Glycerine In Royal Icing?

Baking By Zamode Updated 20 Sep 2013 , 12:13am by 105sruss

lindseyjhills Posted 19 Sep 2013 , 12:13am
post #31 of 59

A

Original message sent by kikiandkyle

I think they gave up enough for tradition, I'm sure Kate didn't really want to have all the stuff that was on there but she did. I doubt it was all fruit cake either.

What can I say? I'm a saddo and like tradition :)

JWinslow Posted 19 Sep 2013 , 12:22am
post #32 of 59

Quote:

Originally Posted by 105sruss 
 

You see what a techno idiot I am I hadn't even realized I was talking to a different person. I used to know Westcliffe really well but haven't been there for about 30  years. I lived in Es*** for 23 years. I hope that Jeanne is still on line, I'll bet she's having a real chuckle at me lol.

I'm here!

I am in the US.  I live in a town (Erie)  that is right on the Great Lakes.  No decorating shops here, just a couple of hobby stores where I can get some things in a pinch.  I either make it or have it shipped in.

 

I'm enjoying our exchange - learning much more than you realize. 

 

Jeanne

105sruss Posted 19 Sep 2013 , 1:00am
post #33 of 59

I agree Lindseyj. I also use sugar paste where required as I said kid's cakes for instance, as for the Brit lady taking offence, we are all entitled to our likes and dislikes and opinions. The large sugar roses on this wedding cake are made from sugar paste by me and I am also horrified looking at that close up I can't believe it. Yes Royal Icing was invented for the Royals and protocol demands that you give the best to dignitaries. Whatever anyone's likes or dislikes are you should only use the very best which of course is Royal Icing not sugar paste, it cannot compare with Royal Icing for taste and finish, hence the reason the very wealthy and stores like Harrods and Fortnums seldom have anything else. Nice to see that Jeanne is still with us. I keep popping off to do a bit more and coming back. Nice to see there are some more Brit night Owls besides me though.

105sruss Posted 19 Sep 2013 , 1:08am
post #34 of 59

Just to add to the bit about what Kate wanted, she was given a free hand in choosing her wedding cake and they were both free to invite whoever they wanted. If you read further back you will see that I haven't knocked sugar paste decorations.

kikiandkyle Posted 19 Sep 2013 , 1:21am
post #35 of 59

A

Original message sent by 105sruss

Hi, To me sugar paste/fondant icing is a poor substitute for wedding cakes and became popular because lazy bakers found it quicker and easier to do.

Just the bakers that use it I guess.

105sruss Posted 19 Sep 2013 , 1:31am
post #36 of 59

Hi Jeanne,

Victoria sponge was invented for the well known lady who was never amused. It is made using 6,6,6 & 3. 6oz margarine or butter. 6oz castor sugar, 6oz of Self Raising flour, 3 medium sized eggs plus a pinch of salt. Cream together the butter and sugar until light and fluffy, add the eggs one at a time with a tablespoon of the sieved flour and salt, beating well between each one. Fold in the rest of the flour and divide evenly between two 8 inch sponge pans. Cook in a preheated oven to 375F, 190C, gas mark 5, or for fan ovens 350F, 180C, gas mark 4, for 20 minutes or until golden and well reason. It shouldn't dent when lightly touched. Leave to cool for 5-10 minutes then turn out on to a wire rack. When cold fill with Raspberry Jam and butter cream or fresh cream and lightly dust the top with either castor or icing sugar. If you want to be really posh and Queen Vic you could place a paper Doily on the top and sieve the icing sugar lightly over it and hey presto when you remove the doily you have a work of art. Of course the top on this one is plain because it has got the marzipan and Royal Icing on it.

105sruss Posted 19 Sep 2013 , 1:43am
post #37 of 59

No the baker's shops that started using it because it was  quicker, easier and required little skill and training to cover a cake with it. As I said earlier, it is done in one hit but you never get the finish that you get with Royal Icing or the taste. Bakers no longer have to pay for apprenticeships, get more cakes done in a lot less time, still charging what they would have for Royal Icing and making a mint. They only need 1 or 2 skilled workers to make the decorations and they can be done well in advance. It is so much easier to make things like frills with sugar paste using the tools that you now have for it. Try making one with Royal Icing and nozzles and you'll see what I mean.

kikiandkyle Posted 19 Sep 2013 , 1:52am
post #38 of 59

AWhile there may be a fondant flower in my avatar photo, that doesn't mean I'm too lazy to know how to do string work and other royal icing techniques.

I can only assume that you've never worked with or tried to make fondant, given that you think it's such an easy skill. We don't all just get it from a box and it doesn't all taste bad.

JWinslow Posted 19 Sep 2013 , 2:23am
post #39 of 59

Quote:

Originally Posted by 105sruss 
 

Hi Jeanne,

Victoria sponge was invented for the well known lady who was never amused. It is made using 6,6,6 & 3. 6oz margarine or butter. 6oz castor sugar, 6oz of Self Raising flour, 3 medium sized eggs plus a pinch of salt. Cream together the butter and sugar until light and fluffy, add the eggs one at a time with a tablespoon of the sieved flour and salt, beating well between each one. Fold in the rest of the flour and divide evenly between two 8 inch sponge pans. Cook in a preheated oven to 375F, 190C, gas mark 5, or for fan ovens 350F, 180C, gas mark 4, for 20 minutes or until golden and well reason. It shouldn't dent when lightly touched. Leave to cool for 5-10 minutes then turn out on to a wire rack. When cold fill with Raspberry Jam and butter cream or fresh cream and lightly dust the top with either castor or icing sugar. If you want to be really posh and Queen Vic you could place a paper Doily on the top and sieve the icing sugar lightly over it and hey presto when you remove the doily you have a work of art. Of course the top on this one is plain because it has got the marzipan and Royal Icing on it.

 

Thanks!  i copied into my files.  How's the cake coming?

JWinslow Posted 19 Sep 2013 , 2:34am
post #40 of 59

Sandra,

 

I'm curious.  I read an article that it is illegal to sell chilled/washed eggs in the UK as it removes the protective coating.  It also stated they can be found near baking isles.  Just wondering if the article was correct.

 

On the subject of the Royal wedding cake done in fondant.  Although the decorations are very pretty the actual execution of the sugar paste is anything but.  There is bulging, sides are not straight and the edges are very round.  IMO, not well done.  I hope I don't cause an international incident - lol

 

Jeanne

105sruss Posted 19 Sep 2013 , 2:57am
post #41 of 59

I don't know why you are getting so nasty we are all entitled to our own opinions. I suggest that you read all of my replies and you will see that I used to make it and have done extensive work over the years using both, but never to cover my fruit cakes. I'm 71 now and mainly make for family and friends but I still say that Royal Icing is a far more difficult art than fondant. I take it by your answers that you own a baker's shop and the title says it all " Cheap cakes make cheap customers". I would think that you are fairly young and have only been in the trade yourself since it became "The Fashion" to have fondant. Therefore you have never gone through the years of training and apprenticeships that master baker's like Percy Ingle used to. I don't even know if they exist anymore but you get the gyst. Today's baker's shops don't do any of that.

kikiandkyle Posted 19 Sep 2013 , 3:07am
post #42 of 59

AI'm not the one calling people lazy! Before you start calling other people nasty try reading what you write yourself!

Take what you want from my answers (you're wrong by the way on just about all of your assumptions). Just stop attacking other people's skills.

105sruss Posted 19 Sep 2013 , 3:08am
post #43 of 59

Yes it's true and they are found by the baking isles. I don't think you'll cause a major upset over the Royal cake, just look at mine and Lindseyj's answers. It's the first time I've seen it in close up and I'm still in shock. Fiona what's her name is making a mint after having done this and it's a disgrace. I know that it wasn't all done by her, she employed minions to help but she did oversee it all. Strangely enough my Grandson's Fiancee would make a great lookalike for Kate, she's the image of her. Did you catch the Vitoria Sponge?

Sandra

105sruss Posted 19 Sep 2013 , 3:11am
post #44 of 59

As I said, read the rest of my replies, I haven't attacked anyone's skills. You need to stop being so paranoid.

105sruss Posted 19 Sep 2013 , 3:16am
post #45 of 59

Hey Jeanne, I don't know about you starting a war I think I've started world war 3, I'm being taken right out of context here. Never mind I can take it.

JWinslow Posted 19 Sep 2013 , 3:37am
post #46 of 59

Quote:

Originally Posted by 105sruss 
 

Yes it's true and they are found by the baking isles. I don't think you'll cause a major upset over the Royal cake, just look at mine and Lindseyj's answers. It's the first time I've seen it in close up and I'm still in shock. Fiona what's her name is making a mint after having done this and it's a disgrace. I know that it wasn't all done by her, she employed minions to help but she did oversee it all. Strangely enough my Grandson's Fiancee would make a great lookalike for Kate, she's the image of her. Did you catch the Vitoria Sponge?

Sandra

Yes, and Thank you!  I copied the recipe and instructions into a file.  I will be giving it a go in the near future.  My Mother-in-Law loves sponge cake and I will surprise her with it.  She is the recipients of many of my experiments.  I love the fact she is very honest with me about the results. 

 

Jeanne

105sruss Posted 19 Sep 2013 , 4:03am
post #47 of 59

Don't forget to go the whole hog with thin sliced cucumber sandwiches cut into 4 triangles and crusts removed, not forgetting the pot of tea for two and of course a doily placed on the plate and the cake on top of it. Oh and pastry forks and china tea cups with saucers lol. Mum really would think that you'd lost the plot. Still it would be a good laugh, you going all Victorian I'd love to see your Mum's face.

JWinslow Posted 19 Sep 2013 , 4:12am
post #48 of 59

Quote:

Originally Posted by 105sruss 
 

Don't forget to go the whole hog with thin sliced cucumber sandwiches cut into 4 triangles and crusts removed, not forgetting the pot of tea for two and of course a doily placed on the plate and the cake on top of it. Oh and pastry forks and china tea cups with saucers lol. Mum really would think that you'd lost the plot. Still it would be a good laugh, you going all Victorian I'd love to see your Mum's face.

What a great idea!  As Earl Grey tea is her favorite this will all come together nicely.  We try do have a day together at least once a month.  No husbands or friends.  Just two old ladies having a good time.

 

Jeanne

105sruss Posted 19 Sep 2013 , 4:58am
post #49 of 59

Good on you girl, go for it.

cazza1 Posted 19 Sep 2013 , 5:35am
post #50 of 59

Whilst some people will see the rounded edges on the fondant wedding cake as poor execution this is not necessarily so.  When I first learnt to decorate 23(?) years ago rounded edges were extremely common in Australia.  Sharp edges were also done but many people like the look of the rounded ones.

105sruss Posted 19 Sep 2013 , 5:52am
post #51 of 59

With me it's not so much the round edges but the lumps and bumps. Like Lindseyj I'm still in shock that it's sugar paste and not Royal Icing.

JWinslow Posted 19 Sep 2013 , 7:06am
post #52 of 59

Quote:

Originally Posted by cazza1 
 

Whilst some people will see the rounded edges on the fondant wedding cake as poor execution this is not necessarily so.  When I first learnt to decorate 23(?) years ago rounded edges were extremely common in Australia.  Sharp edges were also done but many people like the look of the rounded ones.

 

You're right, of course.  I really am looking at it from my limited experience - Rounded edges certainly have their place in a design.  As you can tell from my cakes, I practice sharp edges. 

JWinslow Posted 19 Sep 2013 , 7:11am
post #53 of 59

Good Grief - it after 3 AM - Time for sleep.  Good night/morning :)

kikiandkyle Posted 19 Sep 2013 , 2:23pm
post #54 of 59

AClearly you don't think your words were insulting so I'm wasting my time here. You can justify it as being taken out of context all you want.

You are certainly entitled to your opinion, but when it involves insulting another person's craft the polite thing to do is keep it to yourself.

105sruss Posted 19 Sep 2013 , 6:03pm
post #55 of 59

You clearly have a problem with paranoia. I repeat I haven't insulted anyone's skills and don't you think it odd that no-one else feels insulted. You have taken everything out of context. You are one of the newer businesses that has never gone through the skills and apprenticeships that the old bakers used to go through. Therefore you haven't worked with Royal Icing in that way. I'm not going back over old ground again but I will repeat that you haven't read all of my posts because if you had you wouldn't be up in arms like you are. The only insults are coming from your end. Take a look at Lindseyj's fondant iced cakes, especially the out of the ordinary ones, they are brilliant but like me she uses it on ordinary cakes such as sponges, kids birthday cakes etc. and reserves Royal Icing for the rich fruit cakes. When you have done the things that you do with sugar paste using all the tools available in Royal Icing where you have just tubes, nails and nozzles to use, and when you've flat iced a cake with Royal Icing, come back and tell me then that it isn't more difficult and doesn't take more skill. Until then try seeing both sides of the discussion.

105sruss Posted 19 Sep 2013 , 10:22pm
post #56 of 59

Hey Jeanne don't forget to let me know how your high tea with Mum goes, can't wait to hear. I beat you I was up until 6am because it's so peaceful decorating overnight. You can concentrate far easier without the male half of the relationship barging in and out willy nilly, asking for things that he can't be bothered to look for, even though he's put them there. One day, I swear, that big bowl of icing will go over his head, hmmm that's a thought, another use for Royal Icing lol.

Love speaking to you Jeanne

Sandra

BrandisBaked Posted 19 Sep 2013 , 10:47pm
post #57 of 59

AI understood what you meant and wasn't insulted. I can see why it may have been taken that way though.

JWinslow Posted 19 Sep 2013 , 11:43pm
post #58 of 59

Quote:

Originally Posted by 105sruss 
 

Hey Jeanne don't forget to let me know how your high tea with Mum goes, can't wait to hear. I beat you I was up until 6am because it's so peaceful decorating overnight. You can concentrate far easier without the male half of the relationship barging in and out willy nilly, asking for things that he can't be bothered to look for, even though he's put them there. One day, I swear, that big bowl of icing will go over his head, hmmm that's a thought, another use for Royal Icing lol.

Love speaking to you Jeanne

Sandra

 

Sandra,

I certainly will!  I may not get to do this until Oct, but I have your recipe, and know how to contact you :)  I spoke to my husband last night (he's away on business) and told him the plan.  He is as excited as I am and said she's going to love it.  A question about the cucumber sandwiches - Do the sandwiches have anything else on the bread?  I want to do this proper.

 

I am very much a night owl, especially when trying to do detailed decorations for the same reasons as you.  I have said to my husband on many occasions "You've lived here just as long as me - are you sure you can't find it?"   it's a polite code for - Get it yourself!  If you have that feeling of using the icing as an exclamation point, be sure it's your leftovers - LOL

I've had too many 3am nights this past week- I over slept this morning.  I suspect you are going to have many sleepless nights until your Grandson's wedding.

 

So enjoying our conversations!

 

Jeanne

 

Jeanne

105sruss Posted 20 Sep 2013 , 12:13am
post #59 of 59

Hi,

Thank you. I suppose it works the same with most anything once you say "It's the fashion" people instantly must have it and miss the fact that it's a time saving, money saving, money making ploy that at some time in our lives we all fall for. I can remember paying the same price for, what could only be described as a belt, as I had previously paid for a ballerina length dress. Same thing different article. Those wily old, and yes lazy bakers in their rush to cover cakes in one hit and mould instead of pipe have very nearly killed off the art of Royal Icing and unfortunately leave it to the well off amongst us who buy from the big West End of London Stores, like Fortnums or from the big hotels. There are still a few old fashioned bakers around but they are very hard to find. It's such a shame to see the old arts die and at the end of the day, although more time consuming, there is no decorating done that can't be done in Royal Icing but the same doesn't apply vice versa as you couldn't do the really delicate stuff in paste. Just as a foot note I'm exactly the same with other crafts like knitting and crochet, which, thank God, seem to be coming back and broomstick and hairpin lace. I make things from patterns dating back to 1837 and do talks on them. America is great for keeping arts and crafts alive and most of our old books seem to have emigrated to there, Still it's been an interesting thread with some nice people and a few shocks (the Royal cake) but there really was never any intention to insult anyone.

Until the next big debate

Best wishes to all and hope to speak to you again soon

Sandra

Quote by @%username% on %date%

%body%