bellaudreycakes Posted 18 Jan 2011 , 6:43pm
post #1 of

Does anyone have a list of what expenses they would incur when opening up a small bakery, it just seems like so much, and I'm afraid I'm leaving things out in my spreadsheet, so far I have

Rent
Insurance
Gas/water Bill
Electric Bill
Phone Bill
Cost of supplies per month

I am just trying to make an expense list to see how much profit I will need to make a month.

Thanks for any help!

48 replies
brincess_b Posted 18 Jan 2011 , 6:57pm
post #2 of

cleaning supplies - certainly an initial investment then new bottles of XYZ every so often
uniform/ health and safety clothing - gloves, whatever is required... again the initial cost but eventually need to replace/ restock
xx

Christy0722 Posted 18 Jan 2011 , 7:05pm
post #3 of

So far what you have looks good. However, don't forget your payroll and your taxes. Are you going to do your own books? If not, you'll need to include an accountant. You also need to figure in a little extra for those unexpected expenses (something breaks, replacement parts, etc). Also, do you own all of your own equipment or will you be leasing? I own all my own so I don't have that monthly expense.

Since my bakery is out of state (I live right on the state line and the rent/utilites were much cheaper in the other state) I have to pay an attorney a Resident Agent fee each year. I have that figured into my yearly expenses.

Good luck!! I'm finally getting mine going! Been working on it for 3 years and it's finally becoming a reality. BUT i'm also paying for everything out of pocket so that I will have very low overhead...no loans, leases on equipment, etc.

Malakin Posted 18 Jan 2011 , 7:19pm
post #4 of

We also have to get a business license in my county, food handlers permits.

jason_kraft Posted 18 Jan 2011 , 7:30pm
post #5 of

If you will be taking out loans to start the business, don't forget the interest payments. If you're building out new space that was not previously licensed you may have significant one-time startup costs that will translate into increased interest payments.

You should also make sure to separate costs into fixed vs. variable to better gauge expected profitability over time.

TexasSugar Posted 18 Jan 2011 , 7:51pm
post #6 of

Computer/printer (ink/paper) for order forms, contracts and such.

Furniture like desk, chairs...Plus your cake equipment.

Basic office supplies (outside of the cake stuff), such as pens/pencils, notepads, calendars, toilet paper, hand soap, paper towels, brooms, mops, cleaners.

CWR41 Posted 18 Jan 2011 , 8:01pm
post #7 of

Good question... the answers would be in your business plan.

Some one-time start-up costs to consider (office expenses):
Computers, printer/copier, cash register, coffee brewer and decanters, stir stick dispenser, cake stands (for samples and displays), microwave, safe, power tools and replacement batteries for cordless equipment, scissors, tape dispensers, staplers, soft drink vending machine(s), vacuum, time clock, signage (plus sign painter labor & installation), neon "open" signs, furniture (conference table, chairs, cubical walls, office desk, file cabinets, bookshelves, displays, etc.), telephones and equipment, cordless headsets, TV, digital picture frames, lockers, display cases, countertops, video security system, trash bins, wastebaskets, styrofoam dummies (for displays), surge protectors, clipboards, calculators, register corporation fees, business license application fee and 1st time gross license fee, initial accountant, consultant, and attorney fees.

(operating supplies/equipment):
Freezer, cooler, airbrushes (hoses, hangers, fittings, compressors), fans, glue gun, pencil sharpener, wire cutters, pliers, mop, bucket, enclosed cabinets, full size sheet pans, pan racks, spatulas, serrated knives, mixer, stainless steel work tables, industrial shelving, ergonomic stools, step stools, two or three-compartment sink with drainboards (plus faucet, spout, mounting kit, plumbing materials and installation), jig saw, turntables, decorating tubes/tips, pastry bags and couplers, mixing bowls, rubber mallet, claw hammer, foldaway platform truck, utility carts, personal handtruck, pallet jack, delivery vehicle, GPS system, angled tweezers, aprons, storage containers & lids, hack saw, shop trash containers with dolly and lid, power strips, start-up supply of separator plates and columns, silver cake plateaus (for rentals).

(product and materials inventory):
Copy paper, thermal paper rolls (for cash register), regular and decaf coffee, cups, lids, stir sticks, creamer, sugar, artificial sweetener, napkins, forks, plates, tissues, toilet tissue, paper towels, Handi Wipes towels, glue sticks, tape, staples, highlighters, pens, pencils, markers, dowel rods (plastic and wooden), soft drinks, bottled water, vacuum bags, pine cleaner, sanitizer, dish detergent, time cards and replacement ribbons (for time clock), airbrush color, paste color, business cards, brochures, parchment paper pan liners, assortment of cake toppers, toasting glasses, and cake knife & server boxed sets, gumpaste/gumpaste toppers and flowers, cardboard cake circles, cake drums, styrofoam dummies (for orders/rentals), lace, ribbons, dragees, foil leaves, poly-foil rolls, skewers, wax paper, plastic food wrap film, foodservice foil, bakery boxes, vinyl gloves, rack covers, quinns/decorettes/sprinkles, trash can liners, initial start-up supply of all ingredients.

Some reoccurring costs to consider:
Lease, credit card usage fee, telephone service, Yellow Pages ad, business cards and brochures, electricity usage, water usage, gas usage, car insurance, liability insurance, delivery driver, employee wages, payroll taxes, replacement inventory all operating supplies, product, and materials. (plus more endless possibilities not listed like trash removal, strip mall sign fees, snow removal, parking lot repair fees... the potential list can go on and on!)

SCNYCharlie Posted 18 Jan 2011 , 8:16pm
post #8 of

HOLY COW icon_eek.gif ...god speed to you all icon_smile.gif

jason_kraft Posted 18 Jan 2011 , 8:24pm
post #9 of

That's why I decided to rent an existing commercial kitchen instead of opening my own shop...when renting an existing kitchen 95% of the items CWR41 posted become someone else's problem.

CWR41 Posted 18 Jan 2011 , 8:35pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Annabakescakes

Quote:
Originally Posted by CWR41

Good question... the answers would be in your business plan.

Some one-time start-up costs to consider (office expenses):
Computers, printer/copier, cash register, coffee brewer and decanters, stir stick dispenser, cake stands (for samples and displays), microwave, safe, power tools and replacement batteries for cordless equipment, scissors, tape dispensers, staplers, soft drink vending machine(s), vacuum, time clock, signage (plus sign painter labor & installation), neon "open" signs, furniture (conference table, chairs, cubical walls, office desk, file cabinets, bookshelves, displays, etc.), telephones and equipment, cordless headsets, TV, digital picture frames, lockers, display cases, countertops, video security system, trash bins, wastebaskets, styrofoam dummies (for displays), surge protectors, clipboards, calculators, register corporation fees, business license application fee and 1st time gross license fee, initial accountant, consultant, and attorney fees.

(operating supplies/equipment):
Freezer, cooler, airbrushes (hoses, hangers, fittings, compressors), fans, glue gun, pencil sharpener, wire cutters, pliers, mop, bucket, enclosed cabinets, full size sheet pans, pan racks, spatulas, serrated knives, mixer, stainless steel work tables, industrial shelving, ergonomic stools, step stools, two or three-compartment sink with drainboards (plus faucet, spout, mounting kit, plumbing materials and installation), jig saw, turntables, decorating tubes/tips, pastry bags and couplers, mixing bowls, rubber mallet, claw hammer, foldaway platform truck, utility carts, personal handtruck, pallet jack, delivery vehicle, GPS system, angled tweezers, aprons, storage containers & lids, hack saw, shop trash containers with dolly and lid, power strips, start-up supply of separator plates and columns, silver cake plateaus (for rentals).

(product and materials inventory):
Copy paper, thermal paper rolls (for cash register), regular and decaf coffee, cups, lids, stir sticks, creamer, sugar, artificial sweetener, napkins, forks, plates, tissues, toilet tissue, paper towels, Handi Wipes towels, glue sticks, tape, staples, highlighters, pens, pencils, markers, dowel rods (plastic and wooden), soft drinks, bottled water, vacuum bags, pine cleaner, sanitizer, dish detergent, time cards and replacement ribbons (for time clock), airbrush color, paste color, business cards, brochures, parchment paper pan liners, assortment of cake toppers, toasting glasses, and cake knife & server boxed sets, gumpaste/gumpaste toppers and flowers, cardboard cake circles, cake drums, styrofoam dummies (for orders/rentals), lace, ribbons, dragees, foil leaves, poly-foil rolls, skewers, wax paper, plastic food wrap film, foodservice foil, bakery boxes, vinyl gloves, rack covers, quinns/decorettes/sprinkles, trash can liners, initial start-up supply of all ingredients.

Some reoccurring costs to consider:
Lease, credit card usage fee, telephone service, Yellow Pages ad, business cards and brochures, electricity usage, water usage, gas usage, car insurance, liability insurance, delivery driver, employee wages, payroll taxes, replacement inventory all operating supplies, product, and materials. (plus more endless possibilities not listed like trash removal, strip mall sign fees, snow removal, parking lot repair fees... the potential list can go on and on!)



icon_eek.gificon_eek.gificon_eek.gificon_eek.gifthumbsdown.gif




What's up with the thumbs down? I took the time to answer the OP's question... I am I suppose to apologize because you don't appreciate it?

KHalstead Posted 18 Jan 2011 , 8:35pm

also, notice there weren't any "cake ingredients" in that list either! LOL

Think of all the pans, flour, sugar, eggs, butter, cake boards, cake boxes (tons of sizes of each), dowel rods, cupcake liners, etc. that you'll need!

jason_kraft Posted 18 Jan 2011 , 8:39pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by CWR41

What's up with the thumbs down? I took the time to answer the OP's question... I am I suppose to apologize because you don't appreciate it?



I'm pretty sure she was reacting to the daunting number of items and not the quality of your post. icon_razz.gif

CWR41 Posted 18 Jan 2011 , 8:40pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by KHalstead

also, notice there weren't any "cake ingredients" in that list either! LOL!




"initial start-up supply of all ingredients. "

(last line of last two paragraphs on the list.)

SpudCake Posted 18 Jan 2011 , 8:41pm

Chamber of Commerce dues and Health Dept License both yearly for me.

Joanne

jason_kraft Posted 18 Jan 2011 , 8:41pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by KHalstead

also, notice there weren't any "cake ingredients" in that list either!



The entry for the initial startup supply of all ingredients (as well as boxes, etc.) was under product and materials inventory.

CWR41 Posted 18 Jan 2011 , 8:45pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by jasonkraft

Quote:
Originally Posted by CWR41

What's up with the thumbs down? I took the time to answer the OP's question... I am I suppose to apologize because you don't appreciate it?


I'm pretty sure she was reacting to the daunting number of items and not the quality of your post. icon_razz.gif




I'd believe that's true from the "Holy cow" post, but I don't take it that way without any explanation of the thumbs down... but thanks, Jason.

bellaudreycakes Posted 18 Jan 2011 , 9:16pm

Wow!!! Thank you all, it helps alot! To start out it would just be myself working and eventually as things progress I would maybe hire additional help. The place I'm renting is downtown store front so has nice big window for displays and is close to all businesses. We also don't have a bakery in town so I am hoping that will help me out too. The rent I thought was exceptionally good $450/month and the place is decent size, it has an area in the back that I would use for the kitchen, would just need to put a wall up and another smaller room in the back that I thought I could use for consultations. The front of the store I would carry displays and the cupcakes/cookies along with complimentary coffee and bottled water for sale. I wanted to set up a few tables in the front for people to sit and enjoy their deserts. Also getting Wi-Fi, so people could use their laptops. We also have something in my town for small business loans that are giving new small business owners a loan for a very low interest rate, which I would need to make the renovations. Just got off the phone with the insurance guy and he said somewhere between 500-700 per year in insurance. That number sound right? Anyway the ball is rolling, I know it will take some time to get up and running, but I can already see the place completely done and I am getting really excited!!!
Thanks again to all who took the time to respond! icon_biggrin.gificon_biggrin.gificon_biggrin.gif

CWR41 Posted 18 Jan 2011 , 11:04pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by jschilt1

complimentary coffee


Sounds nice, but you might want to run the numbers for how much potential profit you're giving away that could be contributing towards paying the bills.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jschilt1

I wanted to set up a few tables in the front for people to sit and enjoy their deserts.


Check with your licensing requirements first... in many cases, if you provide seating/tables for eating desserts you might need to register as a restaurant instead of a bakery which could involve more fees and the additional of public handicap restrooms (if they don't already exist).

Quote:
Originally Posted by jschilt1

Just got off the phone with the insurance guy and he said somewhere between 500-700 per year in insurance. That number sound right?


Sounds high to me... don't know what company you called, but make sure you get a quote from State Farm to compare--I think they have the best rates.

cheatize Posted 18 Jan 2011 , 11:14pm

Continuing education costs.

scp1127 Posted 19 Jan 2011 , 9:03am

And now you illegal bakers can see why we get a little touchy when you say, "mind our own business", and "it isn't hurting anyone".

Evoir Posted 19 Jan 2011 , 10:51am

I recommend an insurance broker for buying business insurance. Premiums can vary wildly (sometimes by 100%).

Christy0722 Posted 19 Jan 2011 , 12:38pm

I agree with CWR41 ~ that quote sounds a little high to me too. I had heard State Farm has a policy geared towards small bakeries.

I appreciate all the comments as well!! It made me think of a few things too!!

Annabakescakes Posted 19 Jan 2011 , 3:15pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by CWR41

Quote:
Originally Posted by Annabakescakes

Quote:
Originally Posted by CWR41

Good question... the answers would be in your business plan.

Some one-time start-up costs to consider ................................................................................s... the potential list can go on and on!)



icon_eek.gificon_eek.gificon_eek.gificon_eek.gifthumbsdown.gif



What's up with the thumbs down? I took the time to answer the OP's question... I am I suppose to apologize because you don't appreciate it?




Hold up, slow down!!! You are imaginative to read so much into 1 little thumb down. It is not that I don't appreciate it! I do! The thumbs down is not because "you took the time to answer the OP's question" it was because it sucks that all that stuff costs money that I gotta come up with to actually buy all that stuff to have a business. Did you know that one of those weighted tape dispensers costs $30? I just spent $187 on a faucet, I have 2 estimates from plumbers
that are around $4000. The electric estimate was another $2,500. I have to have a door put in my garage door hole. I need a grease trap yet, and it looks like that is going to be about $500 plus shipping. The expense sucks!!! thumbsdown.gifthumbsdown.gifthumbsdown.gifthumbsdown.gifthumbsdown.gifthumbsdown.gif

Try not to take things so personally. thumbs_up.gif

thecakeprincess Posted 19 Jan 2011 , 3:55pm

great info everyone!

CWR41 Posted 19 Jan 2011 , 5:23pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Annabakescakes

Hold up, slow down!!! You are imaginative to read so much into 1 little thumb down. It is not that I don't appreciate it! I do! The thumbs down is not because "you took the time to answer the OP's question" it was because it sucks that all that stuff costs money that I gotta come up with to actually buy all that stuff to have a business. Did you know that one of those weighted tape dispensers costs $30? I just spent $187 on a faucet, I have 2 estimates from plumbers
that are around $4000. The electric estimate was another $2,500. I have to have a door put in my garage door hole. I need a grease trap yet, and it looks like that is going to be about $500 plus shipping. The expense sucks!!! thumbsdown.gifthumbsdown.gifthumbsdown.gifthumbsdown.gifthumbsdown.gifthumbsdown.gif

Try not to take things so personally. thumbs_up.gif




Thanks for explaining that your thumbs down was directed to the money you need to come up with rather than to my post. I wouldn't have figured that out... wish it was clear upfront--that's all. Like! thumbs_up.gif

BTW, weighted tape dispensers are available at dollar stores... you just need to glue the metal perforator piece on before it falls off and/or gets lost!

Annabakescakes Posted 19 Jan 2011 , 5:39pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by CWR41

Quote:
Originally Posted by Annabakescakes

Hold up, slow down!!! You are imaginative to read so much into 1 little thumb down. It is not that I don't appreciate it! I do! The thumbs down is not because "you took the time to answer the OP's question" it was because it sucks that all that stuff costs money that I gotta come up with to actually buy all that stuff to have a business. Did you know that one of those weighted tape dispensers costs $30? I just spent $187 on a faucet, I have 2 estimates from plumbers
that are around $4000. The electric estimate was another $2,500. I have to have a door put in my garage door hole. I need a grease trap yet, and it looks like that is going to be about $500 plus shipping. The expense sucks!!! thumbsdown.gifthumbsdown.gifthumbsdown.gifthumbsdown.gifthumbsdown.gifthumbsdown.gif

Try not to take things so personally. thumbs_up.gif



Thanks for explaining that your thumbs down was directed to the money you need to come up with rather than to my post. I wouldn't have figured that out... wish it was clear upfront--that's all. Like! thumbs_up.gif

BTW, weighted tape dispensers are available at dollar stores... you just need to glue the metal perforator piece on before it falls off and/or gets lost!




Ha! I have been doing most of my cost-finding on-line. I never get out of the house, I forgot about the Dollar Store. I need to print off your list and highlight what need and go to Big Lots thumbs_up.gif

Sorry I wasn't clear. Your post was very helpful. Some cash would be helpful too!

sugalips Posted 19 Jan 2011 , 5:57pm

)))(((((@@@&&^^%$$$$ OOPS, sorry. My brain just exploded from the overwhelming amount of time and resources you need to run a small business. Hats off to all of you who do this on a regular basis. thumbs_up.gif

indydebi Posted 19 Jan 2011 , 6:01pm

When you say "insurance", what are you including in that quote?

- commercial vehicle insurance (which is WAY higher than personal auto insurance!)
- Liability insurance
- Property insurance (covers your equipment)
- Loss of income insurance
- Tenants or building owners insurance

My annual insurance for all the coverages I needed was over $3500, so be sure the quote you have is for ALL of the insurance you need, not just a "piddly little" liability policy.

And dont' forget that dang mop bucket! (STILL pi$$es me off! icon_mad.gificon_lol.gif )

I believe Jason already covered part of this, but you mentioned putting your consultation area in the back of the shop. Check with your HD to see if this is possible. I had a friend who had a retail cupcake/popcorn shop , with seating in the front, and his public restroom was thru his kitchen. he actually had to build a half wall down the middle of his kitchen, creating a hallway, for customers to walk thru because the public is NOT PERMITTED to walk thru a commercial kitchen. If they are a nose-picking, butt-scratching type of person and touch one finger to your counters, then its now contaminated. its a sanitation/contamination issue.

CWR41 Posted 19 Jan 2011 , 6:07pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by jasonkraft

That's why I decided to rent an existing commercial kitchen instead of opening my own shop...when renting an existing kitchen 95% of the items CWR41 posted become someone else's problem.




Jason: (I mean this in the nicest way) If you look at it realistically, it's nowhere near 95%. Of the 250+/- items listed, I'm sure you don't carry in 10-13 items with you each day in order to operate.

Everyone would be in business for themselves if they were only responsible for a handful of items and had everything else provided to them as "included" in kitchen rental.

To everyone: It's extremely misleading to believe this is true.
(I can only assume that Jason is making his point of some benefits to leased kitchens by over-estimating the 95% of items not needed.)

jason_kraft Posted 19 Jan 2011 , 6:25pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by CWR41

Jason: (I mean this in the nicest way) If you look at it realistically, it's nowhere near 95%. Of the 250+/- items listed, I'm sure you don't carry in 10-13 items with you each day in order to operate.



I'd say 95% is accurate based on the list you provided. I took a quick look again, and these are the only items we need that aren't provided by the rental kitchen:

office exp: cake dummies & business license/corp fees
operating supplies: pans, pastry bags and tips, bowls, storage containers, aprons
product & materials: ingredients, packaging, foil/wrap, cake boards
reoccuring costs: business cards, rent, insurance

The items above are stored in cabinets we rent on-site at the kitchen. Of course we still need to pay for the remaining items on the list (through rent) but we don't have to worry about them ourselves, that's the landlord's job.

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