Question: Cake Decorator Doesn't Bake Her Own Cakes?
Decorating By slopokesgirl Updated 28 May 2009 , 6:43pm by JanH
I dont' have the magazine in front of me, but there is an ad in Modern Baking magazine (industry magazine ... focuses mostly on traditional bakeries that sell cakes, cookies AND pastries, etal) .... the product promises to keep cakes fresh for 60 days.
Just FYI.....
I dont' have the magazine in front of me, but there is an ad in Modern Baking magazine (industry magazine ... focuses mostly on traditional bakeries that sell cakes, cookies AND pastries, etal) .... the product promises to keep cakes fresh for 60 days.
Just FYI.....
I saw that ad....Yuuuuuuck! Where's the vomit emoticon when you need it!?!?!?!
I dont' have the magazine in front of me, but there is an ad in Modern Baking magazine (industry magazine ... focuses mostly on traditional bakeries that sell cakes, cookies AND pastries, etal) .... the product promises to keep cakes fresh for 60 days.
Just FYI.....
I saw that ad....Yuuuuuuck! Where's the vomit emoticon when you need it!?!?!?!
Yeah but for a shop keeping baker this can be a very beautiful thing. Dude, lots of people use the stabilizers. Sure they're not for everyone but used properly it really helps against lost revenue from lost sales and tossing out your hard work and money for ingredients and wasted time. Geez oh Pete, 60 days sure is a looooong time though.
Ask the ice cream boys if they don't use the stabilizers and chemicals in there--boy can they churn out the goodies. I got to go to the World Pastry Forum in '07 and omg it was amazing--no one feared chemicals there. They use them to advantage. It's a thought.
This is a funny thread..because if you talk about cakes from scratch or boxed cakes people get upset about it..and this is no different...and I find that most people on here start with a boxed cake that is why is such a touchy subject. But do they tell their customers...NO.
And that goes to show you that must customers don't care if if frozen or fresh, from scratch or boxed.
You know what..you do whatever you need to do..frozen or not..and make that money.
Good luck!!
This is a funny thread..because if you talk about cakes from scratch or boxed cakes people get upset about it..and this is no different...and I find that most people on here start with a boxed cake that is why is such a touchy subject. But do they tell their customers...NO.
And that goes to show you that must customers don't care if if frozen or fresh, from scratch or boxed.
You know what..you do whatever you need to do..frozen or not..and make that money.
Good luck!!
Y'know I do both but I'm gonna get me some Jilk and then I can be a pure as the driven snow scratch baker.
I know I have issues. In another thread I detailed how I let my feelings get trounced on long ago by a highly attitudinal book writer. Her timing was killer. Really stunted my baking growth. Probably adds to the reasons why I manage a bookstore.
I probably need therapy. But I'll settle for some Jilk and then I can be a 100% scratch baker too. Except I will have the much preferred properties of a mix.
K8MEMPHIS
I do both too...and I love both from scratch and boxed..but most people on here get upset at that and is silly...a good cake is a good cake....A few months ago I went to see a bakery that was up for sale..and I went into the back and noticed the lady had boxed cakes on her shelf.
She had an enormous clientel..but was moving because her husband was relocated from his job out of the country...did the customers know they were boxed maybe not.
So my point is, that is this girl can't bake the cakes, but can decorate them, then what is the problem with buying frozen cakes. Customers are not going to ask, and if they do, tell them you made it.
But do they tell their customers...NO.
YES.
That's kind of a (insert your own negative adjective here) statement to make ... maybe that's why someone got upset in an earlier post about feeling the need to tell people "don't lie" about it.
Why do non-mix bakers ASSUME that mix bakers "lie" or "not tell" their clients? Are you ASSUMING there is some "shame" in being a mix baker ergo a mix baker MUST lie to cover their shame and sin?
When someone asks me if I bake from scratch, I flat out tell them, "You couldn't afford me if I baked from scratch. Like a lot of bakeries, I start with a mix and add my own stuff to it."
I wasn't going to jump in on this point, but when it's brought up in a couple of different forms in the same thread .....
This is why the scratch vs mix debate tends to get a little on the warm side .... 
Dude, one of my old boss's kept their Duncan Hines (boxes) in the cooler!!!! So no one would see them if someone wandered back in the kitchen. I am not by far the only weird one about mixes.
I don't like to tell that I use mixes not because I use mixes but because of the stigma because of the look down your nosedness I've personally encountered. Because it makes it feel like jr high again and once was hard enough huh? Because most cake civilians can't tell the difference they just deem it thier choice if they like it and the other kind if it sucks even if the opposite is true.
Really I should get therapy.
Hey, I sell paperback books too--they're not all hardbacks--this syndrome creeps in everywhere huh.
Indydeby
I use both, I PREFER from scratch, but for kids I do boxed. There is nothing wrong with that. However, if you are making a cake from a box, i feel that the price should reflect that.
I had posted a comment a few weeks ago about this..wanting to know if you will ask the customer if they prefer boxed or from scratch. But it seems that nonone wanted to talk about it. It was not to start something but it was a question about pricing.
Sorry if I offended anyone....definetly not my intention.
Hey, I sell paperback books too--they're not all hardbacks--this syndrome creeps in everywhere huh.
Oh! Oh! Oh! Let's start another one!
Are "self-published" books as good as "real" published books? I mean, if it was a really good book, then wouldn't the big book houses want to publish it? Does that make the writer not as good of a writer as a non-self-published writer? Are they "cheating" by publishing the book themselves? Was *I* cheated when I bought Paula Deen's first cookbook, which was self-published, that she sold on a rack in her restaurant?
Oh come on!! Let's pick on another industry that "cheats" out there!
If the convenience store sells long stem silk roses in clear plastic wrappers like they're real.
Knock off Crocs.
I mean knock off plastic shoes? And why are they so cavernous--I mean your foot's gotta be four inches deep to fit in there.
C'mon I can't think of any more--there's always scratch & mix.
When they say paper or plastic, I say surprise me.
Too many freaking decisions.
Indydeby
I use both, I PREFER from scratch, but for kids I do boxed. There is nothing wrong with that. However, if you are making a cake from a box, i feel that the price should reflect that.
Sorry if I offended anyone....definetly not my intention.
I make all my cakes from a box mix, and using wasc variations. Therefore, my cake is not just mix, eggs, and oil. I just a cake starting with a box mix that had 13 other ingredients in it. That definitely should be worth as much as a scratch cake in my eyes. Granted, cake mix is $1 a box, but I spend A LOT on all of the other ingredients in there! 
However, if you are making a cake from a box, i feel that the price should reflect that.
The flaw in that is thinking that the cost of ingredients is the only factor in cost/price. There have been too-many-to-mention threads in which the discussion was about the time and talent involved in decorating the cake; in which the discussion was about how new decorators should not undercut the current market, but as they get more experienced and better at their craft, their prices should go up.
But under the "she uses a box so she has to charge a cheap price" theory, when my rent or my insurance goes up, I'm not suppose to find ways to reduce my costs (buy bulk 50-lb mixes) but should raise my prices. But under your theory, I can't raise my prices because I use a mix. 
The value of a cake (or of anything) is whatever a person is willing to pay for it. To tell me my cakes should be priced cheaper because ONE of the ingredients is "premade' is ridiculous, close minded and a little unknowing about the business side of pricing cakes. ALL of the other ingredients should be factored in .... you know, ingredients like ovens, utilities, rent, insurance, delivery van, employee payroll, TIME AND TALENT, etc.
Indydeby
I use both, I PREFER from scratch, but for kids I do boxed. There is nothing wrong with that. However, if you are making a cake from a box, i feel that the price should reflect that.
Sorry if I offended anyone....definetly not my intention.
I make all my cakes from a box mix, and using wasc variations. Therefore, my cake is not just mix, eggs, and oil. I just a cake starting with a box mix that had 13 other ingredients in it. That definitely should be worth as much as a scratch cake in my eyes. Granted, cake mix is $1 a box, but I spend A LOT on all of the other ingredients in there!
This is what works for me when I use a mix. That Jilk stuff is pricey--by buying the cake mix and adding stuff to it we get the best of both worlds--we get the pricey stabilizers that make our lives easier and our products better at a price we can afford then we customize it with extra stuff. Way to go, PD!
You know, I'm rather nuetral on the "Big Debate," but I have done the math and for me, the difference between making a cake from scratch and doctoring a mix is shockingly similar. Some flavors mixes were cheaper (by a factor of 2 dollars at the most) whereas some scratch was cheaper (and yes, that is counting every ingredient). So no, I don't think there should be a price difference. You're still baking a tasty cake, regardless of HOW you bake it.
Knock off Crocs.
I mean knock off plastic shoes? And why are they so cavernous--I mean your foot's gotta be four inches deep to fit in there.
C'mon I can't think of any more--there's always scratch & mix.
When they say paper or plastic, I say surprise me.
Too many freaking decisions.
OK - I gotta mention that the cavernous shoes are actuall needed in my family. We have short, wide, FAT feet and it's hard to find shoes that are actually deep enough to fit - and they always end up being way too long as a result. Crocs may be ugly as sin, but they are comfortable and for the first time ever, my mother, my sisters, and I can all wear shoes that actually FIT!!
I have been a box mix baker for a while. I recently tried the 50 pound Pillsbury mix and it is the fluffiest cake I have ever had. My customers LOVE it!
To the OP...Sam's sells frozen sheet cakes that taste just fine. My other cake friend overcooked a cake and did not have time to bake another one. She purchased a box of frozen cakes from Sam's and decorated it. I also bought a box of them and tasted it and I could not tell a difference. By the way...the Sam's Club bucket icing tastes pretty good too in case you can't make your own icing either.
Don't get discouraged in your business...I would totally buy a cake from you even if you did not bake it!
Best of Luck!
Out of interest I just had a look at the WASC recipe to compare to the scratch white choc mud I make. I picked these as WASC seems to be the cake of choice here and by the sound of things is similar in taste, texture and appearance to the WCMC (white choc mud cake - see what I did there 
)
Number of ingredients: 8 in each (a little surprised to find the WASC doesn't actually contain any almonds...)
Method: WASC mix in kitchenaid, WCMC melt a few ingredients in pan or microwave, mix all together in bowl with metal whisk.
Time to prepare: not much in it, 5-10 mins each?
Cost: again not much in it, WCMC can either be made with expensive choc or choc melts so you can cut the costs if you want to.
So, if it costs the same and your time/labour is the same and the cakes are pretty much the same, it should be the same price for the customer shouldn't it? If the customer tastes it, likes it and has their questions answered honestly (I believe it is up to the customer to ask questions if they have a problem with box mix, artificial ingredients etc; it is the bakers responsibility to answer those questions honestly) then who cares whether it is scratch or not?
So, if it costs the same and your time/labour is the same and the cakes are pretty much the same, it should be the same price for the customer shouldn't it? If the customer tastes it, likes it and has their questions answered honestly (I believe it is up to the customer to ask questions if they have a problem with box mix, artificial ingredients etc; it is the bakers responsibility to answer those questions honestly) then who cares whether it is scratch or not?
This is my point...Who cares if you use mixes or not? Sometimes the customers do. That's why they ask, and that's why you should be HONEST and tell them if they do ask. If they don't ask they don't care, but if they do ask tell them.
Then you can go away and bake your cakes to your heart's content, knowing that you've been honest with your customers.
So, if it costs the same and your time/labour is the same and the cakes are pretty much the same, it should be the same price for the customer shouldn't it? If the customer tastes it, likes it and has their questions answered honestly (I believe it is up to the customer to ask questions if they have a problem with box mix, artificial ingredients etc; it is the bakers responsibility to answer those questions honestly) then who cares whether it is scratch or not?
This is my point...Who cares if you use mixes or not? Sometimes the customers do. That's why they ask, and that's why you should be HONEST and tell them if they do ask. If they don't ask they don't care, but if they do ask tell them.
Then you can go away and bake your cakes to your heart's content, knowing that you've been honest with your customers.
I totally get your points.
I understand where you're coming from and I have a further question.
What do we do with the stigma of the mixes? Because the customers that would care specifically about a mix (not for health reasons) would be the ones who have the prejudice. And also it's why we get all huff & puff at different times too--it's a hot topic because there's more to it under the surface. It's like a jr high thing or something.
A similar prejudice is illustrated in The CakeBible about her brother's substitute wedding cake "a hulking white baroque number wtih insipid cupid pillars". Rose is a fine baker and she is more than entitled to her opinion --I'm just pointing to that for the in black and white illustration of the stigma, the put down. There's others but that one is convenient.
Plus my old boss with her cakemixaphobia plus lots of folks disguise the fact of using a mix. I'm not talking about the 'to lie or not to lie' I'm talking about the stigma, the prejudice.
So do you feel if we just declare it often and loud so to speak the stigma goes away? Maybe so.
Is it not intriguing that I can get the $50 stabilizer and make a for real scratch cake declare every ingredient and it's in truth the same as a mix.
For example a possible resolution would be to--for as many people as possible --to agree to myth busting this mix versus scratch stigma.
That in fact Twinkies are made from scratch.
That the ingredients in a mix are actually available to purchase and combine into a scratch cake for the same fluffy long shelf life results.
Not to allow anyone's product to continue to be thought of as better or worse on the strength of a myth--scratch or mix --but to make everyone's product shine by the value of it's own individual merit.
edited for clarity
I think the point is to do what you want, but if someone who's buying something from you asks what they're buying, you should tell them the truth. That's it. That's what the OP wanted to know.
We can talk in circles for the next ten years, but as long as mix bakers don't want to say that they use mixes the "stigma" will exist. If you have a good mix cake product and you don't want to tell people that you use a mix, you're perpetuating the stigma.
Just answer the question if someone asks you.
... I also don't add artificial flavors or added trans fats, like they have in boxed mixes, even the ones that say "no preservatives" on the labels....
Just in the sense of full disclosure my lonely little box of preservative free classic white cake Duncan Hinies (sic) is also trans fat free. Not to mention zero cholesterol.
It does have natural and artificial flavor.
classic white cake Duncan Hinies (sic) .
Ahhahahahahahah! I hope you misspelled that on purpose, but it doesn't do the promotion of cake mixes as tasting good any favors! 
...We can talk in circles for the next ten years, but as long as mix bakers don't want to say that they use mixes the "stigma" will exist. If you have a good mix cake product and you don't want to tell people that you use a mix, you're perpetuating the stigma...
Wonder what the scratch makers could say to help dissipate the stigma, illuminate the truth and bust the myth.
Since we're all in this together yes?
classic white cake Duncan Hinies (sic) .
Ahhahahahahahah! I hope you misspelled that on purpose, but it doesn't do the promotion of cake mixes as tasting good any favors!
Mirriam Webster again:
Main Entry: sic
: intentionally so written used after a printed word or passage to indicate that it is intended exactly as printed or to indicate that it exactly reproduces an original <said he seed [sic] it all>
Well, I don't like cake mixes, so that's my preference. I don't agree that adding unnecessary chemicals for binders/additives/extenders is the same as baking from scratch, so I don't agree with you that there is a "myth." There is a stigma, which is perpetuated every time a mix user pretends that they don't use a cake mix. A stigma and a myth are two different things.
Like I said, if a customer likes your cake mix cake then that's all you need to know, but if they ask whether you use a mix or not, tell the truth.
Yes, I know what "sic" means. With the two options available, is it spelled like that on the box, or did you deliberately misspell it? Neither would make sense to me, given your point of view toward cake mixes.
Yes, I know what "sic" means. With the two options available, is it spelled like that on the box, or did you deliberately misspell it? Neither would make sense to me, given your point of view toward cake mixes.
Interesting. Actually my point of view toward scratch is the more important piece of my point of view.
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...I don't agree that adding unnecessary chemicals for binders/additives/extenders is the same as baking from scratch, so I don't agree with you that there is a "myth." There is a stigma, which is perpetuated every time a mix user pretends that they don't use a cake mix. A stigma and a myth are two different things.
Like I said, if a customer likes your cake mix cake then that's all you need to know, but if they ask whether you use a mix or not, tell the truth.
So if I use Jilk emusifier in my cake made of flour and eggs and sugar and butter and vanilla then it's not scratch?
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