May I Borrow Your Picture(S)?

Business By mellyc Updated 29 Jun 2009 , 7:56pm by sara91

mellyc Posted 28 Jun 2009 , 10:04am
post #1 of 25

Hi everyone,

I'm Melany and I live in the Netherlands.

I'm trying to start a business in online cake decorating.

The idea is to set up a link with impressions and idea's on my website so people will be able to see what the possibillities are in cake decorating. It will be just for global impression as in my experience a cake never entirely turns out the way I plan it to....

Of course credit will be given to the original decorater.

As soon as I have more pictures of my own baked cakes in my posession, I will start replacing my own pictures for the ones I borrowed from you .


kind regards and thanks,

Melany.

24 replies
dhccster Posted 28 Jun 2009 , 10:39am
post #2 of 25

Hi Melany-- where in the Netherlands do you live? I wonder if you are close to where I live???

Unlimited Posted 28 Jun 2009 , 11:41am
post #3 of 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by mellyc

Hi everyone,

I'm Melany and I live in the Netherlands.

I'm trying to start a business in online cake decorating.

The idea is to set up a link with impressions and idea's on my website so people will be able to see what the possibillities are in cake decorating. It will be just for global impression as in my experience a cake never entirely turns out the way I plan it to....

Of course credit will be given to the original decorater.

As soon as I have more pictures of my own baked cakes in my posession, I will start replacing my own pictures for the ones I borrowed from you .


kind regards and thanks,

Melany.




I think you need permission from the site, or from the individual owners of each and every photo instead of one general post stating you are going to do so.

jillmakescakes Posted 28 Jun 2009 , 1:05pm
post #4 of 25

How about, instead of posting the individual pictures, you simply place a link to the decorators site. This will allow you customer/client to browse the entire collection and you to not have the slightest hint of impropriety. You could say something like "Here are some links to cake artists that inspire me."

Deb_ Posted 28 Jun 2009 , 1:13pm
post #5 of 25

Totally agree with Jill's advice. I don't think it's good business to showcase other's individual cake photos on your site but a link to their site would be acceptable.

jlynnw Posted 28 Jun 2009 , 1:15pm
post #6 of 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by jillmakescakes

How about, instead of posting the individual pictures, you simply place a link to the decorators site. This will allow you customer/client to browse the entire collection and you to not have the slightest hint of impropriety. You could say something like "Here are some links to cake artists that inspire me."




I like that idea! Just be sure you can imitate their work reasonable. Nothing is worse than seeing a picture of a cake and going to pick up the cake that looks totally different!

grama_j Posted 28 Jun 2009 , 1:37pm
post #7 of 25

I think the only objection would be if you were presenting the pictures as if they were own designs....... Sounds like a great adventure ! And Welcome to CC!!

tcakes65 Posted 28 Jun 2009 , 1:56pm
post #8 of 25

I personally don't think it's good business practice, and you need to get permission from each individual cake designer. I agree that making a blanket request is not the appropriate way to handle this. Not everyone will see your post or agree to your method of advertising. My recommendation is to make dummy cakes for your portfolio and add to it as you get more business. There's nothing wrong with having a small portfolio to display your skills until you start getting more business. You will be amazed at how quickly your portfolio will grow once your business picks up.

artscallion Posted 28 Jun 2009 , 1:59pm
post #9 of 25

There are thousands of members here with posted pictures. I don't think any one person, or few people who reply here, can give you across the board permission to use any photo you find here. You need to ask individually of the owner of each specific photo you want to use if they would be willing to let you do this.

But I also agree that it might be a better idea not to confuse your customers into thinking you created cakes that were actually created by other people by featuring them on your site. Even if you credit the creator, would that make it clear that the creator was not part of your business? I think it's too ambiguous a thing to do.

Linking to sites that inspire you and give ideas to your customers is probably a better idea, as others have suggested. Or maybe waiting until you have a body of work of your own that you can feature before setting up your website.

grama_j Posted 28 Jun 2009 , 2:05pm
post #10 of 25

" There are thousands of members here with posted pictures. I don't think any one person, or few people who reply here, can give you across the board permission to use any photo you find here. You need to ask individually of the owner of each specific photo you want to use if they would be willing to let you do this. ''
I understand what you are saying, but the "picture" isn't the problem.... the design IS...... how many of the "thousands' of posted pictures are their own designs ? I would venture to guess ....not very many......

mellyc Posted 28 Jun 2009 , 2:05pm
post #11 of 25

I just didn't think of it that way yet, as I said it's all new to me.

Thank you all for your advice and I hope to learn much more on cake central.

Melany.

artscallion Posted 28 Jun 2009 , 2:20pm
post #12 of 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by grama_j

" There are thousands of members here with posted pictures. I don't think any one person, or few people who reply here, can give you across the board permission to use any photo you find here. You need to ask individually of the owner of each specific photo you want to use if they would be willing to let you do this. ''
I understand what you are saying, but the "picture" isn't the problem.... the design IS...... how many of the "thousands' of posted pictures are their own designs ? I would venture to guess ....not very many......




Yes, I should have worded that more clearly. When I say 'picture' I didn't mean just the right to use a photo. I meant the right to represent, as your own, what the photo is of. That includes design...but not just design...it's the work as well. Even if the design is not original, the work/talent/skill is not her own. A picture would represent the skill level and abilities of the original decorator as if the OP had those skills and abilities, whether the design was original or not.

grama_j Posted 28 Jun 2009 , 2:23pm
post #13 of 25

" A picture would represent the skill level and abilities of the original decorator as if the OP had those skills and abilities, whether the design was original or not."

But as she stated, she would give credit to the original decorator..... there should be no problem here.......

artscallion Posted 28 Jun 2009 , 3:21pm
post #14 of 25

It's not a problem If she specifically states that the original decorator is not part of her business. But if she posts a photo of a cake on her site and notes underneath, "cake created and designed by Mindy Smith" What is there to prevent the viewer from assuming that home baker Mindy Smith isn't one of OP's staff bakers? And that they may get a cake made by Mindy Smith if they order from OP? And, to be able to even credit a photo here, she would need to contact the individual poster specifically to get their name for the credit, otherwise her credits would have to read something like, "created and designed by Thatsalottacake68."

And in any event, here's a good outline of the appropriateness/legalities of using other peoples words or photos in your website. Hope it helps.

http://www.lizardkingdom.org/archives/2009/05/blogging-copyright.html

grama_j Posted 28 Jun 2009 , 3:28pm
post #15 of 25

Melly..... you can use ANY of my pictures that you want..... icon_wink.gif

Ruth0209 Posted 28 Jun 2009 , 3:42pm
post #16 of 25

Melany, you can use any of my pictures in my gallery as long as you just give me credit (Cake design by Ruth...). It's just important that you let your customers know that the picture is by another cake designer and that it's an example of the type of cake you could make. I have lots of cake pictures now, but I understand the dilemma of needing something to show.

I do think it's an excellent idea to use dummy cakes and design some of your own work for pictures. I think most customers really want to see you own work rather than someone else's that you claim you can do.

Good luck!

BTW, my DH and I visited the Netherlands a few years ago and were entirely enchanted by the country. You're a lucky woman to live there!! We're dying to go back some day!

Bluehue Posted 28 Jun 2009 , 4:17pm
post #17 of 25

I would like to see your website first please before you copy and paste any of my pictures (just incase you wanted to use any of mine.?
Please don't use mine until i hear from you.


I think it only appropriate that you PM the owners of pictures here, and give them your details before you go any further.

Then i have the choice of saying yes or no....as my cake pictures are also in my portfilio.

Thankyou
Bluehue

jlynnw Posted 28 Jun 2009 , 6:55pm
post #18 of 25

May I suggest you load a few of your pictures as well. Other people "might" be more willing if they see what you are capable of. I would really hate for you to have a picture that you believe you can do, have issues with it, and a client who is very upset that the work is not like the picture. It is the old catch 22, you want a job but need experience, but you need a a job to get that experience. Not that my work is all that, you can use it as long as you credit my work to me.

BlakesCakes Posted 28 Jun 2009 , 7:38pm
post #19 of 25

Welcome to Cake Central.

It's a very poor idea to post the work of others on your website, even as an "ideas gallery". Customers will ALWAYS assume that the works are yours, until told otherwise.

Many, many, many decorators get very upset when they run across their cake photos on another decorator's website. The borrower will be labeled a thief and will receive dozens of e-mails demanding that the photos be removed. It has made many a decorator have to take down their entire website.

If a client wants a particular type of cake, I merely e-mail them photos of "ideas", explaining that I haven't personally made these cakes, but that I can use certain details for my own interpretation. I tell them that I will NOT make an exact copy of another decorator's cake. I will, however, copy cakes that have been published in books.

I know that it's hard to be patient at times, but my advice is to only have photos of cakes that you've done (real or dummies).

That said, please do not use photos of any of my work unless you've e-mailed me first for permission.

Thanks & good luck.
Rae

TexasSugar Posted 28 Jun 2009 , 7:57pm
post #20 of 25

I have to say, thanks for asking, rather than just doing. Especially since pictures are copyrighted and the belong to the owner of said picture. It doesn't matter if that person borrowed someone else's idea, once they do it and take a picture of it the picture now belongs to them.

I personally don't think it is a good idea to put pictures of other peoples cakes on your site, and I would not want my cake pictures on anyone else's website. I agree with the idea of giving some links for ideas or to suggest doing an goggle image search for cake ideas.

The problem with using other pictures as "I could do something like this for you" is that it is really easy to say, "Hey yeah I could do that cake." But sometimes things aren't as easy in reality as they are in theory. We have the same thing with our own ideas. I can think of an idea that I want to do in cake, but it doesn't mean it will come out on the cake like I see it in my head. Same thing for basing a cake off someone else's cake idea as well.

A website, in my opinion is to showcase your cake creations, not the cake ideas. When I look at some one's personal cake page I want to know I am looking at their cakes that they have done. Because if I was looking for a cake I'd want to know what that person has done in the past and see examples of their work.

Have you thought about getting some dummy cakes and decorating them? There are some past posts that talk about how you can change and add on to a dummy cake so that you can get three or four different looking cakes from one dummy.

AKA_cupcakeshoppe Posted 29 Jun 2009 , 5:22am
post #21 of 25

I started a thread like this before and got the same responses. I was wondering what if your pictures were printed out and used in flyers instead of using them online? I'm not gonna, I've given up on this business but I just wonder what the consensus is in that situation?

jlynnw Posted 29 Jun 2009 , 1:06pm
post #22 of 25

AKA. say it itsn't so! You really aren't giving up, are you? Oh, how much you will miss it.

KathysCC Posted 29 Jun 2009 , 1:19pm
post #23 of 25

I am glad that you asked first.

No, it is never a good idea to use other people's work. The photos posted here belong to the people who uploaded them and you do not have permission to use them for your site.

Giving credit to the original owner is not the same as having permission.

FromScratch Posted 29 Jun 2009 , 6:25pm
post #24 of 25

Don't use any of mine please. I guess thanks for asking and not just doing it, but there are ways to get a protfolio of your own work going without having to bake 100 cakes. Get some dummies and do it that way. It's against the law to use pictures that aren't your without permission from each person, so make sure you do get that permission.

sara91 Posted 29 Jun 2009 , 7:56pm
post #25 of 25

Why don't you purchase some professional photos of cakes that are designed for this purpose?

Have a look at stock photo sites like www.istockphoto.com

You can use any of these quality photos for a very small fee (a few dollars) for your website and printed matter.

I would however only use them if you can actually create the same cakes.

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