What is going on with my BC icing??? ... Help

Baking By Mikel79 Updated 4 Aug 2010 , 4:36pm by sugarshack

Kitagrl Posted 1 Jun 2010 , 8:21pm
post #31 of 117

Yeah but there were NO bubbles when I was done beating. Very smooth. Its like something is actually creating bubbles in there...????

Butter was room temp.... I did beat the shortenings together before adding milk...and everything looked perfect when I was done...iced the cake well...it wasn't til an hour later it had formed a whipped/bubbly like texture.

JohnnyCakes1966 Posted 1 Jun 2010 , 8:28pm
post #32 of 117

Does the frosting ON the cake get bubbles after it's been on a while or just what's left sitting in the bowl? Sounds crazy, but MAYBE the frosting is having some sort of chemical reaction with the bowl??? icon_confused.gif

Kitagrl Posted 1 Jun 2010 , 8:32pm
post #33 of 117
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnnyCakes1966

Does the frosting ON the cake get bubbles after it's been on a while or just what's left sitting in the bowl? Sounds crazy, but MAYBE the frosting is having some sort of chemical reaction with the bowl??? icon_confused.gif




Just a regular kitchenaid bowl.

No like if I ice a buttercream cake it doesn't get bubbly but under fondant I guess sometimes it gets a little bit that way but you can't tell unless for some reason you have to pull the fondant off.

Its just weird. It was nice and creamy, but after an hour or so it ended up looking like I used a whisk on it. Whatever. Its been doing this forever...I'm just fed up with it and wanna know how NOT to do this.

My noncrusting recipe has high shortening and evaporated milk content and low sugar content.... but my crusting recipe has the same kind of ingredients as everyone else's on here, although I may use a tad more milk than most of the recipes call for.

JohnnyCakes1966 Posted 1 Jun 2010 , 8:50pm
post #34 of 117

Next time you make a crusting BC, try putting it into a different bowl after it's mixed. (Maybe a glass bowl.) If it still develops bubbles, I have no clue why!!! icon_confused.gif
Oh...Does this happen to you with ANY crusting recipe, or just Sharon's method? (No offense Sharon....just trying to pinpoint things.)

Kitagrl Posted 1 Jun 2010 , 8:54pm
post #35 of 117
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnnyCakes1966

Next time you make a crusting BC, try putting it into a different bowl after it's mixed. (Maybe a glass bowl.) If it still develops bubbles, I have no clue why!!! icon_confused.gif
Oh...Does this happen to you with ANY crusting recipe, or just Sharon's method? (No offense Sharon....just trying to pinpoint things.)




Not sure, and I wasn't using Sharon's exact one because mine is similar...its all butter, shortening, milk, vanilla, and pwdr sugar... I do not measure the milk though...just throw some in...from making it so often....

The only thing I can guess is too much milk? Dunno.

JohnnyCakes1966 Posted 1 Jun 2010 , 9:17pm
post #36 of 117

Well, the thing with Sharon's buttercream is, it's more about the method than the ingredients. (And Sharon, please correct me if I'm wrong about that!!)

I read that you watched her tutorial without sound, but I would suggest watching it again with sound as she explains what to listen for (a sucking or kissing sound)....I can't explain it well, but she does on the tutorial.

Kitagrl Posted 1 Jun 2010 , 9:27pm
post #37 of 117

Yeah I thought it was the method....not the ingredients...

I guess as long as it gets onto the cake smooth its okay...unless this is one of the factors in all those fondant blowouts on the forum lately...

Anyway tomorrow I have to make another big batch. I'll take pictures of it after I make it, and then of the leftovers.

sugarshack Posted 1 Jun 2010 , 10:34pm
post #38 of 117

i agree that is more abut the technique than the ingredients, but with that being said, I have found i DO get air after sitting to some degree ( not horrible) with shortenings other than sweetex.

Kitagirl, please write down evrything you used, the amounts, and the process and we can try to figure it out.

and I am all for any process that works! We each find what works for us!

Kitagrl Posted 1 Jun 2010 , 10:35pm
post #39 of 117

I did use Sweetex....

Do you make your icing more to the soft side (more liquid) or the stiff side?

sugarshack Posted 1 Jun 2010 , 10:35pm
post #40 of 117

i make mine on stiff side, BUT if you go too stiff you will have air trouble.

Kitagrl Posted 1 Jun 2010 , 11:25pm
post #41 of 117
Quote:
Originally Posted by sugarshack

i make mine on stiff side, BUT if you go too stiff you will have air trouble.




It can't possibly be worse than I have haha.

BTW just took my cake out of the fridge to cover with fondant and lo and behold...air bubbles had formed.

Why me....*sigh*

You'd think after 10 years I'd be able to make a batch of buttercream?!

Mikel79 Posted 2 Jun 2010 , 10:22am
post #42 of 117

Kitagrl...

I am with you about wishing I can find out why in the he** does my icing form air in it when I leave it out. The only thing I thought it might be is the brand of my Hi-Ratio....TBK. However, several on this topic say they use Sweetex and have the same issue??????

It is very frustrating when I want to go ice my second cake with the same frosting and now it has air all in it.....


Just venting....again.....=)

Kitagrl Posted 2 Jun 2010 , 5:36pm
post #43 of 117

Okay....

Made a big batch of buttercream in my 6qt today.

2 pounds of salted butter (2 boxes/4 cups), 4 cups of Sweetex....blended those. My main problem is my Sweetex is stored near an a/c vent and is a bit too cold and I've been having problems with occasionally finding tiny bits of unblended sweetex in my icing. But that is a side note.

Anyway blended that awhile then added a bunch of pure vanilla, and a cup and a half of 2% milk.

Let that blend awhile...then gradually added 4 bags (8 lbs) of powdered sugar.

I let blend until it looked smooth on top, with just a few smooth ripples. Took photos but won't load them yet....

As a test, I carefully dipped some into a bowl and set aside to see if it would have bubbles in it. The rest I used to ice a large sheet cake.

After over two hours, NO bubbles in the test bowl!! Huh??? A few bubbles in my iced cake and some bubbles in the icing that is left.

SO my only conclusion is that any kind of disturbing of the icing will allow it to form bubbles...whereas the "test bowl" was simply dipped out and left to set aside (covered)....but the icing that is actively being used to ice a cake, esp in the process of scraping off the spatula and reusing AND exposed to air and beginning the crusting process eventually, rather than covered, will form air bubbles. I notice when I throw all my leftover icing in a bowl, the consistency does get absolutely full of air bubbles.

Also I will say I have NOT made icing this exact way before...yesterday I did throw in leftover icing, this time I made the entire (huge) bowl fresh. I also think I could probably stand to reduce the milk a tiny bit although the consistency was nice and soft but still okay for making roses and borders.

You know what, I wish KitchenAid would come up with some beaters that were smaller for the larger bowls...for instance, I know have plenty of leftover icing to ice a second cake with today, but it is not enough to cover the beater. If KitchenAid made a beater with a longer shank and then a smaller paddle part, then I could just mix up a half a bowl of icing. Oh well I guess KitchenAid isn't there to invent new icing tools for bakers. haha.

Weird...but hey at least I'm getting a smooth icing to start out with anyway....that's better than I was doing as of last week with this recipe.

Mikel79 Posted 12 Jun 2010 , 12:28pm
post #44 of 117

Hi folks!

I hope Sharon and Kitagrl are still following this post.....???

My question is about freezing icing. When I have a cake that is due, I like to do as much as possible ahead of time. This includes Sharons Z. icing. I will make it about 2 weeks ahead and then keep in freezer. I will take out night before to defrost. Place icing back in KA mixer and mix for about 7 minutes. It becomes smooth as butter again, no bubbles.

Do you think freezing the icing can cause issue??

Ktagrl....

I 100% agree with you about disturbing the icing will cause air bubbles. I hate the fact that I will make a batch of icing...HUGE batch....and only can ice 1 cake with it????!!!

Thanks

Michael

Kitagrl Posted 12 Jun 2010 , 12:54pm
post #45 of 117

I don't think freezing the icing is bad....

sugarshack Posted 12 Jun 2010 , 7:11pm
post #46 of 117

freezing is not an issue.

I am not sure what you guys mean by disturbing the icing but here is what i do:

make 2 of my batches and transfer them to a big rubbermaid. cover the surface with plastic and put top on. I might make it 2-3 days before doing cake. leave at room temp. when it is time to ice the cake, i open the rubbermaid and ice straight from there. it is still smooth and perfect as the day i made it. When i ice the cake, the excess i scrape off while smoothing, etc goes into another bowl, not back into the rubbermaid. The scraped off icing will be kinda crusty and airy. I save that for borders and filling OR if i save enough partial batches of that stuff, i can fill the mixer again, and remix till it is smooth again.

sugarshack Posted 12 Jun 2010 , 7:15pm
post #47 of 117
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikel79


I 100% agree with you about disturbing the icing will cause air bubbles. I hate the fact that I will make a batch of icing...HUGE batch....and only can ice 1 cake with it????!!!

Thanks

Michael




Not sure what you mean? If i only use half the icing in the big rubbermaid i discussed above, i cover the rest of the icing with plastic again, put the top on.... and when i go back to use that remaining icing later it is still perfectly airless and smooth..... i can get as many cakes out of that big double batch as I need till it is all used up. no air.

Mikel79 Posted 12 Jun 2010 , 8:09pm
post #48 of 117

Hi Sharon!

When I go to ice my cake, take the spatula and take a little from the KA bowl and then apply to cake, go back to KA bowl and ice cake, etc. This is what I mean by disturbing the icing. I hope that makes more sense.

The left over icing as I go down to the bottom of the KA bowl is now disturbed with a bunch of scrape marks from my small spatula. It has started crusting as well, with air bubbles.

To make sure I understand your response.....You take your completed BC from your KA mixing bowl and then transfer in a big Rubbermaid bowl? You have no air when you go and ice your cakes in 2-3 days?? WOW! I have tried that before, but my icing developed so much air, I had to place it back in the KA bowl to mix.

Do you make your icing just a few days ahead of your cake due date? I usually make mine 2 weeks and then freeze?

Maybe I need to wait a little longer and make icing the day before and buy a different Tupperware container....

Sorry for the loooooong rant....Thinking out loud =)

sugarshack Posted 12 Jun 2010 , 8:19pm
post #49 of 117

Hi Sharon!

When I go to ice my cake, take the spatula and take a little from the KA bowl and then apply to cake, go back to KA bowl and ice cake, etc. This is what I mean by disturbing the icing. I hope that makes more sense.

ok, got it.


The left over icing as I go down to the bottom of the KA bowl is now disturbed with a bunch of scrape marks from my small spatula. It has started crusting as well, with air bubbles.

does not happen to me at all.


To make sure I understand your response.....You take your completed BC from your KA mixing bowl and then transfer in a big Rubbermaid bowl? You have no air when you go and ice your cakes in 2-3 days?? WOW! I have tried that before, but my icing developed so much air, I had to place it back in the KA bowl to mix.

correct, no air at all. even if i freeze it in the rubbermaid, I can thaw it and ice right from the rubbermaid... still no air.



Maybe I need to wait a little longer and make icing the day before and buy a different Tupperware container....

Sorry for the loooooong rant....Thinking out loud =)

I am stumped at this point. if you are using the exact ingredients and process that i do, I am not sure why that is happening.

Mikel79 Posted 12 Jun 2010 , 8:22pm
post #50 of 117

Thanks Sharon!

I think I am going to bite the bullet and try the Sweetex brand and see what happens then.

I just hate that I can only find Sweetex in that large box. That is why I have been using TBK, cause I can buy it in the small 4 pounds tubs.

Thanks again though Sharon you are the best!!

=)
Michael

AnnieCahill Posted 15 Jun 2010 , 10:52am
post #51 of 117

I had the same problem with a cake I did a few days ago. I only have the 4.5 quart mixer so I had to use the recipe for that size. The buttercream was beautiful when it was finished mixing. Positively smooth with NO bubbles. I transferred it into two Tupperware containers and the next day when I opened the containers it looked like a sponge! Seriously! I was able to put it back in the mixer and add more creamer liquid until it was smooth, but it's so strange that happened.

I did use Sweetex so I'm not sure what happened. However, I LOVE this buttercream and I don't care if I have to re-whip-it is so good!

Mikel79 Posted 15 Jun 2010 , 6:39pm
post #52 of 117

Hi Annie....


Thanks for the input! I am finding that folks that use Sweetex are having the same issues. I am hesitant to buy Sweetex if this problem is happening with that brand as well????


=)

Price Posted 15 Jun 2010 , 7:24pm
post #53 of 117

I'm just catching up to this thread. I am a HUGH Sugarshack fan! I use her icing recipe and techinque and I too have had some problems with bubbles forming in the icing after it sits. I usually just add a little more warm creamer and mix by hand to help get rid of the bubbles.

I needed to make alot of icing for a wedding cake I did for my nephew's wedding in May. I made all of the icing I was going to need ahead of time and froze most of it. I'm not sure if the freezing did something to change the consistency or not, but the icing that I froze was nice and smooth.

Kitagirl -- I live about 30 miles north of Baltimore. I'm grasping for straws here, but do you think it's possible where we live has something to do with the difference? Maybe difference in humidity, altitude, or something like that?

Kitagrl Posted 15 Jun 2010 , 7:56pm
post #54 of 117

Hmm I dunno! Well there is more oxygen at sea level....where we are...but then others don't have problems at roughly sea level either.

Its humid but not nearly so badly as down south...

VNatividad Posted 15 Jun 2010 , 8:27pm
post #55 of 117

Holy Crap...how did I miss this thread...I have the same problem. I use hi-ratio but Alpine. My ingredients are to accomodate a 4.5 qrt ka. 4.5 cups of shortening, 18 cups of CH ps. 2 tbs of creme bouquet and 9 - 11 tbs of coffemate liquid.

I start out with perfect, smooth icing, the first time I transferred it into a food safe bucket. Opened it a couple days later to use and it had tons airbubbles. The second time I left it in the KA bowl. Used about half and when I went to transfer the rest into a container it had tons of bubbles again!

Do you think it's the powered sugar? I looked at the ingredients and it has cornstarch but so does 10x dominos brand! Maybe the liquid is too hot? The very first time I achieved moderate success and I don't think my liquid was as hot as I'm using now. Maybe the heat is causing some kind of reaction? I feel sad!

VNatividad Posted 15 Jun 2010 , 8:31pm
post #56 of 117

Me again, I just wanted to point out that I use Alpine hi-ratio and have the same problem.

Kitagrl Posted 15 Jun 2010 , 8:32pm
post #57 of 117

I don't think its the heat or the sugar....my bc came out alot better this last time when I made sure it more than adequately covered the beater with no icing pulling off the sides of the bowl...everything covered, beat until smooth. It was much improved.

sugarshack Posted 15 Jun 2010 , 8:44pm
post #58 of 117

OK, I am not trying to make you guys feel bad but here is a batch that was made several days ahead, transferred to tupperware and covered.... and this is what it looked like days later when I went to use it:

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_pl0c6tYw-Qc/SSOwgCMdS4I/AAAAAAAAAdU/EflSPwicLok/s1600-h/oz23.jpg

I spoke to my Wendy, who uses the 6 quart in her shop and she seems to be having a problem if she transfers it out the mixer bowl. if she leaves it in the bowl, it stays perfect. She uses exact same recipe and ingredients as me. And when she was working from home, before she opened her shop, she did not have this problem. This is so odd!!!

Kitagrl Posted 15 Jun 2010 , 8:47pm
post #59 of 117

I have a 6 qt too...my last batch came out pretty good and stayed pretty good so I'm feeling better about it. Although I still have to watch out for it crusting if I have it out for awhile.

I know I tried to make a batch of this icing one time in a 20 qt mixer at a caterers once and it turned out horribly...maybe the bigger the batch, the harder it is to have it turn out right?

Mikel79 Posted 15 Jun 2010 , 8:50pm
post #60 of 117

Sharon....

I noticed that you have plastic film over your contanier. Do you place a piece of film over the top and then place the lid on top of the contatiner with the plastic film???

I am just trying to see all the little things......probably nothing. But maybe something as little as this helps out this issue????

Michael
=)

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