Does everyone use butter in their buttercream?

Decorating By The_Sugar_Fairy Updated 2 Apr 2009 , 4:00am by tonedna

Arriva Posted 30 Mar 2009 , 9:49pm
post #61 of 112

Sugarshack, I use your recipe and get rave reviews. It is delicious.

BakingGirl Posted 30 Mar 2009 , 9:54pm
post #62 of 112

I think I agree with you Sharon that you are not misleading people by calling it buttercream when it contains shortening. As you say, it depends on what people expect. I am only butting here because at the core of this discussion lies my problem. Personally I loathe shortening, for me it is more like phobia. Stupid, I know. I am not a big fan of powdered sugar type of buttercreams because I did not grow up with it, but rather with the European meringue based buttercreams. I am a big fan of your cakes and your glass smooth icing but know that your technique is based on PS type of buttercream. Do you have any plans on doing a DVD on getting smooth IMBC? Since you say in your post you don't like IMBC I am guessing not, but here is to hoping! Would getting your DVD which covers your smoothing techniques be any good in getting my IMBC smoother?

Wesha Posted 30 Mar 2009 , 9:59pm
post #63 of 112
Quote:
Originally Posted by sugarshack

Quote:
Originally Posted by timhenk

I'm with all of you who feel that BUTTERcream should be made with real butter. If you do not use butter, you are being less than honest with your customers by calling it buttercream.

...



I am going to respectfully disagree and hope I don't start a war, but ....


my recipe... and all standard icing recipes down here in the New Orleans area where I live are called "buttercream" , and very few have butter in them, including the major bakeries.

I know the authentic "term" buttercream implies butter. But some of the nomaenclature can be cultural and local. When you say Buttercream down here where I live, everybody knows and expects that it will be a shortening based decorator icing. This is where I disagree that we are misdleading people. They know exaclty what they are getting when we use that term.

We have different dialects all over the country and use different words for the same thing: ie you may say pop, I say soda. That is not the best example but you get the idea.

Buttercream may not be "technically" and "officially" the proper name for our kind of icing all over the country, but it is the common name for what we all use, purchase, consume and expect down here in our area. There is no deception involved. And I advertise my icing as buttercream proudly, and without shame. Because where I live, it is buttercream.

Where it started and how it got its roots I have no idea. Be it our hot humid climate, or who knows what.... but this is what is reginally done and accepted down here. And to be quite honest, I am a little frustrated with the negative connotations that are often implied towards those of us that use an all shortening icing. Everyone has different tastes, and I respect that. I don't like meringue buttercreams cuz they taste like pure butter to me, but I would never ever say a bad or word about that kind of icing or those that use it. It's just personal preference.

Many of us use all shortening icing because that is what our customers love and ask for, and we are not second class decorators nor dishonest because we use that type of icing. Our cakes are just as beautiful and delicious as any other type. Just different.

When I say buttercream, and my customers get all shortening, they were in fact not mislead nor dissapointed. they got exaclty what they wanted and expected.

Anyway, I needed to get the off my chest and I hope I did not offend. But I felt the need to speak up for us shortening buttercream gals, whose icings are just as good and delicious as any other kind, just different. And also that our icing is not incorrectly named. Not where I live anyway.

Thank you.

Happy caking to all!




Thanks Sugar Shack. You said it perfectly and BTW, I love your Buttercream Video that I got a couple of weeks ago.

Benisha

GipsyGourmet Posted 30 Mar 2009 , 9:59pm
post #64 of 112

I agree with Sharon, I use SugarShack's buttercream recipe and it is wonderful, I've never had a complaint. With the humdity we have in the South (MS), real butter in your buttercream icing is, in my opinion, a receipe for diaster! Again, it's strictly a personal preference and I do not feel that I'm being dishonest with my clients in the least.

Gayla

sugarshack Posted 30 Mar 2009 , 10:01pm
post #65 of 112

hey Baking girl!

That is my point right on. I prob don't care for IMBC because I grew up with the shortening kind just like you did the opposite! It's culture, customs, and personal preference! No one icing is better or more right that the other. They are all equally worthy and good; just different.

And as far as the name, again I just reiterate that "buttercream" is very much a correct and proper name for that type of icing down here where I am.

Since I don't use IMBC or SMBC I doubt I will do a video on it, LOL. And there are many experts here on CC on smoothing it. What I have read is you can use the bench scraper to get the sides as smooth as you can, chill the cake firm (butter will firm up great), then go back with a hot scraper to refine the smoothing on the chilled cake. That is all I know from reading, and obviously have never done it!

HTH

BakingGirl Posted 30 Mar 2009 , 10:11pm
post #66 of 112

Oh, go on Sharon - you know you want to IMBC really!!! Thanks for the tips, they are in the region of what I try to do. I don't often do a purely bc decorated cake anymore, simply because I am perfectionist and if it is not perfect I get annoyed. So I stick to fondant mostly which is the medium I am most comfortable with. Every now and again I get my tips out and torture myself with a bit of BC, in fact I must be about due for a BC cake soon.

Kiddiekakes Posted 30 Mar 2009 , 10:14pm
post #67 of 112
Quote:
Originally Posted by timhenk

I'm with all of you who feel that BUTTERcream should be made with real butter. If you do not use butter, you are being less than honest with your customers by calling it buttercream.





I totally agree with Sharon....I am not deceiving my customers by any means just because my Buttercream is shortening based.They don't really care as long as it looks good and tastes good.It is a personal preference!I use WBH exclusively...many decoraters hate it...my customers love it and come to expect it! I don't care for it but I do like that it is not sweet!!


Laurel thumbs_up.gif

indydebi Posted 30 Mar 2009 , 11:03pm
post #68 of 112
Quote:
Originally Posted by sweetpea223

Me too! can't stand the taste of lard or margarine on my cake. I could definitely taste the difference of real buttercream. One wedding I attended had lard on their icing for the wedding cake. Yeah, the cake looked good, but I couldn't even eat it!




Do you mean real "lard" or are you calling vegetable shortening (Crisco) "lard"? icon_confused.gif

ThisNameInUse Posted 30 Mar 2009 , 11:10pm
post #69 of 112

Ice cream doesn't have ice in it... <juss sayin'> detective.gif
I'm a newbie at this, and I've been trying a lot of different icing recipes.

So far, my favorite flavor and consistancy is one that has butter and crisco in it. It tastes good, and I have the hips to prove it. icon_biggrin.gif
And let's face it, whether you are eating a stick of butter or a stick of crisco, they're both not very healthy for you. shhh.gif

cakelady31 Posted 30 Mar 2009 , 11:27pm
post #70 of 112

yup, I use half butter, half shortening in mine. Although the bakery in which I worked at has buckets of old fashioned buttercream , which by the way is all shortening based. go figure. icon_rolleyes.gif

sweetpea223 Posted 30 Mar 2009 , 11:51pm
post #71 of 112
Quote:
Originally Posted by indydebi

Quote:
Originally Posted by sweetpea223

Me too! can't stand the taste of lard or margarine on my cake. I could definitely taste the difference of real buttercream. One wedding I attended had lard on their icing for the wedding cake. Yeah, the cake looked good, but I couldn't even eat it!



Do you mean real "lard" or are you calling vegetable shortening (Crisco) "lard"? icon_confused.gif




I know indydebi... I just didn't want to name brands...but in any case where I grew up white shortening for me is lard. The taste on that cake is what I remember very well...so in my palate, I may not be able to distinguish the difference because it's what comes to my mind. Butter icing is what almost everyone in the Philippines love...altho occasionally there are boiled icings that will be frosted on cakes. I know, a tropical country yet everyone loves butter icing on their cakes. Next time I'll try to taste the difference of Crisco and lard. Thanks Indydebi!

indydebi Posted 31 Mar 2009 , 12:05am
post #72 of 112
Quote:
Originally Posted by sweetpea223

I know indydebi.....but in any case where I grew up white shortening for me is lard.




oh I know EXACTLY what you mean. When I was growing up, any "yellow stick of fat" was called butter. I've shared this story before, but I asked my Sysco rep for a price on butter and she came back with $3+ a pound. I told her I can get it for 59 cents a walmart. She said, "for BUTTER???"

I said, "Ohhhhhhhhh! When I said "butter", you thought I meant BUTTER!!!!" icon_lol.gif

flourbud Posted 31 Mar 2009 , 12:08am
post #73 of 112

OK, I am a regular visitor to CC, I know THAT acronym, BUT it's hard to understand postings when you aren't up on the abbreviations everyone is using. WBH IMBC SMBC ..... H E L P M E ANyone else out there confused???

sweetpea223 Posted 31 Mar 2009 , 12:16am
post #74 of 112
Quote:
Originally Posted by flourbud

OK, I am a regular visitor to CC, I know THAT acronym, BUT it's hard to understand postings when you aren't up on the abbreviations everyone is using. WBH IMBC SMBC ..... H E L P M E ANyone else out there confused???




IMBC = Italian Meringue Buttercream
SMBC = Swiss Meringue Buttercream

WBH = that I'm stumped.


INDYDEBI.... that is so funny! wish I had stories like that to tell... icon_lol.gif

BakingGirl Posted 31 Mar 2009 , 12:25am
post #75 of 112

WBH, I am guessing the Whimsical BakeHouse. Great recipe and decorating book. Google it and have a look, it is a keeper!

Deb_ Posted 31 Mar 2009 , 12:41am
post #76 of 112

Here you go flourbud, click this link and all the acronyms are there for you!

http://www.cakecentral.com/cake-decorating-ftopict-2926.html

In my area when we say butter cream we mean icing made with butter. The shortening based icings are referred to as "bakery icing". icon_smile.gif

flourbud Posted 31 Mar 2009 , 3:41am
post #77 of 112

THANKS FOR THE DICTIONARY

timhenk Posted 31 Mar 2009 , 4:15am
post #78 of 112

Sorry, I didn't mean to pick a fight. Nor did I intend to insult anyone, or disrespect anyone. If I did any of the above, I apologize.

If your customers like shortening-based icings, then by all means you should make them and sell them. I have no problem with that. If you like the flavor and consistency, I have no problem with that either. I'm not judging you for what you choose to make and/or sell.

But if I ordered a buttercream cake from somewhere and got an all-shortening icing, I'd be upset. If somethinng contains no butter, you shouldn't call it buttercream. It's just truth in labeling, in my opinion. Similar to how large producers cannot call their candies "chocolate" if it doesn't contiain chocolate, they have to say "chocolatey" or chocolate flavored.

I understand all of your arguements, I just respectfully disagree.

I guess I'm just a butter snob!

indydebi Posted 31 Mar 2009 , 5:04am
post #79 of 112
Quote:
Originally Posted by timhenk

But if I ordered a buttercream cake from somewhere and got an all-shortening icing, I'd be upset. If somethinng contains no butter, you shouldn't call it buttercream.




But when it's pretty much the industry standard to call it that, I can't see how someone can blame the cake maker because the customer doesn't understand the industry terminology? As someone said, ice cream doesnt' have ice in it. Coke no longer has cocaine in it, but it's still called coke. And we still say "dial a phone" even tho' I haven't seen a "dial" phone in years.

Popcorn in theaters hasn't had real butter on it in decades (and I worked in a theater decades ago), but we still order and call it "buttered" popcorn.

ANd red velvet cake doesnt' have any velvet in it. icon_biggrin.gif
I looked up some stuff earlier today re: where the name buttercream came from and pretty much everything I saw said it had butter or "other fat", so it appears it's ok to call non-butter icing "buttercream".

Anyone is welcome to disagree with it, but I can't see how you can get upset with it when it's the industry accepted terminology.

sugarshack Posted 31 Mar 2009 , 6:07am
post #80 of 112

THANK YOU Indydebi.

I could kiss you right now. That was my point, exaclty! thumbs_up.gif






ETA: Timhenk: nothing I wrote in this thread was directed to any one poster or person. It has just been such a debate for so long and I had to air my point of view in general. It was not directed at you personally and no offense taken. icon_smile.gif

ThisNameInUse Posted 31 Mar 2009 , 11:20am
post #81 of 112

Maybe it's called buttercream because it's creamy and spreads like butter!

icon_razz.gif

momma28 Posted 31 Mar 2009 , 11:43am
post #82 of 112

I agree with all those who said it aint BUTTERcream without BUTTER. I would never use margarine (I did try for cost and even posted a question about it some time ago but couldnt bring myself to do it)

Just a note. Did you know that if you leave a stick of margarine near an ant hill the ants wont even eat it? Its true. They will eat butter but not margarine hmmmmm if even the ants wont eat it what does taht say about it LOL

And as far as shortening goes, because it melts at a higher temp it stays greasy in your mouth and I simply cannot tolerate it. I cannot get past that no matter how much the recipe is recommended.

flourbud Posted 31 Mar 2009 , 12:32pm
post #83 of 112

I can understand both sides of this debate, but as far as this being an "industry standard"...well maybe only those "in the industry" know that. Until I began cake decorating courses I had no idea that you could make icing with all shortening and call it buttercream. I had ordered buttercream icing on cakes for many years from the grocery store and bakeries and always thought I was getting a butter icing, like the kind my mother used to make. But I couldn't understand why it was tasteless and so greasy on the palate. I'm 55 and just discovered this. So I think that this term the industry uses is misleading to the average person.

tonedna Posted 31 Mar 2009 , 1:01pm
post #84 of 112

I agree with Sharon and Indydeby.. More than that, buttercream likes and dislikes change from person to person. Some like the half ratio half butter( Im one of those), but some people hate the feeling of pure butter on their mouths.
I say to each it's own.

As for wilton..
Wilton recipe is as basic as it can be. Why they dont use butter for their basic class???? Well simple....try working with the same butter based icing for 2 hours and you will find a soupy mess!

Wilton teaches the basics so not only buttercream but decorations, so people can go on their own and find their own styles.

Most of the recipes you find around have the same basic ingredients. Some are lighter than other ones. None of them are bad, they are just meant for those tastebuds that enjoy them.


Edna icon_biggrin.gif

flourbud Posted 31 Mar 2009 , 1:33pm
post #85 of 112

well said, Edna

indydebi Posted 31 Mar 2009 , 1:55pm
post #86 of 112
Quote:
Originally Posted by flourbud

Until I began cake decorating courses I had no idea that you could make icing with all shortening and call it buttercream.



Oh that's funny because when my friend gave me my crisco-based icing recipe, she told me it was "wedding cake icing". For years (decades!) I thought that was the ONLY icing ever used on a wedding cake. I used to tell people all the time "There is no butter in buttercream." I had no idea icing was EVER made with butter! icon_lol.gif

PinkZiab Posted 31 Mar 2009 , 2:08pm
post #87 of 112
Quote:
Originally Posted by indydebi

Popcorn in theaters hasn't had real butter on it in decades (and I worked in a theater decades ago), but we still order and call it "buttered" popcorn.




Not to split hairs, but the government deemed they couldn't legally do that anymore, so many large theater chains now ask if you would like "topping" on your popcorn lol

mellee Posted 31 Mar 2009 , 2:30pm
post #88 of 112

Yeah, but the government also stopped theaters and microwave popcorn producers from using "nasty" coconut and palm kernel oils as the base for their popping oil because of their saturated fat content. Instead they were told to use vegetable shortening. All of a sudden vegetable shortening became bad because of transfats, and now people are back to using "natural" coconut and palm kernel oils and saying why did we ever stop??!!

I absolutely ADORE the taste of butter and frequently eat it alone. I even make my own sometimes. I cook with it. But my buttercream recipe is ALL vegetable shortening. It just plain old works better. Come to think of it, there's no cream in my buttercream recipe either.

Oh well. All's well that ends well. icon_smile.gif

sugarshack Posted 31 Mar 2009 , 10:12pm
post #89 of 112

Ok, you guys have convinced me. thumbs_up.gif
I have decided to chnage the name of my recipe to:

Sharon's Crusting Sweetexmate



J/K. I still stand by my previous post. Just being silly. icon_eek.gif

tonedna Posted 1 Apr 2009 , 1:15am
post #90 of 112
Quote:
Originally Posted by mellee



I absolutely ADORE the taste of butter and frequently eat it alone.




icon_surprised.gifEdna icon_biggrin.gif

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