Question For Those Who Bake And Sell From Home

Business By mommaroxy Updated 29 Nov 2014 , 4:52pm by mls2604

kokopuff Posted 6 Nov 2008 , 5:52pm
post #151 of 223

Sorry I skipped a few post.Are you saying these rules apply to all of Ky or just the Louisville?I live further south in a rural area.

__Jamie__ Posted 6 Nov 2008 , 6:03pm
post #152 of 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by Biabeke

I read all of the posts and I was almost discouraged. Oh well, I refuse to be dicouraged! Famous cake makers like Sylvia Weinstock and Ron Ben-Israel started very small. It would be preposterous for someone to just open a business right from the beginning. For those of you who are not legal yet, be discreet and secure enough clients before becoming legal.





It can be discouraging. But I can't help but think of the cake decorators in my area that are doing it the right way, and how I intend to become a legitimate businees owner myself. I am not going to do things that put my family at risk, whether it be fines from the IRS or getting sued by someone who choked on a nut from my date bread.

I am going to practice on family members, keep myself busy with decorating competitions, and SAVE money! Not sneak around, selling under the table, hoping not to get caught. What kind of respect does that earn from the gals/guys who are operating legitimately?

indydebi Posted 6 Nov 2008 , 6:45pm
post #153 of 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by leahs

Yeah, good luck with that strategy. I was operating on a "limited license" and got caught the second week. Had to get the full catering license immediately. And I was not advertising. The Health Department inspectors live and work in the community too.




I had a catering friend who was busted 30 days after putting up her website .... the inspectors who knocked on her front door told her their boss told them to start scouring the internet and "....shut down the home caterers/bakers".

A flyer or biz card is just as revealing as a website. You never know who was invited to that baby shower.

__Jamie__ Posted 6 Nov 2008 , 6:46pm
post #154 of 223

I just wonder how the conversation would go if two bakers/decorators met up at a party or something and started talking cakes. One is licensed, the other is not. When would it turn sour?

Kitagrl Posted 6 Nov 2008 , 6:47pm
post #155 of 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by leahs

Yeah, good luck with that strategy. I was operating on a "limited license" and got caught the second week. Had to get the full catering license immediately. And I was not advertising. The Health Department inspectors live and work in the community too.




It depends on the state too...if the laws are easier in the state, then its going to be easier to bake nonlicensed for awhile.

Here in PA we only answer to the Dept of Ag and they are so busy they aren't going to run after somebody baking out of home, small scale.

I'm licensed...but I did it nonlicensed for awhile first.

__Jamie__ Posted 6 Nov 2008 , 6:53pm
post #156 of 223

[/quote]Here in PA we only answer to the Dept of Ag and they are so busy they aren't going to run after somebody baking out of home, small scale.[/quote]


And this is where integrity and honesty have to be up front and in full force, no? I couldn't operate on the basis of "they are just too busy to catch me". With my luck, someone I pissed off in high school is probably the inspector for our health department and would love to come pay me a visit! icon_lol.gif

leah_s Posted 6 Nov 2008 , 7:12pm
post #157 of 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by kokopuff

Sorry I skipped a few post.Are you saying these rules apply to all of Ky or just the Louisville?I live further south in a rural area.




Other than my one sentence that references Jefferson county, all that other stuff applies to the entire state.

There is a third category but only applies to you if you are a farm.

kokopuff Posted 6 Nov 2008 , 7:23pm
post #158 of 223

No, I do not have a farm.One less thing to worry about I guess.So do I have to get a license first or have my kitchen inspected first?I want to be legit but I am confussed as to where I should begin.Any suggestions would be appreciated.Thank you!

aundrea Posted 6 Nov 2008 , 7:37pm
post #159 of 223

hi, just jumping in. i know this is such a touchy subject. and i dont want to add to the confusion but i do have a question. (i dont sell my cakes. i only do cakes and baking as a hobby and share with my friends/family/co-workers.)
unlicensed bakers are worried if someone chokes, or is allergic to their cakes (baked goods) and being sued etc.
does anyone know if i baked and served a cake for my, say grandaughters b-day party, and that happened could i be sued?
or i baked the cake for my daughter to bring to her friends party. what would happen then? or a co-worker got sick because my eggs were bad?
is it because no money has been exchanged that legal action can not take place. or can it?
just curious???
im sure laws are different in every state (im in connecticut) but that common concern must be everywhere???

kansaswolf Posted 6 Nov 2008 , 7:45pm
post #160 of 223

Ooh, and in a state (Like Iowa, where I am) with cottage food laws (selling foods that don't need refrigeration, like at a farmer's market, as mentioned before), is it legal to advertise your goods for sale if you're not licensed? I'm looking to get my home kitchen licensed, but I rent my house, so I'm not sure yet how that will affect me. Could I advertise before getting licensed under said cottage food laws?

(I'm also looking at renting space at a church or something, but wondered at the legality of advertising, since I can't seem to find any info on that)

Mike1394 Posted 6 Nov 2008 , 7:53pm
post #161 of 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by aundrea

hi, just jumping in. i know this is such a touchy subject. and i dont want to add to the confusion but i do have a question. (i dont sell my cakes. i only do cakes and baking as a hobby and share with my friends/family/co-workers.)
unlicensed bakers are worried if someone chokes, or is allergic to their cakes (baked goods) and being sued etc.
does anyone know if i baked and served a cake for my, say grandaughters b-day party, and that happened could i be sued?
or i baked the cake for my daughter to bring to her friends party. what would happen then? or a co-worker got sick because my eggs were bad?
is it because no money has been exchanged that legal action can not take place. or can it?
just curious???
im sure laws are different in every state (im in connecticut) but that common concern must be everywhere???




The money exchange has nothing to do whether, or not you get sued. Is your granddaughter going to sue you. I would think not. If I got sick from a coworker I wouldn't sue, but you can't tell with people these days.

Mike

kimmypooh79 Posted 6 Nov 2008 , 7:58pm
post #162 of 223

FOR TN "IN HOME" BAKERS

http://tennessee.gov/sos/rules/0080/0080-04/0080-04-11.pdf

I found the info we need to know to have a legit "in home" bakery.

leah_s Posted 6 Nov 2008 , 8:19pm
post #163 of 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by kokopuff

No, I do not have a farm.One less thing to worry about I guess.So do I have to get a license first or have my kitchen inspected first?I want to be legit but I am confussed as to where I should begin.Any suggestions would be appreciated.Thank you!




The first thing to do is check zoning and subdivision deed restrictions. Not being permitted to have a business use will be the first thing to shut you down.

Second, call your local Health Department, or write to the nice people in Frankfort

Cabinet for Human Resources
Department for Health Services
Food & Cosmetics Branch
275 East Main Street
Frankfort, KY 40621

and ask for a free copy of the Kentucky's Food Establishment Act and State Retail Food Code.

Heck you might even find it online somewhere.

You will likely have a preliminary visit from an Inspector, because I'd be pretty surprised if your home kitchen already met the code, but who knows. Then you'll probably take your class, pass the test, then have your inspection for real.

Then incorporate, register for resale cert and biz name, and buy insurance.

aundrea Posted 6 Nov 2008 , 8:24pm
post #164 of 223

mike, i didnt mean my grandaughter would sue me. i ment the parents etc.
i do agree that too many people are sue happy. my daughter works for an attorney, there is never a shortage.
i guess my curiosity was or my question is,
if my cake is at a party, and someone gets sick (or whatever!)
does it matter if my cake was paid for.
maybe that is more of a legal question. but with all the expirienced people here i just thought i would ask.
even more of a reason for me not to do a home business!
well that and lack of talent!!! (haha)
...........practice, practice, practice!!!

ziggytarheel Posted 6 Nov 2008 , 8:29pm
post #165 of 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by aundrea

mike, i didnt mean my grandaughter would sue me. i ment the parents etc.
i do agree that too many people are sue happy. my daughter works for an attorney, there is never a shortage.
i guess my curiosity was or my question is,
if my cake is at a party, and someone gets sick (or whatever!)
does it matter if my cake was paid for.
maybe that is more of a legal question. but with all the expirienced people here i just thought i would ask.
even more of a reason for me not to do a home business!
well that and lack of talent!!! (haha)
...........practice, practice, practice!!!




If you aren't a business, your homeowner's insurance would be your first option to try in this situation. Liability coverage extends from that to certain situations.

kendi25 Posted 6 Nov 2008 , 9:21pm
post #166 of 223

Ok, Why can't we just all get along? icon_sad.gif
No need for all this...... we are all cake lovers, and, I love this place. Too often we entertain issues that really aren't CRUCIAL
This is my take on this whole conversation. We all break the law at some point. We all have.
Be it a:
parking ticket
drink and drive, etc. or a simple thing like running a red light or overtaking in a no pass zone. Or even driving over the speed limit. Because we were not caught doesn't make it ok. So, to say that if anyone of us have never done anything wrong - we can seat and judge each other.
With this economical crisis- I think 89% of us can't just open a business, And even if we wanted to banks don't want to loan out money. I am a lic. home baker/ caterer. But reality is this.
I would just encourage just do what you have to, be VERY careful about it. At least you know what? You are not out robbing people for $. Life must go on, and the bills have to be paid. I will never knock someone that is trying.
Where I am from (originally) we believe in helping others. In the USA every man is to himself. I will not turn in anyone trying to make a life for themselves.
I think that if a CC member really did turn in someone in TN for baking from home, they ought to be ashamed of themselves. That was a very low thing to do to a fellow human. What is the relevance?
You are a business they are not, is this what this place is becoming now? There is enough for everyone out there.
Please, let's just all get along. I do not want to see us argue about home vs business bakers when there are people starving, homeless, ill right here who don't even have anyone or anything.
Everyone, enjoy baking cake, and, let's all get along.

Happy Caking

UltimateCakes Posted 6 Nov 2008 , 9:45pm
post #167 of 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by kendi25

Ok, Why can't we just all get along? icon_sad.gif
No need for all this...... we are all cake lovers, and, I love this place. Too often we entertain issues that really aren't CRUCIAL
This is my take on this whole conversation. We all break the law at some point. We all have.
Be it a:
parking ticket
drink and drive, etc. or a simple thing like running a red light or overtaking in a no pass zone. Or even driving over the speed limit. Because we were not caught doesn't make it ok. So, to say that if anyone of us have never done anything wrong - we can seat and judge each other.
With this economical crisis- I think 89% of us can't just open a business, And even if we wanted to banks don't want to loan out money. I am a lic. home baker/ caterer. But reality is this.
I would just encourage just do what you have to, be VERY careful about it. At least you know what? You are not out robbing people for $. Life must go on, and the bills have to be paid. I will never knock someone that is trying.
Where I am from (originally) we believe in helping others. In the USA every man is to himself. I will not turn in anyone trying to make a life for themselves.
I think that if a CC member really did turn in someone in TN for baking from home, they ought to be ashamed of themselves. That was a very low thing to do to a fellow human. What is the relevance?
You are a business they are not, is this what this place is becoming now? There is enough for everyone out there.
Please, let's just all get along. I do not want to see us argue about home vs business bakers when there are people starving, homeless, ill right here who don't even have anyone or anything.
Everyone, enjoy baking cake, and, let's all get along.

Happy Caking




This is the most intelligent thing I have read in years. Absolutely Brilliant! icon_biggrin.gif

__Jamie__ Posted 6 Nov 2008 , 9:53pm
post #168 of 223

Well, happy flowers and cute puppy kittens aside, Kendi, this is extremely important information that is being discussed. A business is a business, and someone who operates a business illegally is breaking the law!

And, I don't have a problem with anyone turning anyone else in. Why should I tolerate an unlicensed baker that operates out of her home down the street from me, who steals my clients because she can get away with charging less because she doesn't have any overhead?

__Jamie__ Posted 6 Nov 2008 , 10:00pm
post #169 of 223

I didn't need to make that flowers and puppy comment. I could have made my point without that. I apologize. icon_smile.gif

UltimateCakes Posted 6 Nov 2008 , 10:11pm
post #170 of 223

uh-oh! Here we go again! icon_sad.gif

gr8cakemaker Posted 6 Nov 2008 , 10:16pm
post #171 of 223

WOW, this forum is intense. but I do have to agree that you should be licensed. Im not judging, however for me, I am a licensed home baker who had to fork out a good amount of money for licensing and startup fees. I know someone who bakes from home and her husband is a caterer and they are NOT licensed. Its frustrating to hear of people like this since I have worked so hard to become a legal business! The woman charges very little for her cakes since she does not have any overhead.

I do sympathize with the home bakers who are just starting and do not have a license. I was there too. I donated alot of cakes to different events through people I knew or through the grapevine sort of things...but accepted NO MONEY. I then got my license and started charging for cakes. It takes time to get your name out there, it wont happen over night, but once you get your license the free advertising and marketing strategies are endless. Without a license you would only be able to use word of mouth.

I wish you all good luck with your businesses and happy caking!

UltimateCakes Posted 6 Nov 2008 , 10:22pm
post #172 of 223

Could do more than word of mouth - but it IS a big risk. BIG risk=BIG reward? That's for you to decide. LOL

__Jamie__ Posted 6 Nov 2008 , 10:22pm
post #173 of 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by gr8cakemaker

I wish you all good luck with your businesses and happy caking!


I second that!

indydebi Posted 6 Nov 2008 , 10:30pm
post #174 of 223

Kendi, I don't think this is turning into an "us against them" thread .... I believe this thread is asking for actual info on how to get this legal thing accomplished, and there was a post that was absolutely wrong in it's info, so it was corrected with factual and accurate info for that state. I didn't read it as a slam against any home baker .... but when people ask for accurate info ..... and they get it .... I can't see why anyone should be upset over the info that is being shared, based on whether they like the facts or reality or not.

Mike1394 Posted 6 Nov 2008 , 11:19pm
post #175 of 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by indydebi

Kendi, I don't think this is turning into an "us against them" thread .... I believe this thread is asking for actual info on how to get this legal thing accomplished, and there was a post that was absolutely wrong in it's info, so it was corrected with factual and accurate info for that state. I didn't read it as a slam against any home baker .... but when people ask for accurate info ..... and they get it .... I can't see why anyone should be upset over the info that is being shared, based on whether they like the facts or reality or not.




I went back, and reread what was said. It looked quite informative without a personal opinion.

Mike

kimmypooh79 Posted 6 Nov 2008 , 11:55pm
post #176 of 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by kendi25


I think that if a CC member really did turn in someone in TN for baking from home, they ought to be ashamed of themselves. That was a very low thing to do to a fellow human.




A fellow baker was telling me about a decorator in the area that sold illegally from her home until she could get licensed. The lady got her license then turned everybody she knew in that wasn't licensed. Can you say two faced B!tCh?!?! I couldn't do that.....it's just wrong. I refuse to step on people to get ahead.

I think that both sides are making good points but
someone oh here mentioned that it's not fair for a non-licensed at home baker to sell down the street at a lower cost because they have no overhead.
Licensed or not I would think that at home bakers would have little overhead anyway compared to having an off site location. Depending on the set up of course. Everyone has to start somewhere though. I'm sure there are a lot of bakers taking advantage but there are some that literally have no other way than to do it illegally until they can save up.
Congratulations to those of you who were able to get a loan, save up the money, or just pay cash outright but some have no other option. I'm sorry if this offends anyone but there do seem to be a few people on here with a holier than thou attitude when it comes to being licensed. Remember people that Rome wasn't built in a day and neither is a cake business.

cakeandpartygirl Posted 7 Nov 2008 , 12:48am
post #177 of 223

This is awesome info!!!! I will store this info for when I move back to the states. Where I live it is illegal to have a food business and I can't even open a store out in town. I wish that I could be legal but in the mean time I am just a sitting duck until I move back to the states. Thanks for all the incredibly informative info. Smile

chutzpah Posted 7 Nov 2008 , 4:10am
post #178 of 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by kendi25

.......... We all break the law at some point. We all have..................... or a simple thing like running a red light





Running a red light is NOT a "simple thing". A good friend of mine was killed in a car accident by a woman who ran a red light...... the offender had already had five tickets for this same violation.

My friend was on her way to her own wedding when this happened, by the way.

Breaking the law, no matter how you slice it, is always wrong.

Mike1394 Posted 7 Nov 2008 , 9:26am
post #179 of 223

It has been mentioned that "Everyone has to start somewhere" Kimmy this is certainly not directed at you, it just got me thinking. That's all this is, just a thought for discussion. So no one get offended LOLOL.

Anyway back to the above statement. My question is why? The whole business premise in a captalistic society is to basically put your competition out of business. So nobody deserves a shot at a business. Heck, I want a boat, and an Escalade that doesn't mean I should have one. Just a thought.

Mike

CakeInfatuation Posted 7 Nov 2008 , 11:21am
post #180 of 223

EEEEEK! Kitagirl I really appreciate reading your posts. Looks like you live really close to me. I've been looking into getting licensed because I put so much time and effort into my cakes and so many people keep asking me for a card or if I sell them. It's exhausting just thinking about the whole process.

I found this online from the PA Dept. of Agriculture. http://www.agriculture.state.pa.us/foodsafety/lib/foodsafety/homeproc.pdf My biggest issue right now is the form I need from my township. My township won't give it to me without a $500 zoning variance. My husband won't agree to spending that kind of money until I have enough experience to prove I can make it.

Rock---Hard Place.

Sometimes it just makes me want to cry. Literally! I've looking into working in local bakeries. But they all do "traditional" cakes that are geared more toward speed, Nobody is hiring, and if they were, I wouldn't get paid enough to offset my daycare expenses for my boys while I did it. Not to mention I've got a job 5 days a week smack in the middle of late afternoon.

Timing is all off. But I love to do cakes. I can't afford to to pay for materials and put so much time into cakes for people without charging. I've never charged for a cake. But I really don't know what to do. I know what I should do. I know what I want to do. I also know what isn't possible right now.

It just STINKS! Kitagirl... can I come to your house and work with you? ha ha

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