Alicia0620 Posted 7 Dec 2009 , 5:06pm
post #1 of

Just wondering if anyone has used ganche to cover a cake, and then cover with fondant? 1. Does that work well 2. Do you use buttercream under the ganache 3. Does the ganache harden or stiffen or does it continue to stay gooey??

I have a request for a chocolate cake with chocolate under the fondant, so this is why I was wondering. Thanks for all your help in advance!

68 replies
bashini Posted 7 Dec 2009 , 5:25pm
post #2 of

Hi there, I have used it few times. The ratio is 1:2 cream to chocolate. And it has to be good quality chocolate. It shoudl have more than 50% cocoa solid.

I mix ganache with my normal buttercream and use that as the filling. You also can use whipped ganache as the filling. Then I use ganache to cover the whole cake and smooth it out. Let it set. And then cover it with fondant. It goes hard but not too hard. you still can cut into the cake nicely!

Or the other option is to cover the cake with chocolate paste, like chocopan. that is quite yummy too!

HTH.

Alicia0620 Posted 7 Dec 2009 , 7:01pm
post #3 of

Ok, thanks. I'll give it a shot and see how it works for me.

niccicola Posted 7 Dec 2009 , 7:46pm
post #4 of

I use 3 parts choco to 1 part cream for making a shell on the cake prior to covering with fondant

2 parts choco to 1 part cream for filling anbd icing (to replace buttercream, not intending to cover with fondant)

1 part choco to 1 part cream for dipping, cake balls, pouring/dripping on cakes

2 parts cream to 1 part choco if I plan on whipping it to make it fluffy for spreading

Rylan Posted 8 Dec 2009 , 1:10am
post #5 of

I only use ganache now under fondant. I don't put buttercream under ganache, only use ganache.

I put up a tutorial on my signature. Costumeczar also made a nice tutorial.

AngelFood4 Posted 13 Dec 2009 , 8:31am
post #6 of

For the 1st time today, I covered a cake with ganache. I love how easily it smoothed! But, I'm not sure of what to do before covering it with fondant. The ganache turned into a hard, smooth shell over the cake. Do I need to spread something over it to help the fondant stick?

Rylan Posted 13 Dec 2009 , 9:10am
post #7 of

What was your ratio? Did you refrigerate it?

In my experience, after it comes to room temperature, it will be softer.

cblupe Posted 13 Dec 2009 , 9:37am
post #8 of
Quote:
Originally Posted by niccicola

I use 3 parts choco to 1 part cream for making a shell on the cake prior to covering with fondant

2 parts choco to 1 part cream for filling anbd icing (to replace buttercream, not intending to cover with fondant)

1 part choco to 1 part cream for dipping, cake balls, pouring/dripping on cakes

2 parts cream to 1 part choco if I plan on whipping it to make it fluffy for spreading




Thanks for this helpful information!

AngelFood4 Posted 13 Dec 2009 , 9:43am
post #9 of

Hi Rylan (I love your Thanksgiving cake!)

I think 3 to 1...I started 2 to 1 which I made last night but this morning, it was still liquidy (not the thick, peanut butter consistency I read about, it was more like a thick heavy cream) so I added another part of Chocolate. I used a mixture of mostly Geradeli Bitter Sweet and a little of the semi-sweet. The original recipe called for 9oz choc to 1 cup cream which I ended up tripling. I covered the cake around noon and let it sit out on the counter and when I checked it tonight, it had a smooth hard shell. It gives a little but it's not tacky at all, just really smooth.

I just read a post of yours where you mentioned using shortening over it and I have also read some people put a thin layer of jam while others don't use anything. I'm thinking of trying the shortening tomorrow morning since the ganache and mmf is already sweet enough...any other suggestions?

I attached a picture of it. The shiny parts are from where I used my finger to fill in some tiny air holes left from the upside down method.
LL

Melnick Posted 13 Dec 2009 , 9:54am

AngelFood4, just brush it over with a fine layer of water (I use a pastry brush) to make the fondant stick to it. You can also use a jam syrup I believe. I hadn't heard of using shortening but I think I'd opt for water still before I used shortening. When you use a 3 to 1 ratio, the chocolate will be much firmer. 3 to 1 is usually for white chocolate and 2 to1 for dark/milk chocolate (according to Planet Cake recipes).

bashini Posted 13 Dec 2009 , 10:46am

AngelFood4, your cake looks fab! I use clear alcohol to brush on the ganache and then cover the cake with fondant. Some use sugarsyrup too! icon_biggrin.gif

Kims_cakes Posted 13 Dec 2009 , 11:36am

I just used ganache for the first time on Friday, and LOVED it! So much easier than buttercream. I didn't put anything on top of the ganache, and had no problems with the mmf sticking.

Rylan Posted 13 Dec 2009 , 3:24pm

AngelFood4, your ganached covered cake looks perfect! I'm sure it will turn out great! Not sure why your 2:1 ratio didn't settle but 3:1 for bittersweet and semi-sweet will be really firm.

My ganache recipe for dark and semi-sweet is a 2:1 ratio. It also does settle with a firm shell since I refrigerate it (but it will come back soft and tacky-ish once it has come to room temp).

I personally like to use shortening to adhere the fondant to the ganache when covering it (just rub it all over). If you make a mistake while putting the fondant, it comes off easily. I've use jams, syrups, honey, cornsyrup, water, etc but I still prefer shortening.

AngelFood4 Posted 14 Dec 2009 , 3:53pm

Thank you all for your suggestions. I ended up brushing it with a little bit of water and it worked perfectly. I have to say, I definitely will be using ganache more and try out the recipe (2:1) again and see if it'll work out better. The fondant lays so nicely and I got those nice sharp edges (see Ferrari cake). I love ganache!!! Thanks again icon_biggrin.gif

http://www.cakecentral.com/modules.php?name=gallery&file=displayimage&pid=1537867

JustToEatCake Posted 14 Dec 2009 , 4:24pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by AngelFood4

Thank you all for your suggestions. I ended up brushing it with a little bit of water and it worked perfectly. I have to say, I definitely will be using ganache more and try out the recipe (2:1) again and see if it'll work out better. The fondant lays so nicely and I got those nice sharp edges (see Ferrari cake). I love ganache!!! Thanks again icon_biggrin.gif

http://www.cakecentral.com/modules.php?name=gallery&file=displayimage&pid=1537867



Angelfood I had the exact same question the first time I made ganache (recently) the next morning it just still seemed too soft, I even posted about it. Everyone said just wait "it'll be fine" and lo and behold it actually ended up being pretty thick after 24 hours. So I think your 2 to 1 ratio should work next time.

I used
1 large bag Milk Chocolate chips(I think it's 25 oz)
1 Regular Bag semi sweets (10.4 oz)
14 ounces heavy cream

I used a tiny bit less cream than half because the powers that be said milk chocolate takes less cream and it ended perfect. I've made it twice now.

Bluehue Posted 14 Dec 2009 , 4:46pm

You can also use a spray bottle with cold water - turn the nozzle to *mist spray* - then hplding the spray bottle about 6 inches away from the cake give a few fine sprays.
This will be sufficient to then cover your cake with fondant/or what ever type of medium you use.


Bluehue

bashini Posted 14 Dec 2009 , 5:15pm

Its fantstic!!!! Well Done! icon_biggrin.gif

VNatividad Posted 14 Dec 2009 , 8:23pm

Your cake is so great! Great work!

BlackFlour Posted 15 Dec 2009 , 2:33pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by cblupe

Quote:
Originally Posted by niccicola

I use 3 parts choco to 1 part cream for making a shell on the cake prior to covering with fondant

2 parts choco to 1 part cream for filling anbd icing (to replace buttercream, not intending to cover with fondant)

1 part choco to 1 part cream for dipping, cake balls, pouring/dripping on cakes

2 parts cream to 1 part choco if I plan on whipping it to make it fluffy for spreading



Thanks for this helpful information!




Ditto!!! thumbs_up.gif

Peridot Posted 15 Dec 2009 , 3:16pm

Rylan or anyone....

When using ganache as a filling (I use SugarShacks's recipe) I whip some of it and put it between the layers. Do I need a dam of BC? I hope not as I did not like the look the only time that I used whipped ganache as a filling.

As I read these posts I see that you can use BC and mix that with the ganache for the filling. Does that make it lighter and more fluffy? Do you need a dam if you do that?

The only time that I did this I covered my cake with the rest of the ganache which I whipped and then found out that I was not supposed to!!! It turned out ok but I was wondering why it wasn't a nice dark chocolate.

Before I applied my fondant I used simple syrup on the set up ganache but I am going to try the shortening that Rylan suggested as I might have to lift off the fondant if I can't get it placed correctly the first time. I am going to try marbelizing my fondant.

Rylan....I get the feeling that you use ganache on most or all of your creations. What do you usually use as the filling? Would you have to use a dam if you used fililng that were more loose and runny? I just hate the look of the dam as you have the color of the filling and then you have the dam and then you have the ganache shell and then the fondant or do you think that the look is acceptable?

Rylan Posted 15 Dec 2009 , 3:44pm

Good Morning Barb,

Since I started using ganache, I've never use a dam. I usually use custards, capuccino, fudge and some other fillings. I've never tried mixing ganache and buttercream together, sounds interesting though.

Yes, I only use ganache now because I find that it really really helps give me sharp edges and avoid buldging. I've never had any runny fillings but if I did I would only use a thin layer and not dam--that is just me though.

I'm not a fan of the look of dam either. I think it depends on every person. I personally don't like to see a dam on a cut cake and so I don't use it anymore.

Good luck on your cake Barb.

Jopalis Posted 15 Dec 2009 , 4:01pm

I have tried other recipes and now only use the one posted on CC by Chef Taz! I have poured it on warm and let it cool for piping.... It's excellent! I used to use one by Ina Garten. Now I put Chef Taz Ganache on Ina's Ganache Cake!

Peridot Posted 15 Dec 2009 , 5:35pm

Thanks for the advise Rylan it is greatly appreciated.

CarolAnn Posted 15 Dec 2009 , 6:10pm

Your cake looks very good!! Good for you! Feels good huh?

Ganache is what I use on all my chocolate cakes. I tort and fill and use a thin layer of ganache for the filling, no dam needed. I then crumb coat with it and it spackles in all the holes and spaces beautifully to make a smooth sided cake. I have chilled it and whipped for filling and icing. I love the taste and working with ganache.

I've used the chocolate squares much prefer using semi-sweet choc chips now. I buy either Nestles or Bakers. They work just as well for me and the quality of the flavor is wonderful. I use one 12 oz bag to 8 oz heavy cream/whipping cream. I guess that makes the ratio 3-2?

niccicola Posted 15 Dec 2009 , 6:18pm

If I don't do a dam of ganache, then I usually end up having a thin layer of ganache, so I'll just use a thicker consistency dam of ganache and then a spreadable layer of ganache for filling.

LOVE LOVE LOVE ganache!!!

cherrycakes Posted 15 Dec 2009 , 6:24pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by CarolAnn

Your cake looks very good!! Good for you! Feels good huh?

Ganache is what I use on all my chocolate cakes. I tort and fill and use a thin layer of ganache for the filling, no dam needed. I then crumb coat with it and it spackles in all the holes and spaces beautifully to make a smooth sided cake. I have chilled it and whipped for filling and icing. I love the taste and working with ganache.

I've used the chocolate squares much prefer using semi-sweet choc chips now. I buy either Nestles or Bakers. They work just as well for me and the quality of the flavor is wonderful. I use one 12 oz bag to 8 oz heavy cream/whipping cream. I guess that makes the ratio 3-2?




CarolAnn - do you use the same ratio for filling cakes and for covering them? Do you whip the ganache when using it as filling?

CarolAnn Posted 16 Dec 2009 , 4:33am

Nope, I use the same batch for filling and icing. I have whipped the ganache for filling but I like it better unwhipped. I only use a very thin layer between each torted layer of cake. For me that's plenty considering there will be three layers of it inside the cake. It thickens when it's chilled and makes the most wonderful dense slice of heavenly chocolate cake ever. I'm glad I don't have any in the house now, or I'd be eating cake at 10:30 at night. That's a no no for me.

allissweets Posted 30 Dec 2009 , 5:29am

I am planning to make my first whimsical cake for this weekend, and I'm scared to death! I think I've read more posts about disasters with whimsical cakes than I have success stories! Yikes! One of the things I've read a few times is that many like to cover the cakes with ganache instead of buttercream - stating that it makes it more stable. The cake flavor is chocolate so I think the ganache would be fine. I've NEVER covered a tiered cake in ganache before so this is one more thing to make me nervous. I plan to chill my cakes in the refrigerator during the torting/stacking process. Will this affect the integrity of the ganache? Doesn't ganache firm up when cold but soften at room temp? What will that do to the cakes? Doesn't the ganache "give" a little as you apply the fondant?

Also - what's the best ratio to use for crumb-coating the cakes? I'm reading 2:1 and 3:1. Does it matter? Can I use the same ratio for filling my cakes as I do for crumb coating them?

THANKS SO MUCH to anyone and everyone who is willing and able to help me!!! icon_smile.gif

allissweets Posted 30 Dec 2009 , 5:31am

One more thing...my friend would like the cake flavored with Bailey's Irish Cream. I've tried several times to get a deep, noticeable flavor in my chocolate cake recipes and it's just not happening. I think if I flavor the ganache, I may get a good hint of the liqueur without it being overpowering. Does anyone ever flavor their crumb-coating ganache with liqueur? THANK YOU AGAIN!! ~Alli

allissweets Posted 30 Dec 2009 , 2:44pm

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