Do You Offer A Sugar Free Option

Business By luelue1971 Updated 25 Jul 2008 , 10:59pm by aswartzw

luelue1971 Posted 24 Jul 2008 , 3:04pm
post #1 of 25

Do any of you offer diabetic cakes as an optional flavor?

Do you do sugar free cakes or frostings or both?

24 replies
MosMom Posted 24 Jul 2008 , 3:51pm
post #2 of 25

Yes and I also offer vegan and allergen modified cakes.

fluttercakes Posted 25 Jul 2008 , 1:32am
post #3 of 25

I offer gluten-free, egg-free, or vegan, but I really want to offer sugar-free but I just don't like baking with Splenda...ick! If someone has a good recipe for a cake without that nasty stuff in it that actually tastes like a normal cake, please send it my way (my mom would be my best customer!) icon_biggrin.gif!

Mike1394 Posted 25 Jul 2008 , 11:33am
post #4 of 25

No, I make artery clogging, insulin spiking pasteries. If they don't want that they can go somewhere else. hehehehe icon_biggrin.gif

Mike

fluttercakes Posted 25 Jul 2008 , 1:21pm
post #5 of 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike1394

No, I make artery clogging, insulin spiking pasteries. If they don't want that they can go somewhere else. hehehehe icon_biggrin.gif

Mike




Whoo hoo, Mike! It's funny, but I sell a heck of alot more of that stuff then the healthier alternatives, too! icon_lol.gif

tdybear1978 Posted 25 Jul 2008 , 1:39pm
post #6 of 25

for those of you who do sell the sugar free cakes, what kind of prices do you charge? I am possible going to start this in the next couple of months and I am just curious what people sell their 1/4 sheet and 1/2 sheet cakes at

costumeczar Posted 25 Jul 2008 , 1:41pm
post #7 of 25

I'm with fluttercakes...If someone has a truly sugar-free recipe that doesn't taste like bitter [email protected] after its been baked, pass it on! I do reduced sugar if someone requests it, but not totally sugar-free.

I test recipes on my kids, who don't have any reason to lie to be polite, and whenever they try anything that's got any kind of artificial flavoring or sweeteners they say "This doesn't taste good..."

aswartzw Posted 25 Jul 2008 , 1:42pm
post #8 of 25

Try Whey-low. You can use any scratch recipe and substitute equal parts whey-low for sugar.

It comes in granular sugar, brown sugar, and powdered sugar. On the pricey side adn you will probably need to order it, but definitely worth it!!!

My BF is a bodybuilder and can't eat sugar. I made him chocolate cupcakes, filled with PB, and topped with 7-minute frosting. Everyone was eating them and noone could tell a difference.

Also, whey-low is a all-natural, safe alternative to sugar.

fiddlesticks Posted 25 Jul 2008 , 1:43pm
post #9 of 25

I would also love a sugar free recipe . I need one for this tuesday and still have not found one ! Yikes !!! I would love any help.

Lady_Phoenix Posted 25 Jul 2008 , 1:45pm
post #10 of 25

I second the Whey-Low. My daughter and I are both diabetic so we have to eliminate carbs where we can. Just remember that sugar free does not mean low carb. Flour has a lot of carbohydrates, simple ones at that which will spike a diabetics blood sugar. I am working on a recipe using spelt flour which is much gentler on blood sugar levels.

angelcakes5 Posted 25 Jul 2008 , 1:46pm
post #11 of 25

I have been looking for a good sugar free recipes. My husband is a diabetic so he cannot eat any of my creations. Pilsbury had some sugar free cake I bought one to try and he loved it. I ended up frosting it with sugar free coolwhip, becasue I cant find a good sugar free frosting recipe. But now no one sells those Pilsbury reduced sugar cake mixes??? Unless they sell out of them?

aswartzw Posted 25 Jul 2008 , 1:47pm
post #12 of 25
malishka Posted 25 Jul 2008 , 1:54pm
post #13 of 25

I would love to have a sugar free recipe for both, the cake and the buttercream. My best friend is diabetic and I can never make a cake for her.
I use the buttercream recipe that uses crisco. Butter just melts here in Florida. So once i tried to substitute splenda for sugar and it tasted nasty!!!
as my kids have described it.
so, any one out there with the secret to a good sugar free tasting cake and buttercream?

malishka Posted 25 Jul 2008 , 2:04pm
post #14 of 25

aswartzw,
i just checked out the site and it's fantastic. It has a recipe section there for chocolate cake and buttercream. Even custards we can use for fillings.
whey cool! lol
thank you.

fluttercakes Posted 25 Jul 2008 , 2:30pm
post #15 of 25

Yeah, I heard about having to change the flour out as well because of the carbs...so how is the spelt flour working for ya, Phoenix?

I did try one of my trusted chocolate cake recipes substituting 2/3 cup Splenda plus 1/3 cup regular sugar for the cup of sugar in the recipe kinda like the Splenda for baking...and GROSS!!! Nasty, dry, tasteless cardboard! Blech!

I have looked into that Whey-Low, but I'm still on the fence since it's so expensive, and I don't get that many requests for sugar-free. I have been thinking about Stevia Powder...any one try that out? Hmmm...

aswartzw Posted 25 Jul 2008 , 2:48pm
post #16 of 25

thumbs_up.gif Glad I could help. People who usually have the ill aftereffects from Splenda and other sweeteners had none with Whey-Low so I knew it was a winner!


As for carbs, I wonder if substituting whole wheat flour would work? I know it can dry it out some and you won't get a pure white for white cakes but maybe with some tweaking it will work.

lillicakes Posted 25 Jul 2008 , 2:56pm
post #17 of 25

I am diabetic--pretty severely--and try to follow a VERY low carb diet at all times. Protein and fat (GO butter! and cream cheese!) are cool but not carbs.

As someone else said, flour is out of the picture if you are restricting carbs. I have done some things with nut flours, and coconut flour, and can sometimes substitute whey protein for a little bit of flour. There are some other high-fiber low-carb alternatives, such as carbalose flour which is used in "CarbQuik" bake mix. While not carb-free, these things are significantly less carby than regular flour.

I really want to do more experimenting, for myself and for the rest of the low-carb community (who low-carb to alleviate health conditions, lose weight, or just because they find it a healthier lifestyle).

Avoiding sugar is tricky, especially if you have issues with artificial sweeteners. Splenda is nice because of the bulk, but Splenda DOES have carbs because that bulk comes from maltodextrin, which is a corn-based carby product. However, it is tough to do away with sugar because of its chemical and structural properties, as well as bulk. THAT is the real challenge.

I am not put off by artificial sweeteners, but here is a tip: a lot of times you can improve flavor by using more than one artificial sweetener at a time (or including stevia, which is natural). The wonky taste of one gets cancelled by the other.

Again, it takes a lot of experimentation. And I think all of that experimentation takes some serious motivation! I would be getting along more quickly with the project, but those low-carb cakes DO have calories, so.....


Edited to reply to the poster above: Whole wheat flour is just as carby as white flour. Sorry (it IS a pity....)


Edited again (obviously, this is a subject near and dear to me!) because I looked at the Whey Low product someone recommended. Could this be the low-carb grail? Golly, no. It is not the panacea. I am completed unconvinced by the scientific claims.

This product is made of sugar --
sucrose (the same white sugar everyone knows),
fructose (fruit sugar...but refined fruit sugar, without the fiber, vitamins, or phyto chemicals...as a diabetic and devout low-carber, I VERY rarely get to eat any kind of fruit because fructose, even unrefined fructose, spikes blood sugars),
lactose (refined milk sugar...and again, with my health profile and lifestyle, I cannot consume milk).

This is not to say the product doesn't taste good and work well--it SHOULD, because it IS sugar.

But through some kind of weird twist on the "net carbs" idea (which many low-carbers follow, but doesn't really work for diabetics) in which grams of fiber is deducted from the total number of carbs to give a lower "net carb" number, this manufacturer deducts the carbs from sugars that are lower in glycemic index (which is irrelevant for many, if not all, diabetics). This is the kind of marketing that really makes me angry icon_mad.gif

Anytway, that is all probably more than anyone wanted to know, but if you are using Whey Low and marketing the products as being low carb or sugar free, it simply is not true. The product MAY be lower glycemic index, which will matter to some people but not to hard-core low carbers or to diabetics who follow a low-carb diet (or concern themselves with how their blood sugar responds to food--there ARE different ideologies among diabetics, and some just eat whatever they want and inject large amounts of insulin to try to deal with the sugar).

Lady_Phoenix Posted 25 Jul 2008 , 4:50pm
post #18 of 25

So far the spelt flour tries are not quite where I want them. Cakes tend to be drier...the gluten in spelt is very fragile so it doesn't rise well. I won't give up! lol

I tried Stevia and did not care for it. Likewise Splenda for baking is horrid.

lillicakes Posted 25 Jul 2008 , 5:11pm
post #19 of 25

Lady_Phoenix, are you actually watching carbs or more concerned with glycemic index? I understand you are dealing with diabetes but not all diabetics are the same.

For me, low GI foods (like Dreamfields pasta) still spike me. I monitor a zillion times a day and am insulin dependent, so I low carb to keep the amounts of insulin I need to inject manageable.

Anyway, I ask because spelt really has only 10 or 15 % less carbs than white wheat flour, but it does have more fiber and is lower GI (for the people with bodies to whom that matters) and has less gluten, but still has some. Nut flours are much lower carb/higher fiber. Of course, some people have nut allergies, so there you go. And anytime you reduce the gluten, I find you need to pump up the egg content and/or the baking powder.

I use the Nunaturals stevia which is non-bitter. I also use Splenda, the granulated form and the liquid, occasionally saccharin (I know--horrors) products like Sweet N Low, and very occasionally Nutrasweet products (ala Equal), but only for non-heated items. Finallky, erythritol might be a good choice for baking. It is the least obnoxious of the sugar alcohols in terms of gastrointestinal impact and blood sugar impact.

tdybear1978 Posted 25 Jul 2008 , 6:25pm
post #20 of 25

what do you guys charge for your sugar free cakes?

aswartzw Posted 25 Jul 2008 , 8:41pm
post #21 of 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by lillicakes


This product is made of sugar --
sucrose (the same white sugar everyone knows),
fructose (fruit sugar...but refined fruit sugar, without the fiber, vitamins, or phyto chemicals...as a diabetic and devout low-carber, I VERY rarely get to eat any kind of fruit because fructose, even unrefined fructose, spikes blood sugars),
lactose (refined milk sugar...and again, with my health profile and lifestyle, I cannot consume milk).




Please note that Whey Low is made of sugar (the point of being all natural). HOWEVER, the point is due to chemical reactivity the sugars are altered b/c they are together. THEREFORE, they are no longer processed by your body the same way.

Just because it has sugar in it doesn't mean your body will process it like sugar. Sugars behave differently than milk or flour. It's called science for a reason and I guess (being a chemist) I can fully understand the claims.

Splenda has sugar in it. Why is it allowed to be a diabetic food? Because it's been chlorinated and the sugar is now digested differently.

aswartzw Posted 25 Jul 2008 , 9:40pm
post #22 of 25

lillicakes....

Whey low does offer a free sample. It is the size of a sugar packet for tea or coffee. Would it be possible to just try a small sample? I would think it wouldn't spike your blood sugar more than Splenda would, but I honestly have no idea. It would be nice, though, if it doesn't and then you wouldn't have to worry about something being chemically altered (unnaturally like Splenda).

Please know I fully respect your decision (if you don't) and greatly admire your healthy eating approach compared to counteracting sugar spikes with insulin. If only more people would do it..... thumbs_up.gif

lillicakes Posted 25 Jul 2008 , 9:50pm
post #23 of 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by aswartzw

Quote:
Originally Posted by lillicakes


This product is made of sugar --
sucrose (the same white sugar everyone knows),
fructose (fruit sugar...but refined fruit sugar, without the fiber, vitamins, or phyto chemicals...as a diabetic and devout low-carber, I VERY rarely get to eat any kind of fruit because fructose, even unrefined fructose, spikes blood sugars),
lactose (refined milk sugar...and again, with my health profile and lifestyle, I cannot consume milk).



Please note that Whey Low is made OF sugar (the point of being all natural). HOWEVER, the point is due to chemical reactivity the sugars are altered b/c they are together. THEREFORE, they are no longer processed by your body the same way.

Just because it has sugar in it doesn't mean your body will process it like sugar. Sugars behave differently than milk or flour. It's called science for a reason and I guess (being a chemist) I can fully understand the claims.

Splenda has sugar in it. Why is it allowed to be a diabetic food? Because it's been chlorinated and the sugar is now digested differently.




Ah, a kindred spirit. My bachelors degree is also in chemistry icon_wink.gif

Splenda does not have sugar in it. Sugar may be used as a raw ingredient, but the final product is not a molecule that is recognizable as sugar. Splenda claims "tastes like sugar, because it is made from sugar." Whether one agrees with the first part of the claim or not, the second is true. Splenda is not chemically sugar. The same way that hydrogen peroxide (H2O2) is NOT water (H2O), though the two are chemically close in molecular structure. Their chemical properties are markedly different, a fact that would become evident if one tried to drink (or bathe, for that matter) in hydrogen peroxide.

THAT is a completely different situation from the whey low product. What is IN that product is sugar (sucrose, common table sugar), fructose (fruit sugar), and lactose (milk sugar). The chemical structure is not altered. You could test the product by GC and find those three compounds.

On its web site, from what I find, Whey Low does not even claim to use altered forms of the sugars (not like Splenda, which, as discussed above, is not claimed to BE sugar). In the clnical testing area, the patent number is referenced and it is stated that it has conducted 80 oral tolerance tests on 9 subjects (i.e. 9 people), some of whom were "typical" type 2 diabetics (being a type 2, I would argue that there is a wide range of what may be considered "typical).

If you look up the patent, you find various claims and details of the method of manufacture (that is included in all patent applications, and disclosure of those "secrets" is the price one pays for getting exclusive protection that a patent offers). The claims are that the fructose helps to impede the absorption of lactose in the small intestine (where most nutrients are absorbed) and that lactose impedes the absorption of fructose. The idea is that the undigested sugars then speed along through your small intestine to the large intestine, where they are not absorbed by your body but instead nourish what the Whey Low folks describe as "healthy" bacteria.

Those theories may work with some people or some of the time. It would depend upon the rate of gastric emptying and the capacity for absorption a person has, as well as transient factors (what the food was consumed with, how much liquid was consumed, etc.) However, many diabetics (some experts argue that any diabetic with any variety of neuropathy) have slowed, or unreliably slowed digestion called gastroparesis. Retarding absorption of sugar (by mixture with fat, or as this product claims, by mixtures of several forms of sugars) does not reliably help a diabetic reduce blood sugar spikes. And even in cases in which the spike is blunted, the area under the blood sugar response curve (which would indicate how much the blood sugar is elevated over fasting levels versus a period of time, which may be as long as 6, 8, or more hours) is likely to be essentially the same.

So again, I am sure, more than anyone wanted to hear.

But my second degree is in law, and I am wary of advertising and claims that can be easily misinterpreted. Worse, this is something that could actually be dangerous for people. If someone who doesn't know any better makes a low-carb cake to provide to someone with health conditions adversely impacted by the ingestion of sugar, and that person responds (as predictably, they would to being fed sugar), it will be sad indeed.

Consider making a birthday cake that should be "safe" for a Type 1 diabetic child. Type 1's have no insulin production--if they get an increase in blood glucose, they MUST inject insulin to lower it or will remain at elevated levels. If a parent, or the child (many T1 kids are in charge of measuring and maintaining their own blood sugars) anticipates less glycemic response and with a false sense of security, does not check, things can get dangerous. As a cake "manufacturer," when you provide a cake to a customer you do so with implied and express warranties. If you say a cake is low-carb, you are warranting that it is. And low-carb is NOT the same thing as low-glycemic. Be careful, all of you cakers, because I am saying this to help you avoid any problems down the road! Don't let good intentions turn into a nightmare situation.

And with that I will get off my soap box icon_smile.gif

lillicakes Posted 25 Jul 2008 , 10:02pm
post #24 of 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by aswartzw

lillicakes....

Whey low does offer a free sample. It is the size of a sugar packet for tea or coffee. Would it be possible to just try a small sample? I would think it wouldn't spike your blood sugar more than Splenda would, but I honestly have no idea. It would be nice, though, if it doesn't and then you wouldn't have to worry about something being chemically altered (unnaturally like Splenda).

Please know I fully respect your decision (if you don't) and greatly admire your healthy eating approach compared to counteracting sugar spikes with insulin. If only more people would do it..... thumbs_up.gif




I just saw your second post. I hope what I said makes some sense, and I think it should. I appreciate your input and point of view.

Maybe I will eventually try the product and measure the response, though it is a little bit like playing Russian Roulette for me. That and I am very stingy with my carb budget and try to REALLY enjoy what carbalicious things to indulge in.

The point is, diabetics are different and have very different responses to even legitimate "diabetic" foods. Many diabetics (like me) cannot tolerate Glucerna products, for example, which are made FOR diabetics. Many have undue trouble with Splenda (I don't; I respond to the maltodextrin carrier, but don't respond adversely to Splenda that is in water or another non-carb carrier). Many can eat Dreamfields pasta--I wish I was one of them, because I sure miss noodles. Many can eat sugar-free candies like Russel Stovers chocolates...others, like me, have great gastric distress and a blood sugar response that is approximately 2/3 of what it would be if I just ate sugared candy. Diabetics all respond differently to even low glycemic products that are NOT composed of sugar.

So what I am saying is to all of you fellow cakers, be very careful with what your expectations are and how you present these "special dietary need" products. Cake is not the healthiest thing to consume, anyway, but I am sure no one wants a customer to get into problems from eating it. There are real scientific and legal issues here, so just "head's up."

aswartzw Posted 25 Jul 2008 , 10:59pm
post #25 of 25

Lillicakes,

Hey fellow chemist! I successfully completed my master's from the great school of my avatar just 1 1/2 years ago!! Still recent enough I still celebrate. icon_lol.gif

Did you see these clinical studies? I know they are the company's own data but until proven wrong, we can't really make a statement that it's not good. In addition, there is a testimonial on the site of a woman who claims to have done a blood sugar test. While I'm not an expert on blood sugar, the results do look interesting.

http://www.wheylow.com/Articles.asp?ID=136

In addition, here is more info on who invented Whey-Low, why, and other stuff...

http://www.azstarnet.com/allheadlines/184211

I will never use Splenda as sucralose is an organochloride and those can be very bad for people, even in small doses.

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