Does Duff Refrigerate???

Decorating By forthwife Updated 13 Jul 2009 , 5:02pm by ninatat

forthwife Posted 10 Jul 2009 , 8:32pm
post #1 of 64

Probably the wrong forum for this but, to me it doesn't look like Chef Duff (and crew) refrigerate their cakes once they're done being decorated. I see shelves and shelves of cakes in the store. How on earth do they do this since their cakes are iced with a buttercream containing raw egg whites????? I know refrigeration doesn't kill salmonella, but it does slow it down. Any thoughts?

63 replies
Rylan Posted 11 Jul 2009 , 12:17am
post #2 of 64

The eggs are cooked I believe.

Rylan Posted 11 Jul 2009 , 12:19am
post #3 of 64

Well let me reinstate what I said. Doesn't SMBC contain eggs and still be ok to be left on the counter?

forthwife Posted 11 Jul 2009 , 9:44pm
post #4 of 64

I know they're heated, but cooked I don't know. Regardless, would you leave scrambled eggs on the counter??

varika Posted 11 Jul 2009 , 9:53pm
post #5 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by forthwife

I know they're heated, but cooked I don't know. Regardless, would you leave scrambled eggs on the counter??




Salmonella is not co much a concern, because the eggs are pasteurized in the process if not cooked through. I've left SMBC out on the counter for three or so days, when fondant covered, though I never would if it wasn't covered. Almost all of Duff's cakes are fondant-covered.

Also, we have no idea what temperature it is in the bakery, but they all seem to have sweaters hanging on the backs of their chairs all the time--maybe the whole store is refrigerated! icon_biggrin.gif

cylstrial Posted 11 Jul 2009 , 10:23pm
post #6 of 64

I'm sure that the place is kept pretty cold. I went to the Nashville, TN cake contest and Michelle Bommarito was there. She said they keep it super, super cold.

When they make their frosting they are definitely cooking those eggs to 160 or more. And SMBC (which I'm pretty sure he uses a French Buttercream) but anyway, it can be left out for 1-2 days (for a customer) 3 days if it's for your own consumption.

I have definitely seen some cakes in their fridge before though. So maybe they only refrigerate the ones that have a filling that has to be kept refrigerated.

momma28 Posted 11 Jul 2009 , 10:53pm
post #7 of 64

I saw duff give a lesson in making smbc on food network I think during a challenge and he does not even heat his egg whites. He said that the sugar cooks the egg whites while beating. I wouldnt take that chance.

CakeandDazzle Posted 11 Jul 2009 , 11:09pm
post #8 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by cylstrial

I'm sure that the place is kept pretty cold. I went to the Nashville, TN cake contest and Michelle Bommarito was there. She said they keep it super, super cold.

When they make their frosting they are definitely cooking those eggs to 160 or more. And SMBC (which I'm pretty sure he uses a French Buttercream) but anyway, it can be left out for 1-2 days (for a customer) 3 days if it's for your own consumption.

I have definitely seen some cakes in their fridge before though. So maybe they only refrigerate the ones that have a filling that has to be kept refrigerated.




What is the difference between French bc and smbc... or really what is french buttercream??

Anyways Smbc can be left out for at least 24 hours. The eggs are cooked

Quote:
Originally Posted by momma28

I saw duff give a lesson in making smbc on food network I think during a challenge and he does not even heat his egg whites. He said that the sugar cooks the egg whites while beating. I wouldnt take that chance.




That wouldn't be Smbc then right? since you cook the egg whites and sugar together? Maybe IMBC?

ninatat Posted 11 Jul 2009 , 11:16pm
post #9 of 64

ahhhhhum

momma28 Posted 11 Jul 2009 , 11:19pm
post #10 of 64

I dont know which kind but I was a bit grossed out that he added them without heating.

Rylan Posted 12 Jul 2009 , 3:16am
post #11 of 64

I believe the sugar is hot enough for the eggs to be properly cooked.

CakeandDazzle Posted 12 Jul 2009 , 3:22am
post #12 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by RylanTy

I believe the sugar is hot enough for the eggs to be properly cooked.




totally off topic... but isn't your avatar cake the cake you were dissappointed in?? and now its you avatar?? Ummm I wonder if thats because it was a fantastic cake?? lol

tcturtleshell Posted 12 Jul 2009 , 3:30am
post #13 of 64

The last show of Duff's I saw they were shoving a cake into the walk in frig. They had to re-do the sides because the door frame of the frig took all the icing off. So I guess that would mean he does use a frig. The cake they were shoving in the frig was the cake for the 100th show or something of Broadway musical Hairspray.

forthwife Posted 12 Jul 2009 , 3:34am
post #14 of 64

I know some are refrigerated, but there are still tons and tons throughout the shop. I just can seem to wrap my brain around it being ok not to refrigerate an egg product. My brother in law is a microbiologist and he won't even let his family eat butter that's been left covered on the counter. Am I just paranoid??

Rylan Posted 12 Jul 2009 , 4:23am
post #15 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by CakeandDazzle

Quote:
Originally Posted by RylanTy

I believe the sugar is hot enough for the eggs to be properly cooked.



totally off topic... but isn't your avatar cake the cake you were dissappointed in?? and now its you avatar?? Ummm I wonder if thats because it was a fantastic cake?? lol




I felt like it looked better small because you can't see the flaws.

Rylan Posted 12 Jul 2009 , 4:25am
post #16 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by CakeandDazzle

Quote:
Originally Posted by RylanTy

I believe the sugar is hot enough for the eggs to be properly cooked.



totally off topic... but isn't your avatar cake the cake you were dissappointed in?? and now its you avatar?? Ummm I wonder if thats because it was a fantastic cake?? lol




It looks better small because you can't see the flaws.

CakeandDazzle Posted 12 Jul 2009 , 5:11am
post #17 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by RylanTy

Quote:
Originally Posted by CakeandDazzle

Quote:
Originally Posted by RylanTy

I believe the sugar is hot enough for the eggs to be properly cooked.



totally off topic... but isn't your avatar cake the cake you were dissappointed in?? and now its you avatar?? Ummm I wonder if thats because it was a fantastic cake?? lol



It looks better small because you can't see the flaws.




no i seen the thread and the cake full size! your being modest the cake is fantastic and has no flaws...

indydebi Posted 12 Jul 2009 , 12:16pm
post #18 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by momma28

He said that the sugar cooks the egg whites while beating. I wouldnt take that chance.




If Duff said it, that's good enough for me. I assume he knows much more about it than I do.

I also saw that Cake Love guy on food channel making icing and when he poured the hot mixture into the mixing bowl, he kept feeling the bowl and explained he wanted to feel the heat of the bowl, which is what "cooked" the eggs and made the icing "safe".

2 experts saying the same thing. I'm not going to tell Betty Crocker how to bake, so I'm good with it. thumbs_up.gif

And I never refrigerate my cakes or icing.

Mike1394 Posted 12 Jul 2009 , 12:26pm
post #19 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by CakeandDazzle

Quote:
Originally Posted by cylstrial

I'm sure that the place is kept pretty cold. I went to the Nashville, TN cake contest and Michelle Bommarito was there. She said they keep it super, super cold.

When they make their frosting they are definitely cooking those eggs to 160 or more. And SMBC (which I'm pretty sure he uses a French Buttercream) but anyway, it can be left out for 1-2 days (for a customer) 3 days if it's for your own consumption.

I have definitely seen some cakes in their fridge before though. So maybe they only refrigerate the ones that have a filling that has to be kept refrigerated.



What is the difference between French bc and smbc... or really what is french buttercream??

Anyways Smbc can be left out for at least 24 hours. The eggs are cooked

Quote:
Originally Posted by momma28

I saw duff give a lesson in making smbc on food network I think during a challenge and he does not even heat his egg whites. He said that the sugar cooks the egg whites while beating. I wouldnt take that chance.



That wouldn't be Smbc then right? since you cook the egg whites and sugar together? Maybe IMBC?




French BC you use egg yolks instead of the whites. SMBC you cook the sugar, and whites together. IMBC you cook the sugar to 240, and add to a medium/soft peak white.

Mike

SHogg Posted 12 Jul 2009 , 12:27pm
post #20 of 64

Well said Indydebi......I agree

cylstrial Posted 12 Jul 2009 , 12:45pm
post #21 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike1394

Quote:
Originally Posted by CakeandDazzle

Quote:
Originally Posted by cylstrial

I'm sure that the place is kept pretty cold. I went to the Nashville, TN cake contest and Michelle Bommarito was there. She said they keep it super, super cold.

When they make their frosting they are definitely cooking those eggs to 160 or more. And SMBC (which I'm pretty sure he uses a French Buttercream) but anyway, it can be left out for 1-2 days (for a customer) 3 days if it's for your own consumption.

I have definitely seen some cakes in their fridge before though. So maybe they only refrigerate the ones that have a filling that has to be kept refrigerated.



What is the difference between French bc and smbc... or really what is french buttercream??

Anyways Smbc can be left out for at least 24 hours. The eggs are cooked

Quote:
Originally Posted by momma28

I saw duff give a lesson in making smbc on food network I think during a challenge and he does not even heat his egg whites. He said that the sugar cooks the egg whites while beating. I wouldnt take that chance.



That wouldn't be Smbc then right? since you cook the egg whites and sugar together? Maybe IMBC?



French BC you use egg yolks instead of the whites. SMBC you cook the sugar, and whites together. IMBC you cook the sugar to 240, and add to a medium/soft peak white.

Mike




Thanks Mike!

PattyT Posted 12 Jul 2009 , 12:47pm
post #22 of 64

For SMBC, I follow either Martha's or Nick Maglieri's recipes. Both call for heating the egg whites with sugar. Nick's said 130 degrees, but one of Martha's said 160 degrees, so I go to 160 with all my SMBC now. If you stir contstantly they do not coagulate or "cook".

The American Egg Board link has all the temps:

http://www.incredibleegg.org/egg_facts_handling4.html

160 looks like it does the trick...

Charmaine49 Posted 12 Jul 2009 , 1:00pm
post #23 of 64

RylanTy.............no ways, your cake was stunning the large version as well.
As someone said, "its only a cake" and there will always be flaws, no matter what!

artscallion Posted 12 Jul 2009 , 1:45pm
post #24 of 64

We discussed this a few months ago in another thread. Duff calls his recipe "French Buttercream". But it's not. French buttercream uses yolks, not whites as Duff does. Italian buttercream heats the sugar and then pours it into beaten whites. Swiss buttercream heats the sugar and eggs together before beating them. Duff doesn't heat anything. You can get in-shell eggs that are pasteurized. We don't know what Duff uses. But he doesn't specify that in his published recipe that the public would use.

Official FDA stance...no raw eggs, ever, at all. Though the chance of contamination from egg whites (whites aren't conducive to bacteria like yolks are) is minute in healthy adults

Professionals weigh that risk and make their choices. I'd say half the people I know don't worry about it. The other half either don't use them or include disclaimers in their menu. It's kind of like the medium hamburger scare of a few years back. You get a few cases of something and suddenly no one will serve you anything but a well done burger. Over time, thinks loosen up and restaurants start asking again how you want it cooked. There is a risk. But it's so small, you weigh it.

For myself, with so many other choices out there, I see no reason to even deal with it. If I want a meringue buttercream, I use powdered egg whites.

cylstrial Posted 12 Jul 2009 , 2:45pm
post #25 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by artscallion

We discussed this a few months ago in another thread. Duff calls his recipe "French Buttercream". But it's not. French buttercream uses yolks, not whites as Duff does. Italian buttercream heats the sugar and then pours it into beaten whites. Swiss buttercream heats the sugar and eggs together before beating them. Duff doesn't heat anything. You can get in-shell eggs that are pasteurized. We don't know what Duff uses. But he doesn't specify that in his published recipe that the public would use.




Sorry! I must have missed post. For some reason I thought he used the French Buttercream. I don't know if I heard it on a TV show or what. But anyway, sorry about misleading people!

tonedna Posted 12 Jul 2009 , 3:04pm
post #26 of 64

Before people had fridges butter was already around. It was kept in dishes in a room where no AC existed. The butter will get soft, but it will be good out of the fridge withouth causing illness even overnight. Even for cooking is required that the butter be at room temperature. So..a cake done with butter in it can be left outside over night no problem. The risk is that it will get softer.
Edna icon_smile.gif

indydebi Posted 12 Jul 2009 , 3:09pm
post #27 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by tonedna

Before people had fridges butter was already around. It was kept in dishes in a room where no AC existed. The butter will get soft, but it will be good out of the fridge withouth causing illness even overnight. Even for cooking is required that the butter be at room temperature. So..a cake done with butter in it can be left outside over night no problem. The risk is that it will get softer.
Edna icon_smile.gif


My thoughts exactly. My grandmother NEVER put her butter in the fridge. It sat on her kitchen table all day, in a non-A/C'd house, on a farm.

CakeandDazzle Posted 12 Jul 2009 , 3:47pm
post #28 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike1394

Quote:
Originally Posted by CakeandDazzle

Quote:
Originally Posted by cylstrial

I'm sure that the place is kept pretty cold. I went to the Nashville, TN cake contest and Michelle Bommarito was there. She said they keep it super, super cold.

When they make their frosting they are definitely cooking those eggs to 160 or more. And SMBC (which I'm pretty sure he uses a French Buttercream) but anyway, it can be left out for 1-2 days (for a customer) 3 days if it's for your own consumption.

I have definitely seen some cakes in their fridge before though. So maybe they only refrigerate the ones that have a filling that has to be kept refrigerated.



What is the difference between French bc and smbc... or really what is french buttercream??

Anyways Smbc can be left out for at least 24 hours. The eggs are cooked

Quote:
Originally Posted by momma28

I saw duff give a lesson in making smbc on food network I think during a challenge and he does not even heat his egg whites. He said that the sugar cooks the egg whites while beating. I wouldnt take that chance.



That wouldn't be Smbc then right? since you cook the egg whites and sugar together? Maybe IMBC?



French BC you use egg yolks instead of the whites. SMBC you cook the sugar, and whites together. IMBC you cook the sugar to 240, and add to a medium/soft peak white.

Mike




Thats what i thought about french... but someone tried to tell me french was uncooked egg whites & sugar whipped then add butter... like smbc with out cooking it.... disaster waiting to happen for whoever eats that cake....

CakeandDazzle Posted 12 Jul 2009 , 3:56pm
post #29 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by indydebi

Quote:
Originally Posted by tonedna

Before people had fridges butter was already around. It was kept in dishes in a room where no AC existed. The butter will get soft, but it will be good out of the fridge withouth causing illness even overnight. Even for cooking is required that the butter be at room temperature. So..a cake done with butter in it can be left outside over night no problem. The risk is that it will get softer.
Edna icon_smile.gif

My thoughts exactly. My grandmother NEVER put her butter in the fridge. It sat on her kitchen table all day, in a non-A/C'd house, on a farm.





My grandparents left a stick of butter in one of those butter containers on the counter until it was gone... days even weeks Im sure... nothing ever happened... now im not saying ANYONE should ever do this.... but it happens

Ruth0209 Posted 12 Jul 2009 , 4:23pm
post #30 of 64

I very seldom refrigerate the butter I use for my family. I HATE trying to butter a piece of toast with rock hard butter. It's really fine even when it's melted down into a semi-puddle, although I do stick it in the fridge for a while when that happens.

You can soften your butter really quickly and easily in the microwave by heating it 11 - 12 seconds at 50% power. Works like a charm. Since I usually forget to set out the butter when I'm baking, it's a time saver for me.

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