how to handle this question correctly...

Business By cakemeasIam Updated 14 Nov 2009 , 1:51am by CakestyleIN

LaBellaFlor Posted 9 Nov 2009 , 1:14pm
post #31 of 267

I only bake from scratch and I make my own fondant. BUT if I bought pre-made fondant and a client asked, I would tell them it was pre-made and bought. Once again, I feel everyone is missing the point. No, you don't have to advertise your a mix baker, but if your client asked, why can't you just tell them you start with a base mix. That doesn't have nothing to to do with trade secrets or anything you guys are trying to say. And we're not talking Coca-cola. That's just silly. I'm sorry, but you are talking about lieing. This is not the same thing as buying soda, a Big Mac, or a Cadillac, or anything else. Like the OP said, the lady was upset about paying for a boxed mix cake when she wanted a scratch cake. If your client ask, they are asking for a reason. If it's just as good, then tell the truth. If it's what you don't do & it's what they want, then don't take the order and lie to get their money. Leah_s had the perfect answer, period.

sahrow Posted 9 Nov 2009 , 1:19pm
post #32 of 267

I'm a scratch baker... of bread. *lol* I even mill my own wheat for that. I can tell the difference in breads!

Cake-wise, I prefer mixes. I'm a home baker/ friends only baker... no selling of cakes. Even with that I won't use a boxed red velvet cake. I did once, and it was terrible. I have a great recipe for red velvet that works every time and tastes divine, so red velvet is always from scratch.

The box red velvet just tasted like... well, the box. I'm guessing this customer has tried the same boxed red velvet cake I did, and if you use that one, I bet she will be unhappy.

...just my 2 cents.

cfao Posted 9 Nov 2009 , 1:23pm
post #33 of 267

Many brides come in and ask this, along with when is the cake baked, is it frozen, how long before the reception is it set up, etc. They get this list from bridal magazines or sites like the knot of what they should ask their baker. Imagine if they went to their favorite restaurant with this list when ordering their food - is this made from scratch, was it made 10 minutes ago fresh from the chef, etc.

When asked this question, I tell them I have my own recipes. I doctor my mixes and for over 20 years, customers have raved about how good the cakes are. The one thing I get asked for the most is my frosting recipe. People are so used to getting "bettercream" that when they get a cake from me frosted with buttercream they always comment on how good the frosting is. Again, I just tell them it is my own recipe, which it is, and I do not give it out.

Suzycakes Posted 9 Nov 2009 , 1:39pm
post #34 of 267

I agree with sahrow - the box red velvet taste is not a true red velvet cake taste! The box mix has a very chemical/twangy taste to me. I believe a red velvet cake must be a scratch cake to have the correct taste and texture.

Suze

Loucinda Posted 9 Nov 2009 , 2:25pm
post #35 of 267
Quote:
Quote:

Here's a thought...
How many people only "bake from scratch" and then use commercial fondant?




I LOVE that one. icon_biggrin.gif
Here is an idea - make your doctored mix one, and a scratch one, then do a tasting for the bride - let HER decide which one is which. thumbs_up.gif

-K8memphis Posted 9 Nov 2009 , 2:31pm
post #36 of 267
Quote:
Originally Posted by LaBellaFlor

I only bake from scratch and I make my own fondant. BUT if I bought pre-made fondant and a client asked, I would tell them it was pre-made and bought. Once again, I feel everyone is missing the point. No, you don't have to advertise your a mix baker, but if your client asked, why can't you just tell them you start with a base mix. That doesn't have nothing to to do with trade secrets or anything you guys are trying to say. And we're not talking Coca-cola. That's just silly. I'm sorry, but you are talking about lieing. This is not the same thing as buying soda, a Big Mac, or a Cadillac, or anything else. Like the OP said, the lady was upset about paying for a boxed mix cake when she wanted a scratch cake. If your client ask, they are asking for a reason. If it's just as good, then tell the truth. If it's what you don't do & it's what they want, then don't take the order and lie to get their money. Leah_s had the perfect answer, period.




I feel these comments are ugly and are hitting below the belt.

If you feel it is lying then don't do it.

Reiterating that others are indeed liars is not what this discussion is about.

LaBellaFlor Posted 9 Nov 2009 , 2:32pm
post #37 of 267

I think that is what I said. If they asked if my fondant was premade, I would say yes, I bought it pre-made.

Sweet-Dreams Posted 9 Nov 2009 , 2:36pm
post #38 of 267

I think that the best thing to do is to be honest. Personally, I'm not a fan of eating boxed mixes. It's not the taste (and I know some of you use doctored mixes to create cakes that taste AMAZING!) though. I just prefer not to eat a lot of preservatives. (Yes, I'm one of those "all natural" weirdos, lol!) I buy a lot of organic/free range foods and I try to limit going to restaurants that don't bake from scratch (very hard to do, hence the 'try'!!).

I know this doesn't really apply in this case, but I just wanted to give another perspective. If I asked someone if they baked from scratch I would really prefer an honest answer. I wouldn't be doubting your abilities to make something that tastes delicious! icon_biggrin.gif

-K8memphis Posted 9 Nov 2009 , 2:36pm
post #39 of 267
Quote:
Originally Posted by MObeefcake

a client inquiring about a future order wanted to know if i make my cakes from scratch- specifically red velvet. she proceeded to say that she had paid a lot of money once for a cake a and it tasted like it came from a box...
help me answer diplomatically...i use doctored cake mixes...




The huger problem is that perhaps some can but most people cannot detect which method is used. If a cake sucks the person just assumes it's the method they like least. EVEN MANY PROS can't tell.

-K8memphis Posted 9 Nov 2009 , 2:37pm
post #40 of 267
Quote:
Originally Posted by elliebuff

This is always tough...but in the end, if you don't tell the truth, it may come back to haunt you. I do the same thing with doctored cake mixes--I would say something like, "I generally start with a box mix, but make additions to it to give it my own flavor/touches--I like the smooth texture they bring to the cake. I would be happy to set up a tasting with you if you would like to do that."

Good luck!




This answer to the op is the first to mention not telling the truth and the consequences.

Pretty sure most of us get that lying is wrong but thank you for the heads up.

cakesdivine Posted 9 Nov 2009 , 2:38pm
post #41 of 267

I did a blind taste test at a sampling not too long ago...I made a scratch cake (and my scratch cakes are really good) and a doctored mix cake in French vanilla & Dark Chocolate cakes. In both instances the clients preferred the box mix as opposed to the scratch. The funny thing was I asked them to tell me which one was from scratch and which one was a box mix THEN asked them which one they preferred based on taste, texture, and moistness. ALL of them thought the doctored cake mix was from scratch and that the doctored cake mix tasted the best. It was very eye opening for them. I use doctored cake mixes for the speed as my time is very limited, and to me they do have a much nicer texture than a scratch cake.

From scratch does NOT equal better tasting or better quality! That is a myth.

Oh and FYI grocery stores and Walmart have their cakes already baked & shipped in from a large mass production bakery that starts from scratch with their ingredients not a box mix.

LaBellaFlor Posted 9 Nov 2009 , 2:38pm
post #42 of 267
Quote:
Originally Posted by K8memphis-

Quote:
Originally Posted by LaBellaFlor

I only bake from scratch and I make my own fondant. BUT if I bought pre-made fondant and a client asked, I would tell them it was pre-made and bought. Once again, I feel everyone is missing the point. No, you don't have to advertise your a mix baker, but if your client asked, why can't you just tell them you start with a base mix. That doesn't have nothing to to do with trade secrets or anything you guys are trying to say. And we're not talking Coca-cola. That's just silly. I'm sorry, but you are talking about lieing. This is not the same thing as buying soda, a Big Mac, or a Cadillac, or anything else. Like the OP said, the lady was upset about paying for a boxed mix cake when she wanted a scratch cake. If your client ask, they are asking for a reason. If it's just as good, then tell the truth. If it's what you don't do & it's what they want, then don't take the order and lie to get their money. Leah_s had the perfect answer, period.



I feel these comments are ugly and are hitting below the belt.

If you feel it is lying then don't do it.

Reiterating that others are indeed liars is not what this discussion is about.





If thats how you feel, that is your perogaitive. I stand by what I say. I think it's wrong to encourage people to tip toe around the question of scratch or mix when a client ask. Tell them yes, it's scratch or no, I start with a base mix that I then add ingredients. It's like when you find out someone lies to you and you ask,"Why did you lie to me?" and they answer with,"I didn't lie. You didn't ask me" or "I just didn't tell you". The OP said the lady was upset she got a boxed cake when she wanted scratch. Heck, even Coca Cola tells you what's in their soda. It's on the can.

Sweet-Dreams Posted 9 Nov 2009 , 2:39pm
post #43 of 267

This topic reminded me of a commercial I saw on AOL earlier this week:
icon_lol.gif
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q-RLqLx1iYI

manahigh Posted 9 Nov 2009 , 2:41pm
post #44 of 267

Wow CCers! I just don't see why these scratch vs mix forums always get so nasty. Everyone take a DEEP breath.

Loucinda Posted 9 Nov 2009 , 2:44pm
post #45 of 267

I bake from "scratch" all the time.....just not cakes. I do artisan breads.....how many of you would ask if your bread was made from a mix or not? Jeesh.

(and another FYI, I have only been doing cakes for sale for about 4 years now, and have NEVER been asked that question)

Now, as far as the pre-made fondant/scrach cake thing, again, why go into the details? IF they ask if it is all scratch, taking the advice of some on here - you would have to answer no. (There are some here that don't want us to go into the "details" of I start with a mix) just the FACTS - in which case, those who use premade fondant would have to HONESTLY answer NO - it isn't all from "scratch". Double standard?

dailey Posted 9 Nov 2009 , 2:45pm
post #46 of 267

what a silly thread. if a customer ask whether you used a box or bake from scratch, simply answer the question. some things are a no-brainer...

-K8memphis Posted 9 Nov 2009 , 2:47pm
post #47 of 267

Could we agree that the op did not mention or hint or attempt to lie about anything? Could we delete those extreme comments from the rest of this thread?

It makes as much sense to say, please don't break any other of the other ten commandments if someone asks scratch or mix.

Please don't kill me because you might go to jail.

Please don't clean out my gargage again because stealing from me is wrong.

We mostly get the ten commandments.

Let's grow up this tiny little bit and stop preaching extremes--not that telling the truth ain't important--btw--yes I do look fat in these jeans--happy now?

If you're not getting it--when you say "Don't lie." You've preconcluded that the person does lie or is considering perpetrating a lie--breaking a moral code of honor and commiting a jailable offense.

I for one grant that our op was not even remotely contemplating lying about it.

LaBellaFlor Posted 9 Nov 2009 , 2:49pm
post #48 of 267
Quote:
Originally Posted by Loucinda

I bake from "scratch" all the time.....just not cakes. I do artisan breads.....how many of you would ask if your bread was made from a mix or not? Jeesh.

(and another FYI, I have only been doing cakes for sale for about 4 years now, and have NEVER been asked that question)

Now, as far as the pre-made fondant/scrach cake thing, again, why go into the details? IF they ask if it is all scratch, taking the advice of some on here - you would have to answer no. (There are some here that don't want us to go into the "details" of I start with a mix) just the FACTS - in which case, those who use premade fondant would have to HONESTLY answer NO - it isn't all from "scratch". Double standard?




If someone asks if EVERYTHING you made was from scratch and it isn't, then say no. It's not about mix or scratch is better. It's about just answering the question truthfully. that's all I'm trying to say. I never said anything about taste, quality, or anything like that. Just answer the question truthfully. like Daily said,"This is a no brainer. Just answer the question".

LaBellaFlor Posted 9 Nov 2009 , 2:51pm
post #49 of 267

I don't think I called the OP a liar. I think my point was you can answer in a round about way all you want, you'ld be lieing. What this has to do with stealing and murder is beyond me. That is just such a ridiculous point.

Loucinda Posted 9 Nov 2009 , 2:55pm
post #50 of 267
Quote:
Quote:

It's about just answering the question truthfully




Exactly.....only now, since the premade fondant thing is there, we can explain exactly which PARTS of the cake are not from scratch?

(whereas before that was brought up, it was NO, you HAVE to tell them the truth, don't skirt around it, don't try to sugar coat the fact it isn't from "scratch" - you have to just say NO it isn't)

Yep, double standard, if you ask me.

Sweet-Dreams Posted 9 Nov 2009 , 2:55pm
post #51 of 267
Quote:
Originally Posted by LaBellaFlor


If someone asks if EVERYTHING you made was from scratch and it isn't, then say no. It's not about mix or scratch is better. It's about just answering the question truthfully. that's all I'm trying to say. I never said anything about taste, quality, or anything like that. Just answer the question truthfully. like Daily said,"This is a no brainer. Just answer the question".




I agree, and I especially like IndyDebi's way of including how many other businesses use mixes as well. Many times the brides are asking because of information they read or have a list of questions they memorized from a website to ask. Educate them on how the taste doesn't depend on whether it's made from scratch or built upon from a mix. icon_biggrin.gif
If you start with a mix, be proud of it! Simply telling the customer that use your own special recipe is deceiving! Like I said before, I prefer not to eat cake mixes not because of a taste difference, but because of the ingredients.

-K8memphis Posted 9 Nov 2009 , 2:56pm
post #52 of 267

If your child was cross eyed or had a majorbreak out on their face and someone mentions it and says sincerely to you in front of the kid, "Oh I'm so sorry your poor child has such an unsightly skin problem."

Dude, just being honest. What's a matter with sincere emphathy and honesty?

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

I'd say, I do not exclude any methods or ingredient you get the benefit of over 30 years of experience~~it all depends on the job at hand. I can provide you with an ingredients list when you place your order.

Of course we'd need to add a clause in our contracts that we are polygraph ready. Please initial and date it here ___________

Or you could say, "Yes I use toxic waste but I put some other ingredients in there so to kind of cover up the nasty taste. What date did you want to poison your friends & family at your party?

Loucinda Posted 9 Nov 2009 , 2:59pm
post #53 of 267
Quote:
Quote:

I'd say, I do not exclude any methods or ingredient you get the benefit of over 30 years of experience~~it all depends on the job at hand. I can provide you with an ingredients list when you place your order.




LOVE that one, I am saving it. (for if I am EVER asked the ridiculous question!)

Thanks K8!

Sweet-Dreams Posted 9 Nov 2009 , 3:00pm
post #54 of 267
Quote:
Originally Posted by Loucinda


Exactly.....only now, since the premade fondant thing is there, we can explain exactly which PARTS of the cake are not from scratch?

(whereas before that was brought up, it was NO, you HAVE to tell them the truth, don't skirt around it, don't try to sugar coat the fact it isn't from "scratch" - you have to just say NO it isn't)

Yep, double standard, if you ask me.




But the customer isn't asking about the fondant. My buttercream is made from scratch, and I have been practicing making fondant from scratch as well.

However, at the moment, if a customer asked me, "Is everything made from scratch?" I would be honest. I would reply that while the cake and buttercream are, I am currently shipping in Satin Ice fondant. (and I would definitely be sure to explain that it doesn't taste like Wilton's! lol icon_lol.gif

LaBellaFlor Posted 9 Nov 2009 , 3:00pm
post #55 of 267
Quote:
Originally Posted by K8memphis-

If your child was cross eyed or had a majorbreak out on their face and someone mentions it and says sincerely to you in front of the kid, "Oh I'm so sorry your poor child has such a horrible skin problem."

Dude, just being honest. What's a matter with sincere emphathy and honesty?

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

I'd say, I do not exclude any methods or ingredient you get the benefit of over 30 years of experience~~it all depends on the job at hand. I can provide you with an ingredients list when you place your order.

Of course we'd need to add a clause in our contracts that we are polygraph ready. Please initial and date it here ___________

Or you could say, "Yes I use toxic waste but I put some other ingredients in there so to kind of cover up the nasty taste. What date did you want that?




icon_confused.gif

-K8memphis Posted 9 Nov 2009 , 3:02pm
post #56 of 267
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sweet-Dreams

Quote:
Originally Posted by Loucinda


Exactly.....only now, since the premade fondant thing is there, we can explain exactly which PARTS of the cake are not from scratch?

(whereas before that was brought up, it was NO, you HAVE to tell them the truth, don't skirt around it, don't try to sugar coat the fact it isn't from "scratch" - you have to just say NO it isn't)

Yep, double standard, if you ask me.



But the customer isn't asking about the fondant. My buttercream is made from scratch, and I have been practicing making fondant from scratch as well.

However, at the moment, if a customer asked me, "Is everything made from scratch?" I would be honest. I would reply that while the cake and buttercream are, I am currently shipping in fondant. (and I would definitely be sure to explain that it doesn't taste like Wilton's! lol icon_lol.gif




Do you make your vanilla? Check the ingredients on your flour bag lately?

tatorchip Posted 9 Nov 2009 , 3:03pm
post #57 of 267
Quote:
Originally Posted by LaBellaFlor

I only bake from scratch and I make my own fondant. BUT if I bought pre-made fondant and a client asked, I would tell them it was pre-made and bought. Once again, I feel everyone is missing the point. No, you don't have to advertise your a mix baker, but if your client asked, why can't you just tell them you start with a base mix. That doesn't have nothing to to do with trade secrets or anything you guys are trying to say. And we're not talking Coca-cola. That's just silly. I'm sorry, but you are talking about lieing. This is not the same thing as buying soda, a Big Mac, or a Cadillac, or anything else. Like the OP said, the lady was upset about paying for a boxed mix cake when she wanted a scratch cake. If your client ask, they are asking for a reason. If it's just as good, then tell the truth. If it's what you don't do & it's what they want, then don't take the order and lie to get their money. Leah_s had the perfect answer, period.





is your high horse named "Trade Secret" icon_smile.gif

cakesdivine Posted 9 Nov 2009 , 3:05pm
post #58 of 267
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sweet-Dreams

This topic reminded me of a commercial I saw on AOL earlier this week:
icon_lol.gif
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q-RLqLx1iYI





OMG! I never laughed so hard in all my life! This was too funny!

LaBellaFlor Posted 9 Nov 2009 , 3:05pm
post #59 of 267
Quote:
Originally Posted by tatorchip

Quote:
Originally Posted by LaBellaFlor

I only bake from scratch and I make my own fondant. BUT if I bought pre-made fondant and a client asked, I would tell them it was pre-made and bought. Once again, I feel everyone is missing the point. No, you don't have to advertise your a mix baker, but if your client asked, why can't you just tell them you start with a base mix. That doesn't have nothing to to do with trade secrets or anything you guys are trying to say. And we're not talking Coca-cola. That's just silly. I'm sorry, but you are talking about lieing. This is not the same thing as buying soda, a Big Mac, or a Cadillac, or anything else. Like the OP said, the lady was upset about paying for a boxed mix cake when she wanted a scratch cake. If your client ask, they are asking for a reason. If it's just as good, then tell the truth. If it's what you don't do & it's what they want, then don't take the order and lie to get their money. Leah_s had the perfect answer, period.




is your high horse named "Trade Secret" icon_smile.gif





No. By they, I have two and their called "Perfection" & "Know It All".

cakemeasIam Posted 9 Nov 2009 , 3:07pm
post #60 of 267

you guys have been busy while i was gone! icon_biggrin.gifplease know i was not intending to mix up a controversy... i wasn't trying to dodge the question...it was her comment on money that i was afraid of insulting.
i use cake mixes...i doctor them...i have made things from scratch too.
i simply took all's advice and said...i do start with a mix. but i don't finish with one.
happy monday!

Quote by @%username% on %date%

%body%