes and some people just like all the chemicals.
Yum.
My point exactly. The chemicals won because is what people are used to tasting. It actually takes a while for your taste buds to adjust. My MIL made BC yellow cake for years and I ate it. It wasn't until I started baking from scratch and then had that same cake that the chemical taste came out. My taste buds had adjusted and I could now taste the difference. And I did not like it anymore.
I wasn't getting ugly in my statement, I was stating a fact. Maybe if we stopped perceiving in our heads that it is getting ugly and not state that fact then others won't perceive it as ugly either. It only gets ugly if you perceive it gets ugly. Perceive it what you want, but don't go telling me what I said is ugly. I have the right to state an opinion like everybody else.
I have no problems with other people liking the chemicals. I understand completely. I used to be one of those cake mix people. I have been on both sides. I wasn't raised on scratch alone. I was raised on if it didn't come from a box, it couldn't be used. And this is just not cake, it was BC scalloped potatoes, Kraft Mac and cheese, Shake and Bake, and all those other box like stuff in the middle of the grocery store. Once you start cooking and baking with what nature grows and not what is produced in a lab you then begin to see the difference. If you like it still from the box then go for it. But there are alternatives too. I personally decided that I like the natural taste more than the chemical taste.
Like I said all along a taste off doesn't exactly work if one is used to the chemical taste in cake. You have to bake and eat it for probably about a month daily (hey, it's a sacrifice but we are retraining our taste buds) and then try the cake mix. Then you will know if you like the chemical taste or the taste of real sugar, butter, eggs and flavorings.
My mom did cake both ways when I was growing up, but I always liked the from scratch better. I guess the box mixes today are better than they were then, but I can't imagine preferring cake mix cakes to scratch. I guess I also figure that w/o all those chemicals it is better for you--if cake can be heathy? I like my cake mix doctor cookbook because it gives me different ways to add things to my cake mixes w/o me having to figure out all the math and where I substitute what for something in the scratch if I want to change it around some.. Most scratch recipes stand on their own. To each his own.
Also I agree that just because somebody states an opinion that doesn't mean things are getting ugly. Let's grow up around here. Maybe you might have perceived what the person what saying if you think what they are saying is ugly. So give someone a break and go back and figure out what they were really saying. Just because they might disagree with you doesn't mean they are getting ugly or are wrong.
I have found most people on Cake Central to be very nice and helpful.
I guess I'm just picking up from what about 90% of the posters on this forum say about scratch vs. box. I got called out for even asking about who did what.
And it was a typical response from someone who bakes scratch. Scratch is better because.....well, some people don't think scratch is better.
And speaking of getting on someone for stating an opinion....let's get off MY back now, shall we?
So, ok, I'll quit beating around the bush and say what I really mean considering you want us to grow up here.
I guess what it really comes down to is that I (and I'm sure other mix bakers) feel slighted and put down by scratch bakers because I don't "have the skill to make a REAL cake". Not all the scratch bakers do this but a lot do, maybe unintentionally but still they do.
Thank you very much. I have a question for all of you. I just recently made a white sourcream cake and tried a new recipe that sounded yummy. I just talked to my pastor's wife who ordered the cake and she said it was good, but a little dry and a lot crumbly. I put the timer on for what the cake said and I kept checking it ever few min. or so and tested it at least 3 times with a bamboo skewer and the last time it checked out ok so I took it out. Then I realized after I talked to her that I did not use a heating core and probably should have would that have helped it not be dry? Or does that just help cook it better from the inside out as well as outside in? It was an 11x15. So I bet that was my mistake, but if any of you have any other ideas I would love to hear them. I usually don't have problems with my cakes. Thanks in advance for any helpful tips that you might have.
I've never had a dryness problem with the WASC recipes, almost the opposite at times. It could be from overbaking the cake if you say you had to check it for doneness so many times. Do you have a oven thermometer? Its wise to have one, as your oven could be baking too hot or not hot enough and that'll mess up you baking too.
As for heating cores. I have one but don't use it. I use flower nails instead. Way easier and no cake plugs to replace. I use two flower nails in my 11x15 and I also use baking strips.
After having the WASC recipe failing more than once, I switched to self - raising cake and pastry flour and superfine sugar in place of the AP flour & regular sugar, thanks to a hint from a fellow caker. I also started using flower nails and baking strips in all my pans as I mentioned, except 6 inch and under and haven't had a problem since. Knock on wood! 
I guess I'm just picking up from what about 90% of the posters on this forum say about scratch vs. box. I got called out for even asking about who did what.
And it was a typical response from someone who bakes scratch. Scratch is better because.....well, some people don't think scratch is better.
And speaking of getting on someone for stating an opinion....let's get off MY back now, shall we?
ouch! You take stuff too personal. And now I agree with this statement it is getting too ugly. I think we should just stick to the topic at hand.
I bet you if everybody had sided with you, you would be putting out a message that said get off of my back. So agree to disagree and drop it. And now I am done watching this topic.
I really don't take stuff too personal. I'm not angry. This is a forum. Of strangers.
I'm just callin' it like I see it. But yes, let's drop it.
This we can agree on.
So, ok, I'll quit beating around the bush and say what I really mean considering you want us to grow up here.
I guess what it really comes down to is that I (and I'm sure other mix bakers) feel slighted and put down by scratch bakers because I don't "have the skill to make a REAL cake". Not all the scratch bakers do this but a lot do, maybe unintentionally but still they do.
I see what you're talking about all the time! Then, people say 'I'm just trying to be honest, not rude'. Well, I don't buy that one bit! There are a handful of scratch bakers here that have a habit of making 'honest' comments that come across as awfully rude. Scratch may be better to some, but mix is better to others. No one is wrong in having an opinion one way or the other. People could just try to be a bit less 'higher than thou' about it.
I've baked cakes on and off most of my life. Some from scratch, some from boxes. Unless I'm making something with a flavor you can't buy in the store, I use a box mix. Every now and then I try scratch recipes because I keep hoping i'm going to come across some that are as amazing and moist as a box mix. For the most part that's my biggest complaint with scratch mixes - they tend to be more dense and not as moist. Maybe it's just my recipe source so I'm definitely going to check out some of the recipes listed here!! I'd gladly put the extra time into scratch mixes if I was convinced it was worth it. Thanks all!
So, ok, I'll quit beating around the bush and say what I really mean considering you want us to grow up here.
I guess what it really comes down to is that I (and I'm sure other mix bakers) feel slighted and put down by scratch bakers because I don't "have the skill to make a REAL cake". Not all the scratch bakers do this but a lot do, maybe unintentionally but still they do.
I see what you're talking about all the time! Then, people say 'I'm just trying to be honest, not rude'. Well, I don't buy that one bit! There are a handful of scratch bakers here that have a habit of making 'honest' comments that come across as awfully rude. Scratch may be better to some, but mix is better to others. No one is wrong in having an opinion one way or the other. People could just try to be a bit less 'higher than thou' about it.
Maybe it's a Kristie thing (it's how i spell my name too) LOL
When I first started cake decorating (not too long ago) I used cake mixes for ease and consistency. However, in the UK, I think it's cheaper to bake scratch cakes than using cake mixes, plus we don't have such a variety on offer either.
After reading those rave reviews, I've searched around for Sylvia Weinstock's classic yellow cake recipe and will hopefully try it out this week.
<watch this topic for replies with a big tub of popcorn>
So this is where this is a big'ole fail despite its good-meaning intentions...
Box mix bakers generally can't bake from scratch. There, I said it. They don't know the chemistry, do's and don'ts, what makes a good recipe and they probably don't even have one in their recipe box. If anyone even volunteered chances are they bake up a big brick of over mixed, over baked, dry scratch cake then proclaim Betty Crocker the winner.
I won't bake boxed mix because I don't eat hydrogenated, fake, artificial crap, and wouldn't serve that to my friends/family even in jest. I have a reputation, you see.
Judging from how testy everyone is tonight, this thread otta get real good, real fast
Jen
I'm in a Wilton's cake class, so right now, the past 2 weeks, every cake has been a crappy box cake. Because I don't have a dummy cake, the numerous cakes, and my time (I work from home, and often make my practice cakes while I'm working...) spent baking them, I opted for on sale box cakes. I can defend this, cause I hate throwing away food, and I'm making them to learn technique of decorating.
So, the other day, I made 3 box cakes, froze them for my practice cakes, and I cringe even putting cake mix in my cart at the grocery store. .This will be my third class this week, and it's basic Cake Decorating.1
..I have 2 more classes (fondant, then flower making or vice versa) after this, and my family is inpatient...but...understanding. When I say, don't eat it, it's for practice, they know I mean it. I've taught myself to throw it away.
I can't wait to make one from scratch. My favorites are the recipes from Penzey's...I'm an addict of that store. But for my practice cakes, even the one's from scratch, I went with cheap ingredients and quick. the cake i'm making for my neighbor's birthday will not be a box, cause, I like the cakes from scratch.
<watch this topic for replies with a big tub of popcorn>
So this is where this is a big'ole fail despite its good-meaning intentions...
Box mix bakers generally can't bake from scratch. There, I said it. They don't know the chemistry, do's and don'ts, what makes a good recipe and they probably don't even have one in their recipe box. If anyone even volunteered chances are they bake up a big brick of over mixed, over baked, dry scratch cake then proclaim Betty Crocker the winner.
I won't bake boxed mix because I don't eat hydrogenated, fake, artificial crap, and wouldn't serve that to my friends/family even in jest. I have a reputation, you see.
Judging from how testy everyone is tonight, this thread otta get real good, real fast
Jen
I'm in a Wilton's cake class, so right now, the past 2 weeks, every cake has been a crappy box cake. Because I don't have a dummy cake, the numerous cakes, and my time (I work from home, and often make my practice cakes while I'm working...) spent baking them, I opted for on sale box cakes. I can defend this, cause I hate throwing away food, and I'm making them to learn technique of decorating.
So, the other day, I made 3 box cakes, froze them for my practice cakes, and I cringe even putting cake mix in my cart at the grocery store. .This will be my third class this week, and it's basic Cake Decorating.1
..I have 2 more classes (fondant, then flower making or vice versa) after this, and my family is inpatient...but...understanding. When I say, don't eat it, it's for practice, they know I mean it. I've taught myself to throw it away.
I can't wait to make one from scratch. My favorites are the recipes from Penzey's...I'm an addict of that store. But for my practice cakes, even the one's from scratch, I went with cheap ingredients and quick. the cake i'm making for my neighbor's birthday will not be a box, cause, I like the cakes from scratch.
I don't get it. You state you hate throwing away food, yet you tell your family not to eat your practice cakes, because you'd rather throw them away?
If you dislike mixes so much, why would you keep buying them instead of a dummy or two that could be reused for each class? Seems like an awful waste of money.
I've not been anywhere to buy a dummy...but I think I've solved the cake problem...I finally bought those Wilton baking strips. My cakes were coming out too crumbly. I've only thrown out a couple...my poor neighbors get them. Or, they go into cake pops, which I prefer to make from scratch.
With all this baking,I've not had time to actually enjoy the process of baking from scratch. I'm trying to get the technique right now. I'm also trying to perfect a vegan cake recipe, so that's another possible hurdle. I have several vegan cook books.
And, so, I've switched to box cakes, to perfect frosting techniques, and on the weekend, making vegan cakes to perfect the vegan cake recipe. (I'm not vegan, but I lean that way). So, on the weekends, I play with my food. lol. On the week nights, I'm perfecting techniques. I actually want to take a mix, and make a vegan cake of the same type, and see if people can tell the difference. The vegan icing is tricky, but can be done, without merainge powder. it's a science to perfect technique, then play with what you lean.
I just prefer scratch cakes, but I make cake mix cakes also. I don't always have the time to do from scratch and yes they do take more time. Cake mixes are better these days then when I was growing up. I do not believe that people who prefer cake mixes to scratch can't bake from scratch, they probably either don't have the time or don't even want to try because they prefer the cake mixes. There are a lot of cake mix flavors out there. I shop at Aldi's and they have really good cake mixes. I use them completely a lot of the time. Very moist. So if there are any hard feelings from anything that I said before because of a misunderstanding please forgive. It certainly was not intended.
There is a huge difference between being honest and stating an opinion and being rude. I did not personally see that anyone that stated an opinion even if it differed from mine was rude. So again I think that some of the readers are reading insults into things written that were not meant.
And yes, I think that if you are so petty that you read an insult where one was not intended than some growing up needs to be done. I will not apologize for that. If the shoe fits, wear it.
I just prefer scratch cakes, but I make cake mix cakes also. I don't always have the time to do from scratch and yes they do take more time. Cake mixes are better these days then when I was growing up. I do not believe that people who prefer cake mixes to scratch can't bake from scratch, they probably either don't have the time or don't even want to try because they prefer the cake mixes. There are a lot of cake mix flavors out there. I shop at Aldi's and they have really good cake mixes. I use them completely a lot of the time. Very moist. So if there are any hard feelings from anything that I said before because of a misunderstanding please forgive. It certainly was not intended.
There is a huge difference between being honest and stating an opinion and being rude. I did not personally see that anyone that stated an opinion even if it differed from mine was rude. So again I think that some of the readers are reading insults into things written that were not meant.
And yes, I think that if you are so petty that you read an insult where one was not intended than some growing up needs to be done. I will not apologize for that. If the shoe fits, wear it.
Aldi's is a very good brand. It owns TJ's. So Aldi's I hold in high regard, cause Trader Joe's is one of my favorite stores.
This is just the stupidest conversation I am not sure why I am continuing but....
Why did everyone jump on me and say I needed growing up? That I was reading into something that wasn't there? I didn't insult anyone either. I stated my opinion that it is typically the answer a scratch baker gives to a boxer maker. Mix is fake. Not real. Garbage. It's demeaning to those who use it regularly to say that their product is substandard. The original poster to who I was referring may not have meant to be rude and that's fine. I came back here to explain why I said what I did and even that was met with comments about growing up and being honest versus being rude.... (it wouldn't take a genius to figure out who you were referring to).
I didn't ask anyone to apologize for anything and quite frankly like it when people are honest, even if we disagree. And this wasn't personal until someone else made it so by personally calling me out for getting on another persons opinion. I've never been anything BUT honest. My statement was honest. Was my honestly rude and everyone else's not? I guess I don't get how my one comment morphed into this "thing".
Then I got called out for stating an opinion about this topic getting ugly. You'd be lying through your teeth if you didn't say that 99% of the time, this debate gets heated and ugly.
I didn't call anyone out or call them stupid. Or act in any way childish. I came back and explained myself. But that wasn't good enough because apparently I am the bad guy in this discussion and that's fine. Like I said before, I don't take this forum personally.
You're talking out of both sides of your mouth and it really sucks that you think I'm the one who needs to grow up.
But since continuing on with this is childish, I'm going to stop. There's no point trying to convince you of anything since you made your split second decision about me a ways back.
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